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Old 06-11-2007, 12:27 AM
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350 or 383

Okay.......before anyone yells at me over this question...I have looked at COUNTLESS forums.....and still not sure what to do. I have a 77 stingray that runs quite well except for a clutch i need to replace and air I need to fix (its a 4spd)...Anyhow, my dad is an old chevy man and told he could easily hop it up into a 383. However, this guy at work told me to set my original motor (with only 80k original miles, never rebuilt) to the side and drop a generation 2 350 in it........so i read more........yada yada yada....and now i am totally confused as to what to do....help!!!.....I will be graduating college soon and will have at least 2-4k to drop on something when that great event happens in less than a year.....which is the better way to go here? 350 rebuilt with some goodies.....383 stroker...or a generation 2 (which i know little about)?

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Old 06-11-2007, 05:37 AM
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Do you look at your car as an investment piece or play toy?

Are you happy with the way it runs now or are you looking for more performance? 80K isn't extreme by any means, especially if the car was taken care of.

With a 2k to 4k budget, you could build up a nice little small block. 383 conversions have been popular for years, they make nice little street/strip motors. I would probably keep and rebuild the 350 and warm it up with a nice mild cam, reworked q-jet, and a good exhaust.
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Old 06-11-2007, 08:13 AM
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By Generation II I think we're talking about an LT series motor, no? LT motors are pretty nice, but I'm not sure there's enough benefit to them to worry about trying to get one working in your stingray. The bolt up would be direct, but I think the big draw to using the LT motor is the fuel injection (which without expensive upgrades is pretty limited).

I think a 383 or a 400 would be your best bang for the buck. For less money, less work and effort you could blow the LT-1 out of the water. Your biggest investment is going to be some aftermarket heads. You will likely spend between 700-1200 dollars on a set of heads that will push out anywhere from 400-500 horse with around 400 cubes. No problem. Considering a 383 ground up rebuild on your existing core, heads, cam, decent intake, and some exhaust work I would eyeball you in the 3000-4000 dollar range. With this setup (assuming some decent gears in the back) I don't see any reason you couldn't be in the 12's.

K
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Old 06-11-2007, 10:50 AM
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First off, I would like to say this is my car to 'get around' but in the same since I want some power for when I need it(extreme power that will outrun my friends' mustang and acura, etc). I wont be the person who races my car every night and blows it up in less than a year...however, I want the CAPABILITY to totally go.
Secondly, Yes, by generation 2 i was talking about the Lt. The guy at work told me that was the better way to go but my dad seems to like the 383 stroker. I have read that the mounts are the same, etc....but yeah, i'm not sure about the fuel injection and all... I'm not sure what gears are in the back....whatever is stock for a 1977 4spd.....the car doesn't have enough power to really spin the tires in first, but its top end is decent around 145mph.
Also, this guy at work told me to set the original motor in it now to the side(all numbers match) regardless because it would hurt my resale value of the car if I messed with it....is there much truth in that?
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Old 06-11-2007, 11:07 AM
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If you're interested in having the option to go back to factory original then its definitely going to be more trouble to do the LT swap (considering all the provisions you'll need to use for the EFI). You could very easily get another 350 block from a junk yard if you're worried about using the factory block for any reason. You can certainly use your factory 350 block for the 383 and go back to the 350 setup later in the car's life! If it were mine and I had a few extra dollars I'd do this: Get yourself a 350 out of a junk yard that is a post 1987 block with the 1-piece rear main seal. These blocks also have the taller lifter bosses to accept roller lifters if you want to go that route (although I think a flat tappet cam will work just fine for your motor).

You can build a 383 that will have a slight lope, run great round town, have good vacuum, run great track times and live a good long life. One word of advice though is if you are looking long-term for a motor make sure you spend a little extra money where it counts. It all starts with top-notch machine work.

Good luck!

K
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Old 06-11-2007, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killerformula
If you're interested in having the option to go back to factory original then its definitely going to be more trouble to do the LT swap (considering all the provisions you'll need to use for the EFI). You could very easily get another 350 block from a junk yard if you're worried about using the factory block for any reason. You can certainly use your factory 350 block for the 383 and go back to the 350 setup later in the car's life! If it were mine and I had a few extra dollars I'd do this: Get yourself a 350 out of a junk yard that is a post 1987 block with the 1-piece rear main seal. These blocks also have the taller lifter bosses to accept roller lifters if you want to go that route (although I think a flat tappet cam will work just fine for your motor).

You can build a 383 that will have a slight lope, run great round town, have good vacuum, run great track times and live a good long life. One word of advice though is if you are looking long-term for a motor make sure you spend a little extra money where it counts. It all starts with top-notch machine work.

Good luck!

K
Ditto that 100% and I'll just add that GMPP has some sweet hydraulic roller cams in their crate engines that would be great for what you want, the ZZ4 cam would be a nice start for a "daily driver" 383. In a 9.5 to 1 383 with Vortec heads it is capable of 375 HP and 435 LbFt of TQ at the flywheel on 87 Octane. You can get a new, never run crate motor takeout ZZ4 cam off eBay for $84.95 plus about $15 shipping. I've bought a '395 Marine cam from the guy before and had no problems, I'm thinking real hard of switching to the ZZ4 though.
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Old 06-11-2007, 07:51 PM
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Myself in a 4spd car I have always liked the 377 for more rpms but like everyone is saying the best would be to get another 350 block and build a mild 383 while you are still driving the car. Then just take a long weekend and put the 383 in and you are set.
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Old 06-12-2007, 02:10 PM
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Agreed everyone, appreciate the comments.....yeah...my dad mentioned the 377....and 355 (i think he don't want me to have the 383 cuz it would be fast, hahahah)....but the 383 looks pretty good right now......I've also looked at that zz4.......not sure, i'll have to read some more.....and i'm guessing everything in the rear would work since this is a vette right?.....and the 4 spd would be fine, in other words 350-400 hp wouldn't break nething?.........o, and one other thing, how much gas mileage would I lose with the 383 built aroud ~ 375hp?, lol
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Old 06-13-2007, 05:05 AM
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If you can keep your foot out of it ( and that's a big IF )you might actually get better mileage than the '77 350. Mid-70's 350's weren't known for great gas mileage. A Vortec head 383 with one of the milder roller cams and a well tuned Q-Jet absolutely has the potential to run circles around the original engine and use less fuel doing it.

I'm building a very mild 383 right now using Vortec heads and the GM '395 Marine roller cam to replace the original 350 in a '76 Monte. I'm also replacing the TH350 and 2.73's with a 200-4R and 3.73's. I should pickup 175 HP and 150 LbFt of peak TQ over the stock 165 HP it came with plus have a much broader TQ curve. The original engine is in great shape but it's a heavy car with the aerodynamics of a billboard so mileage is about 15 Avg. The new drivetrain should pull 18-20 no sweat IF I "play nice" and blow the doors off the original.

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Old 06-14-2007, 08:53 AM
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327- short stroke 350, a great little screamer
350- dime a dozen, good all around mill
355- bore the 350 .030 over (I'm pretty sure this is right)
377- 400 block with 350 crank (I think, not 100% sure) but the shorter stroke is better suited for higher rpms.
383- Opposite of above... 350 block with 400 crank, and bored .030 over I think would make 383 cubes...

I haven't played with the desktop dyno 2k I have at home for a while making weird block/crank combos, and since I don't want anyone to take the above as the Word of God, I'm letting people know it might not be exactly, totally accurate. Please correct any of the above if there are errors.

Also, if you plan on racing it a lot, get the crank balanced, and match the heaviest rod to the lightest piston to the entire rotating assembly is as balanced as possible.

About the guys getting better mpg than the stock smogger engines, this is assuming you don't run some racing cam. Especially for a sunny-day driver, I'd use a milder performance cam from a place like this , ditch the air injection, and use high flow cats. Vortec heads are excellent budget performance parts too, they bolt up slightly different than the traditional sbc heads though, but its no biggie.

For investment purposes, I'd keep the stock 77 engine covered with some fogging oil in the cylinders (keeps rust away) and use a junkyard block. Getting a vortec 350 out of a mid-90s Chevrolet pickup would get you the good heads and the better one piece rear main.
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