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Old 05-13-2012, 06:37 PM
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301 out 350 in

im pulling out my 301 pontiac.. im going to put in a chev 350. looking for any advice.. im going to have 2 days to do this. so i want to make sure i get everything ahead of time. im keeping the original trans for now. my car is a 1978 pontiac grand prix sj.

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Old 05-13-2012, 06:52 PM
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The trans is a Buick-olds-pontiac bolt pattern and only 2 boltholes will line up to a SBC. Not to mention the motor mounts,and exhaust wont fit either.
If it were me, I would put a 350 pontiac in it.There are some out there and not overpriced. I scrapped a perfectly good 350 a few months ago because I did not have any use for it.
Or if you can round one up a 400 or 455.That car would fly. It will bolt in too. Reuse your trans and all.
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Old 05-13-2012, 08:25 PM
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I can add a little support to LATECH's recommendation. My son and a friend of his were racing a '68 Firebird with a roller 455 and decided to go a different route. (blown dragster) I bought the engine and they put a stock 400 in it and sold the car. The Chevy guy that bought it brought it to the track a few times, but he drove it like a Chevy. Well, those stock cast rods won't take 7200 rpm shifts. After he blew it, he found a "BUILT" 400 chevy and put that in. It ran a full 2 seconds slower than the Pontiac did. He only came back to the track a couple of times. There is also a racer at our track that has a '69 bird with a 454 BBC that I occasionally give a bad time about having used "chebby" power. He parks in the row directly behind me and has come up to make sure that I had a real Pontiac in my car. I think he has gotten his car in the 11s now. (started in 14s) He has a ways to go to get into the 8.90s where I am with my smaller engine.

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Old 05-13-2012, 09:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandon301
im pulling out my 301 pontiac.. im going to put in a chev 350. looking for any advice.. im going to have 2 days to do this. so i want to make sure i get everything ahead of time. im keeping the original trans for now. my car is a 1978 pontiac grand prix sj.
Only because you are in a bind and are replacing a 301 Pontiac do I support your project- not that you need my or anyone else's support, per se.

Use an adapter like this to mate your Pontiac tranny to the SBC engine.

Use motor mounts for a Monte Carlo/SBC, the rubber motor mounts attach to holes that are already in the crossmember of your car. Hopefully you will have or can get the metal engine brackets that mount to the engine, that the rubber mounts connect to.

The starters are on opposite sides, there may be other plumbing and electrical wiring splices, etc. that need to be made but they're all minor, relatively speaking. You may need a water neck that points differently than the one on the SBC, depending.

After you get your feet under you, look for a Pontiac 400 or 455 to go in it.
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Old 05-13-2012, 11:34 PM
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thanks

i thank everyone for the advice. its my only car and i only have a weekend to swap it out. i just didn't want to many surprises. ive taken all emission's crap off, ac is off, went to electric fan.... what about the fly wheel?? starter?? torque converter? starter going to have to use a Chevy one right? if you guys are like me ya all probably think about all this constantly... thanks again guys..
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Old 05-14-2012, 12:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandon301
i thank everyone for the advice. its my only car and i only have a weekend to swap it out. i just didn't want to many surprises. ive taken all emission's crap off, ac is off, went to electric fan.... what about the fly wheel?? starter?? torque converter? starter going to have to use a Chevy one right? if you guys are like me ya all probably think about all this constantly... thanks again guys..
The simplest swap would be to put another Pontiac in there. The starter for a chevy is on the other side, so wiring would have to be changed. A chevy won't bolt to your transmision and uses the wrong fywheel, plus You would have to weld in different frame mounts for the engine. You will save yourself a lot of headache by just getting another Pontiac.

Bill

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Old 05-14-2012, 02:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandon301
i thank everyone for the advice. its my only car and i only have a weekend to swap it out. i just didn't want to many surprises. ive taken all emission's crap off, ac is off, went to electric fan.... what about the fly wheel?? starter?? torque converter? starter going to have to use a Chevy one right? if you guys are like me ya all probably think about all this constantly... thanks again guys..
I do agree 100% that a Pontiac engine to replace the Pontiac engine you have would be the easiest swap. But finding a good running Pontiac 350/400/455 or even another 301 is not as easy as a SBC. Desperate times/desperate measures and all that. Do what you need to do, worry about the rest when time permits.

Do you have the engine yet? Do you know what year it is, or if it's a 1-piece or 2-piece rear main seal engine? Some help ID'ing the engine if you are unsure is here.

The same torque converter will work but you need a SBC flexplate to match the engine you are swapping in. There are different SBC flexplates depending if the engine has a 1-piece or 2-piece rear main seal, or if it's an externally balanced 400 SBC.

If it's a 2-piece rear main seal (~'85-and older) SBC, the flexplate is a neutral balanced type, and is a very common piece. If it's a 2-piece rear main seal engine the flexplate uses a smaller bolt circle and the flexplate has a weight attached. The good thing is the bolt patterns are different so you can't use the wrong flexplate- but a 400 SBC externally balanced flexplate will fit on a 350 or smaller SBC that's internally balanced and uses the neutral balanced flexplate- but doing so will create a severe imbalance condition that can damage the engine and cause it to vibrate so bad that you'll think you have square tires.

So if possible get the flexplate and starter that was on the engine originally- the Pontiac starter and flexplate is useless for using on a SBC engine. You could use the Pontiac starter if you swap out the nose, but the easiest thing is to use or buy a starter set up for the SBC engine you are going to use to begin with.

The starter nose will be different depending on which of the two different diameter flexplates that are used on the SBC engines. One is a large 14" diameter version (168 tooth ring gear); it uses the starter nose w/offset bolt holes. The smaller 12-3/4" diameter flexplate (153 tooth ring gear) uses a starter nose that has the bolt holes straight across from each other. More on that here.

The wireing to the starter and alternator will be the same except the starters are on opposite sides as I mentioned before. Lengthen or reroute the wires to the solenoid as needed (soldering and shrink wrap is much better than wire nuts or twisting the bare wires together and taping w/electrical tape- a few minutes spent doing it right will save you from possibly being stranded when you need it most.

For the large positive battery cable that attaches to the starter, the Pontiac cable won't be long enough unless the battery is on the passenger side. If needed, buy a longer cable.

Do not forget to use the ground wires and straps to ground the engine to the car.
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Old 05-14-2012, 07:48 PM
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Others have mentioned Pontiac and I would also consider a 350 - 455 Poncho. Very easy swap and with mild modifications it will run very well.
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Old 05-14-2012, 10:14 PM
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thanks man

i think that you have thought of everything..lol.. going out to get the engine tomarrow. not sure about all the numbers yet. you might know this.. will 327 heads fit on the 350? i heard they would, but sounds like ya know what ur talking about.. thanks everyone. Brandon
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