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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2013, 03:05 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
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cheapest way to get a running sbc with what you have is sell or scrap everything you have and buy a running 350 off craigslist.

When you can buy a running engine with only moderate miles and perhaps little wear for $500 or less you can't build them that cheap.

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Old 01-28-2013, 04:18 PM
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Thanks for the input everyone. I think I'm going to build the 307 even tho everyone seems to hate them. This will be my first engine build I'm going to use the Edelbrock intake, Holley carb, and HEI distibutor with the 305 heads I already have. Any suggestions on a cam?
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Old 01-28-2013, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryder57 View Post
Thanks for the input everyone. I think I'm going to build the 307 even tho everyone seems to hate them. This will be my first engine build I'm going to use the Edelbrock intake, Holley carb, and HEI distibutor with the 305 heads I already have. Any suggestions on a cam?
"Everyone seems to hate them"? I don't think you'll get that here. The only thing about the 307 is it's small. But other than that it can be a nice engine. I'd rather have a 307 than a 305 any day.

If I had a 307 I'd bolt on a set of L30 305 Vortec heads. Need an intake, SA rockers, center bolt valve covers. The payoff is a real good flowing head w/a chamber size smaller than a 350 head. Some info and photos of the L30 5.0d L Vortec head can be seen at NastyZ28.com Vortec Cylinder Heads: The Definitive Guide, post 478.


Vortec L30 "059" unported casting from the Stan Weiss head flow chart:
Lift....Int..Ex
.100 68...47
.200 128 103
.300 179 138
.400 205 152
.500 221 163
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Old 01-28-2013, 05:43 PM
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Maybe not on here but everywhere else I looked on the internet said they were" junk" and "boat anchors" because its not a 350. thats why i posted this question here and not other sites
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:08 PM
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I don't know about many other places but ill take a 307 any day and twice on sunday. so its not a 350, so what, why is it the common practice is if you don't know throw a 350 in it. why not 283 or 400 be original.

start small work your way up.

for you cam, you'll have about a 800 rpm difference than advertised, so look at your application then go from there
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryder57 View Post
Any suggestions on a cam?
You cannot intelligently choose a camshaft for a motor until you have nailed down the static compression ratio.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:37 AM
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Im a big fan of 283s and 307s for cruiser cars; you can use a fairly mild cam and it'll really wake them up, besides people will usually give you stuff for them on the cheap. I even had one nice lady give me $5 and a glass of juice for getting rid of some rusty junk someone hoarded in her shed. Thank you kindly ma'am for your rusty 350 smogger parts that I parlayed into a running 307 2bbl. Add stock 305 heads, Performer intake and a 600cfm Edelbrock with a Wolverine(?) '250H' hydraulic cam (not a roller cam). This is NOT the right way to do it; but my friends vega wagon needed a motor so we could go to spring break LOL. It probably made 220 honest HP (which is different than internet HP), but it ran like a champ, and it was loud and knocked down some decent economy when you drove sensible (Did I mention we were 21 and going to spring break??). Im sure if we had payed attention to detail, it would have done much better.

You have the time and the will to do this correctly. Use the right parts, with attention to detail and it will serve you well. Remember that a 307 uses a little different mindset in terms of parts (Most chevy aftermarket parts are based on the 350ci smallblock) so you'll want to avoid the popular Performer RPM manifold and 650cfm carburetor. You can't use a 2.02/1.60 set of valves in the heads either

Use a quality rebuild kit (Northern seems to make one); you probably want to make sure it has moly rings, a roller timing chain set and either King or Clevite bearings. Camshaft is dependent on your compression ratio, but it'll be fairly mild compared to the 350 crowd.

Ask lots of questions and HAVE FUN
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 01-29-2013, 10:15 AM
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You do not pick a camshaft solely by what the compression ratio.
Pick a cam that will do the job you want the motor to do.
Pick the cam duration based on the rpm range you want the power to be made at.
Then pick a compression ratio that is usable with the intended fuel.
Obviously if you limit the fuel choice to a low octane 87 octane then you need to go easy on the engine compression ratio.
just remember low compression ='s low torque output.
A high performance engine needs a high performance fuel.

For a high performance pump gas motor using a 92 octane fuel a compression ratio of 9.8 to 10.5:1 works
real well. And the cam , from that point, does not have that much effect on that.
On pump gas, once you get beyond about 10.5:1 cr your chance of having engine knock problems
greatly increases, reguardless of what cam is in that motor.
You want a generous compression ratio, but not excessive for the fuel in the tank.
More compression ='s more engine torque output. Up the the practical usable limit of the fuel in the tank.
Beyond 10.5:1 compression consider it EXPERIMENTAL, as you are at or real close to the practical street operational edge of GOOD pump gas.
10.6,,,10.7 +++ expect that the motor may/probabily will want more fuel octane that wahts in the pump.
Allowing he engine to ping and knock because the cr is too high for the pump gas fuels ability to resist detonation ("octane"), will result in engine damage. Its just a matter of time.
Just realize a cam cannot be a big cam and be a small cam a the same time.
Pick a cam based on how you will really be using the vehicle and the gear ratio.
Gear ratio:
Placeing or establishing the RPM @ 60MPH ("cruise rpm') is a good bench mark.
Auto trans:
Bigger cams need a high stall too, especially in a small cid engine.

Intake manifolds. If you want a powerfull 307 then a RPM manifold and 750cfm carb is great choice.
That same motor will want a cam and gear and a converter too.
If you area after big horsepower do not dummy it down with low horsepower parts or a small carb.
A 307 makes (more) power like any other motor, By breathing more air and processing more fuel.
Yup it will need rpm.

But of you do not want a big horsepower, and want a low rpm , stock like cruiser, then keep the cam small
and use a low end torque type intake manifold.
The RPM manifold and others (dual plane hi rise) like it that have a full plenum divider have broad power range.

If you want to cam it up for power, you want stiff gears. ( A 3307 is much like a 283 or 327, it likes RPM, when hot rodded.
If you are not willing to do that, keep the cam for your 307 relatively small.
Like stated you don't really want or need a 2.02" intake valve for a 307. A 1.94" valve gets it done.
Especially when the head is ported for improved air flow. Flow is power. A 1.94 x 1.60 valve set is ideal for a high perf
street 307. A 1.94" x 1.50" valve set gets it done too.

Last edited by F-BIRD'88; 01-29-2013 at 10:42 AM.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 01-29-2013, 10:46 AM
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350 block into a 327

I agree with the k.i.s.s. method. If you're on a budget and money is an issue, maybe it would be simpler to ust clean up the 350 block and bolt the 305 heads on it. The smaller combustion chamber would boost compression without having to re-work anything. Its the most economical way to get a good running engine. Then save your dimes for a point down the road when a more radical build is in the budget. Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 01-29-2013, 11:07 AM
How fast is fast enough?
 
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For your modest goals and budget I'd just use an "RV cam" in the 205-215 duration range, clean up the bowls and chambers around the valve seats, run flat top pistons with the 305 heads, a moly cast ring set, a stock type timing chain will be fine, stock crank, rods, valve covers, rockers, pan, etc. I would step up to a m155hv oil pump, but otherwise mostly stock everything else except maybe some headers and as said mild work on the heads. Maybe a used performer or RPM intake if you can get one cheap, a plain jane 600cfm holley vac secondary carb, a rebuilt HEI ignition with a stock module and maybe a hotter coil, recurved of course.

Just keep it simple and you'll be able to get close to 1hp/ci on a shoestring budget.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:19 PM
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How would a Comp Thumper cam work with this set up? Duration@.050" 227/241 lift is .511int/.497 exh I found one really cheap a guy bought but never used is this to much cam?
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 01-29-2013, 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by ryder57 View Post
How would a Comp Thumper cam work with this set up? Duration@.050" 227/241 lift is .511int/.497 exh I found one really cheap a guy bought but never used is this to much cam?
There is no such thing as too much cam. Just not enough motor.

Will need serious rear gears and a serious stall converter.
If you are not willing to do that , pass on that cam.
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Old 02-01-2013, 06:36 PM
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Ok so I started taking the 307 apart and inspected the heads and they are not 305 heads. They are the "882" casting number heads with the big valves. Should put them in the 350 block and build it since they are bigger heads?
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 02-01-2013, 07:01 PM
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Ok so I started taking the 307 apart and inspected the heads and they are not 305 heads. They are the "882" casting number heads with the big valves. Should put them in the 350 block and build it since they are bigger heads?
these are the worst SBC heads there are. The cr was extemely low with these heads on a 307 and they flow like crap.

Find a cylinder head with a small combustion chamber.
882 heads are useless and usually cracked too..
If the valves are 1.94x 1.50 and usable keep them and the retainers and locks.
If small 1.72" valves diameter ditch the heads whole.

Find a better head.

On the 307 bring the piston to TDC exactly and measure the piston deck clearance @ TDC.
This will be a whole different motor with a high compression cylinder head on it.
With a 882 head on it its no surprise your friend gave it to you. It would be a very lame motor.
You can fix that.

If you want any chance of using the thumpr cam in a 307 working well you need a high compression ratio+ head port flow
stiff gears and a converter.
You want a cylinder head with a real 53cc to 58cc chamber volume (measured) and a thin .015" head gasket.
The 307's piston deck clearance @TDC matters.

Last edited by F-BIRD'88; 02-01-2013 at 07:10 PM.
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:21 PM
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307

882 castings are 76cc chamber heads with smog controlled flow...which could possibly be the worst head ever bolted to a small block. I have used several of these heads on my race boat...as anchors!
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