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Old 04-14-2011, 10:28 AM
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2k Eurethane primer over bare metal

It is essential to shoot Epoxy primer over bare metal? Can Eurethane be shot over bare metal? I seem to be getting mixed answers and wanted to know what you guys think? At first I was planning on just shooting some good quality Eurethane over some well prepped metal but mow Im considering Epoxy or etching

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Old 04-14-2011, 10:38 AM
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Don't go the etching route, use a quality true epoxy that is the way to go then top it with your 2K. Most of us on this site prefer SPI epoxy.

Vince
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Old 04-14-2011, 10:48 AM
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Despite what you will hear about todays thinking... unless you are leaving it in primer for a length of time, the 2K primers work very well. ...at least for me.

I came up using lacquer, enamel, and synthetic enamel primers. The urethanes were a godsend! I sand thoroughly with rough grits... wire bush the pits and such... metal prep, and prime 30 minutes later. Alway use three coats minimum. More if you need to block out problems. If you expose bare metal, just wipe with prep 30 minutes before painting again. I think a big part of the confusion is that painters think that if they don't see rust, it must be okay. You need to understand that it starts on a microscopic level. Treat it before paint, and you have no worries.

I use R-M 801 metal prep, which has an alcohol in it, so you just spray it with a squeeze bottle... let it stand for a minute or two, and wipe with paper towels. It will be safe for about an hour... but you can paint within 30 minutes

I have done hundreds of jobs... wetsanding the primer on each one... and even leaving them out side in the rain on occasion. NO RUSTING EVER... EVER! My jobs typically will last 20-30 years or more, with no bubbling from any rust problems.

I am not saying that epoxy doesn't have it's place, but today's younger guys are heavily influenced by what they hear, and start to make it a part of their system, spending more money and time on each job. When they have no troubles they somehow think they would have otherwise. In all fairness, I now live in Arizona, not a wet climate.... thoug I painted in the midwest for 10 years using the lacquer primers. Same story though. I used metal prep.

Just remember they have been painting cars for well over 100 years without epoxy primer. Are they all bubbling up with rust? Just my opinion.

Last edited by TucsonJay; 04-14-2011 at 10:55 AM.
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Old 04-14-2011, 10:49 AM
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Damn! I just got my SPI Eurethane and Clear delivered yesterday and was planning on shooting the primer this weekend..
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Old 04-14-2011, 10:50 AM
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Any alternative to SPI

Quote:
Originally Posted by 67Elcamino
Damn! I just got my SPI Eurethane and Clear delivered yesterday and was planning on shooting the primer this weekend..
Is there anything else anyone can recommend that I can pick up at a local store such as PPG, Dupont, etc.. that is comparable as far as quality and price?
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Old 04-14-2011, 03:16 PM
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epoxy prime, and never have to worry about it. 1/2 gallon of the spi epoxy is 60 bucks.......spray a coat and wait per tech sheet instructions, then proceed with your 2k urethane primer.

btw, this topic has been beaten to death and prolly one of the most dumped topics here.....do a search and youll come up with a lot of info and a lot of arguing and bickering......its up to you which route you choose. i use epoxy on bare metal after freshly blasting.
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Old 04-14-2011, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TucsonJay

My jobs typically will last 20-30 years or more, with no bubbling from any rust problems.
20-30 years and none of them have EVER rusted! You got PROOF. I'm sure you know where EVERY car you've done is and the condition it's in now.
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Old 04-14-2011, 06:04 PM
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Hahaha.. thanks for the input guys. I guess its better to be safe than sorry I think Im gonna but me a couple of quarts and shoot in on the bare metal. I also heard not to clean fiberglass filler with Wax an Grease remover? If so the how do I clean before shooting the epoxy . The car willbe stripped to mental with a few filler spots.. so I cant imagine trying to clean the bare metal without getting someof the filler


Maybe Dog years??
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Old 04-14-2011, 06:04 PM
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I would think it would also depend on the quality of the said 2K primer
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Old 04-14-2011, 06:26 PM
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yes you can clean fiberglass with wax and grease remover, you just need to extend your dry time after use to make sure all solvents are out of the glass and/or filler.

There are some "said" 2k primers out there that are designed for a direct to metal application over larger areas of metal (or entire car). they are a hrybrid of urethane primer and epoxy primer, BUT it just isn't a true epoxy primer, which imo is the only primer (epoxy) you should be putting over your metal in a restoration job. just my opinion....
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Old 04-14-2011, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Underground
20-30 years and none of them have EVER rusted! You got PROOF. I'm sure you know where EVERY car you've done is and the condition it's in now.
Well, I've been painting for 47 years... 36 of them in Tucson, and am very active in the car community. Never heard of one gone bad yet. About 50% of my customers will keep coming back, and they're still coming. I'm sure they would tell me... because I guarantee the workmanship as long as you own it.

BTW, If something fails one time, I change my system. "Rep" is what keeps people in business.

...but I probably don't know what I'm talking about.
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Old 04-15-2011, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TucsonJay
Well, I've been painting for 47 years... 36 of them in Tucson, and am very active in the car community. Never heard of one gone bad yet. About 50% of my customers will keep coming back, and they're still coming. I'm sure they would tell me... because I guarantee the workmanship as long as you own it.

BTW, If something fails one time, I change my system. "Rep" is what keeps people in business.

...but I probably don't know what I'm talking about.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Wow, great information but you should not be posting this!!!

Just think if you sold this info to one of the OEMS where they could advertise a 30 year lasting paint job, the edge they would have! This could be worth millions to you.

Not sure if you know this but Dupont and BASF have full time R&D departments just for OEMS, you could sell this info to one of them and again we are talking millions of dollars they would be thrilled to pay you just to have this kind of edge.

I remember a few years ago, someone posted they had a tractor painted 25 years ago with a $15 a gallon of syn-enamel and it still looked like the day it was painted, do you have any idea what an OEM would pay you for that kind of money saving info?
I bet that guy has his own island now.

Its great what a person can learn on here, thanks!
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Old 04-15-2011, 06:09 AM
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use Epoxy any brand you like and you will be good to go.

i as well as other Use SPI,but if you need to run out and grab some, get whatever brand is closest and easier for you if in a hurry.


once again some bad advice being thrown around for Newbies to read!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 04-15-2011, 06:36 AM
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Basicly,If I strip the whole car I'll epoxy it...If its a repair it just gets 2k...
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Old 04-15-2011, 09:17 AM
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good point DBM

generally if i repair i just shoot 2k,but there is not a lot of bare metal showing anyway.

if there is a lot of exposed bare metal,Epoxy.
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