400 sbc vs 400 pontiac - Page 4 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Engine
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #46 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 12:13 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Lancaster, CA
Posts: 229
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by runn141
what i have seen with pontiac the pontiac 350 will kill a pontiac 400, i think the pontiac 350 is also a big block. correct me if im wrong
the pontiac 350,400,455 are all the same block on the outside.

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #47 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 01:01 PM
Dirty Biker's Avatar
Bold As Love
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: In my van, down by the river.
Age: 38
Posts: 378
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndersonRacing44
the pontiac 350,400,455 are all the same block on the outside.
actually the pontiac 287 and up are all the same block.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontiac_V8_engine



For whatever my opinion is worth, I think:


A Pontiac 400 will completely destroy a 400 sbc in a race. There is no compare. 400 sbc doesn't have a prayer. If I could easily(cheaply) put a pontiac motor in my van I would in a heartbeat.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #48 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 01:27 PM
cobalt327's Avatar
WFO
 
Last wiki edit: Intake manifold
Last journal entry: 1980 Malibu Wagon
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Atlanta
Age: 59
Posts: 5,037
Wiki Edits: 1616

Thanks: 128
Thanked 597 Times in 546 Posts
I don't know what you base that on, but is the rare 400 Pontiac that will beat a 400 SBC in a drag race.

It is all in the cylinder head flow. Even a set of Edelbrock Pontiac heads do not hold a candle to a decent aftermarket SBC head.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #49 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 03:12 PM
lust4speed's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Inland Empire, SOCAL
Posts: 424
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Before this gets too carried away, statements have to define and limit the engine combinations that we are talking about. It does little to base your opinion on the latest, greatest, and most expensive after-market blocks and heads. By the time you have altered every dimension of the old small block, can you really still call it a true representation of a Chevy engine? We can talk about exotic engines made of unobtanium, engines made up of expensive parts, or what was delivered from the factory back in the day.

1. Unobtanium goes to Chevy - Years of multiple after-market suppliers have introduced some truly impressive speed parts. If your wallet is big enough, Chevy wins. But again, is it a really a Chevy engine at this point when nothing will interchange with the original engine?

2. Just really expensive parts to modify your engine - Very close call today. Pontiac after-market suppliers are finally starting to appear and this segment is hard to call with Pontiac finally making up some ground. This is going to be an interesting arena in the next few years for all engine makes. Last Pontiac performance engine stopped with the 1974 model year, and there were very few produced with the gas crisis and insurance companies wrecking havoc. Pontiac people have had to work with parts that were made at least 36 years ago and sometimes 46 years ago while the Chevy engines continued to be produced and refined by Chevrolet and after-market suppliers. Old Pontiac technology held up remarkably well without any refinement from manufacturer or supplier input, and this old stuff still remains competitive in this mid-range competition. As for today, have you researched the CV1 Pontiac head? Pontiac Tiger heads? The new generation RAV aluminum head that just hit production? There are two aftermarket Pontiac block suppliers doing both cast iron and aluminum that can easily live at 535ci on the street, larger for strip only. Cool times ahead for everyone, and finally Pontiac is included.

3. Stock off the showroom floor - Pontiac won hands down, and it was superior to either the small or big block available engines factory installed in Chevrolet's. The Pontiac's were drivable anywhere which wasn't always the case with other higher compression engines. It was a very rare occasion for a stock Pontiac to loose a street race against another stock car. I had a '63 Chevy SS Impala with the 327 (in 1963) that would chew up most cars on the road (including 409's that always seemed to load up and not clean out in street driving), but not the Pontiac's. In '67 I traded in my SS, and factory ordered my GTO that I still have today. I was 19 when I took delivery and did plenty of "testing" out on the street against other brands. So my results are first-hand.

Pontiac cylinder head combustion chambers are fully machined. There is no equalizing chamber sizes like on a cast Chevy chamber, and all Pontiac chambers are right on the money. There also are no casting irregularities that can screw up flame travel. Chevy after-market finally introduced the air-gap manifold bragging about the horsepower increase, but Pontiac always used a separate valley cover. Finally, the Pontiac torque range was brutal. What wins races is the total power available under the curve, and there is no contest here. Dyno results for the Pontiac engine produce a flat line for torque across the curve. Now in drag racing on the track, you can make up for the small block's output by gearing way down, ridiculously loosening up the converter, and screaming it to the stratosphere -- but this produces an engine that is miserable to drive down to the local store, never mind across town or a real road trip.

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Last edited by lust4speed; 09-08-2010 at 03:33 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #50 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 04:03 PM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: At Speed
Age: 51
Posts: 1,346
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 2
Thanked 29 Times in 29 Posts
If the requirements are that it be nearly stock and driveable, I'll take an LSX over any muscle car engine. My old Camaro is getting a LS3 this winter.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #51 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 04:40 PM
lust4speed's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Inland Empire, SOCAL
Posts: 424
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
An LSX longblock is neither stock nor inexpensive. That's not to say it isn't a very nice piece, but it would fall into my category 1 for most of us.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #52 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 04:59 PM
Dirty Biker's Avatar
Bold As Love
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: In my van, down by the river.
Age: 38
Posts: 378
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by lust4speed
An LSX longblock is neither stock nor inexpensive. That's not to say it isn't a very nice piece, but it would fall into my category 1 for most of us.

Thank you man! That other post was awesome too! I was hoping somebody would come on here and say a few words in defense of Poncho!

It seems everybody just wants to believe that the motor they spent all there time and money on is the best, nothing really wrong with that I guess as long as you are nice about it. I like pontiac and chevy both, just for different reasons. I would have a pontiac if I could, I like them alot. I almost had a real mint condition 287 and the manual transmission that went with it. They put them in big GMC trucks a long time ago. I didn't buy it because I was afraid of the cost of making a custom driveshaft or a bop/chevy tranny adapter, however looking back on it, I should have maybe just went for it because a week or so later there was a th400 for pontiac bolt pattern in the paper that I could have just maybe used with my old driveshaft.

I could argue all the reasons why I think they are better but sometimes the truth speaks for itself.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #53 (permalink)  
Old 09-08-2010, 06:17 PM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: At Speed
Age: 51
Posts: 1,346
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 2
Thanked 29 Times in 29 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by lust4speed
An LSX longblock is neither stock nor inexpensive. That's not to say it isn't a very nice piece, but it would fall into my category 1 for most of us.
LS motors are cheap and plentiful, especially the 5.3 . I chose to buy a new LS3 crate. Even the real LSX 6.2 is less than $7k. A 6.2 LS can make 500hp with ease and drives like a modern fuel injected car should drive.

Category 1 parts would be R07 setup.

I still prefer real musclecars have the engines they were built with, especially the old, rare cars. My Camaro was a L6 when new so I dont feel any sympathy for making it into a fun, driveable car.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Engine posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Opinion on 400 SBC Build Up. ezobens Engine 22 11-18-2013 07:49 AM
400 cid SBC Shades_o_Grey Engine 20 02-04-2008 12:28 PM
400 Sbc With 350 Crank Six Inch Rods blown volvo Engine 53 02-17-2006 10:36 AM
400 SBC...New CAM thecamaroguy Engine 41 03-15-2005 06:47 AM
400 SBC Balancing and info ? Brobob Engine 8 10-31-2002 03:44 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.