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Old 12-13-2013, 05:48 PM
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283 and Edelbrock 1404 Advise ? CONFUSED!

I have a 4 door impala with a 283 the mods are
MSD HEI Distributor & MSD Wires
Edelbrock 2101 Manifold
Edelbrock open air cleaner
Edelbrock 1404 Carb

Im having trouble on where to start the tune. Starts fine and Idles great "about 2 turns out". Power seams good for the most part if not floored. Im running it the way it came out the box as far as jets and metering rods and springs. I just got my Calibration kit today for this carb.

What the car does is at "WOT" it bogs and sputters bad and takes a min to catch up before it starts to pull. This being said it doesn't pull near as hard as when just getting on the gas slowly but strong. I have checked float and is correct. I have tried the accelerator pump in all 3 holes and get the same. What controllers the "WOT" gas?

If anyone have this some what same setup please give me your carb setup as in metering rods / springs / jets and so on

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Old 12-13-2013, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrashDFWFO View Post
I have a 4 door impala with a 283 the mods are
MSD HEI Distributor & MSD Wires
Edelbrock 2101 Manifold
Edelbrock open air cleaner
Edelbrock 1404 Carb

Im having trouble on where to start the tune. Starts fine and Idles great "about 2 turns out". Power seams good for the most part if not floored. Im running it the way it came out the box as far as jets and metering rods and springs. I just got my Calibration kit today for this carb.

What the car does is at "WOT" it bogs and sputters bad and takes a min to catch up before it starts to pull. This being said it doesn't pull near as hard as when just getting on the gas slowly but strong. I have checked float and is correct. I have tried the accelerator pump in all 3 holes and get the same. What controllers the "WOT" gas?

If anyone have this some what same setup please give me your carb setup as in metering rods / springs / jets and so on
That carb is going to want no more than 4 3/4 psi. Start there.
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Old 12-13-2013, 07:19 PM
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You need a vacuum gauge to set it up, do you have the manual for the Carb? But before working on the the Carb. Get the timing right first. Just work with the the metering rods & different colored springs first. An put the pump rod into the middle hole for now. You most likely have lots of vacuum, try using the next stiffer spring than what's in it now

Last edited by dogwater; 12-13-2013 at 07:46 PM.
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Old 12-13-2013, 07:46 PM
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I agree with techinspector.
Keep fuel pressure below 5 psi for Edelbrock carbs.
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Old 12-13-2013, 07:59 PM
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If it bogs during the transition from cruise to power, you can usually cure it by swapping to higher rated step-up springs. Stock springs are probably rated at 5" of vacuum, and your tune kit should have springs up to 8" of vacuum.

Swapping to a higher rated spring will speed up the transition from cruise to power. For example, using an 8" spring it will transition to power mode as the vacuum hits 8" instead of waiting until it drops farther to 5".

Once you get the springs right you can then start trying different rods. Your carburetor should have come with a chart that shows the stock rods and the various combinations you can try with your tuning kit.

Bruce
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Old 12-13-2013, 08:21 PM
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Ya I just put in the 8"hg spring and it felt as if it had more power off idle but I don't think it plays a part at that low does it? Could this be a issue of the main jet to big or small?
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Old 12-13-2013, 08:34 PM
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Did you try adjusting the rod, not just the hole. A stock 283 should want a stock carb tune. Is your ignition tuned correctly?
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Old 12-13-2013, 09:32 PM
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I just took out the 86 main that it came with and put an 83 in and it stumbles even worse so Im thinking of putting an 89 in does that sound to much or should I go 92 or 98 for a main?
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Old 12-13-2013, 09:44 PM
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why are you changing the jets?
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Old 12-13-2013, 10:04 PM
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yes sorry I wasn't to clear
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Old 12-14-2013, 05:21 AM
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Springs primarily affect the point it transitions from cruise to power. Swapping springs should not affect overall low speed performance unless you have a problem with unusually low vacuum. On a high performance engine with very low vacuum the vacuum may be so low that it lets the springs push the rods up into power mode just off idle.

The rod has two steps (diameters) in it, cruise and power, and the rod sticks down into the jet to partially close off the opening in the jet. The spring tries to push the rod up, but at idle the vacuum pulls the rod down into the jet, blocks the jet off partially, and makes the mixture leaner. Once vacuum drops too low to hold the rod down, it pushes up and lets the mixture go richer.

Rod sizes are listed like .057 in. x .049, which is a fair small/rich rod. Going to a larger rod (e.g., .72 x .65) will fill more of the jet opening and make the carb much leaner. However, you can also swap jets at the same time, so its a combination of jets and rods, not just one or the other. You can usually get it fairly close by only swapping rods, and that is easy to do without any dis-assembly. Jets take more work to swap.

Bruce
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Old 12-14-2013, 06:09 AM
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That IB that came with the carb - it does take a couple times through it to really understand what some of what they are saying. And that 4-5 psi pump pressure is beyond important (as in necessary) for it to run right. Next, timing!! Chebbies are with stock ignitions advanced via manifold vacuum, MSDs 'usually' ported vacuum. Eddy's have 3-4 small vacuum ports along with a couple big ones (which are manifold vac). Make sure you are using a correct port for your distributor. Also, with that distributor, limit the advance - these are 'usually' supplied with springs for 4 different settings. You don't say if you have a performance camshaft, so the distributor as purchased may have too much low end advance for the engine. Then that vacuum gauge ..... use it along with a timing light

MSD Ignition Instruction Download

Edelbrock.com - Tech Center - Installation Instructions
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Old 12-14-2013, 08:57 AM
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I have the internal timing at 12 deg. Full manifold vac advanced with a silver 25 deg stop bushing. One light silver spring and one light blue spring opening at about 1300-3200 RPM. If this was a fuel psi issue would it bog at all RPMs or just high RPMs when fuel pressure is more? It funny bc it runs strong from idle till the secondary kicks in. Almost like it losses have its power and slowly starts to pick back up. Im almost to the point of spending $200 or more on an A/F gauge.
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Old 12-14-2013, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrashDFWFO View Post
I have the internal timing at 12 deg. Full manifold vac advanced with a silver 25 deg stop bushing. One light silver spring and one light blue spring opening at about 1300-3200 RPM. If this was a fuel psi issue would it bog at all RPMs or just high RPMs when fuel pressure is more? It funny bc it runs strong from idle till the secondary kicks in. Almost like it losses have its power and slowly starts to pick back up. Im almost to the point of spending $200 or more on an A/F gauge.
Well - first of all, you need to hook the dist. to a ported source - this is from the MSD 8365 HEI IB: "Vacuum Advance: The vacuum advance will advance the timing up to 10 during partial throttle driving (with 15 lbs of vacuum). The vacuum line should be routed to a ported vacuum outlet above the throttle plates.


Once you do that then we can again revisit the carb. Fuel pressure being high wont necessarily cause bogs but flooding at any rpm.

Also that 'E' setting advance - probably too fast without a 'bigger' camshaft. I would probably do the 'B' setting on a basically stock internal engine (assuming that's what you have - you haven't said anything different). I am running the 'E' curve, but have a fairly 'big' tho not radical camshaft

Edelbrock carbs are easy but you just can't throw parts at them without knowing what effect each point will make - and each point can be anywhere from minor to radical. You also have to have a correct float setting - and right out of the box is not always right. Then - dirt. These carbs do NOT like any dirt at all and a good filter is always necessary.

This is some of what I did to get my carb right:


A fuel pressure regulator w/gauge



One of two fuel filters (really only need one good one, but this one just looks good, the other really does most of the cleaning)
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Old 12-15-2013, 06:26 PM
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Ok Ive been playing around and trying different things.
I added my 6al box to the hei with the diode.
As for the tune I started with calibration #11 I got backfires and sputter.
Went with the calibration #17 I got less backfire and less sputter.
I have now gone to Calibration #18 and no backfire and pulls better.
Im wondering if I can get more out of it. Wonder if I should go with a different number.

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