409 dies when hot - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Engine
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04-27-2013, 06:56 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
409 dies when hot

Hey guys, hope someone can shed some light on this. I have a 63 Impala SS with 409/425. Engine was rebuilt a year ago last fall. Engine remained stock except for the addition of Edelbrock 1403/1404 carbs and Procomp PC-7000 dist and PC-91 coil.
Last spring I broke it in the recommended way and put almost 600 miles on it over the summer with no problems. This past winter I started it 3 times and let run for about 10 minutes but didn't drive it.
Several weeks ago when I was going to drive it it wouldn't start. It would fire every time but not start. I tracked problem down to ignition wire from firewall to coil and corrected, (I hope). So far I haven't had that problem. I took car out and drove a peaceful 1 mile drive and 1 block from home the car died and wouldn't start. Fuel pressure guage showed 6.5lbs and getting gas to carb. Walked home and got my remote starter cable and when I checked plug 1 it was an orange colored flame. Put plug back in and started and ran fine.
Today it started fine and drove around the block. Parked it and 10 minutes later it wouldn't start. Checked plug 1 again and orangish flame but car started right up again.
It seems when I pull plug 1 out and check and then reinstall it the car starts right up. My first guess would be replace wiring harness from firewall since it's all original and I've already had a problem with it.
It appears to be heat related but ran great all last summer when it was a whole lot hotter.
Thanks for reading

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 04-27-2013, 08:25 PM
496CHEVY3100's Avatar
Appalachian American
 

Last journal entry: ,
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Appalachia GA
Posts: 858
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 495
Thanked 330 Times in 289 Posts
Did you remove the voltage reducer,probably on the firewall the 63 came with one ,the second small wire on the solenoid switch gives 12 volts while in start position then drops to 6-8 volts to run on,,you need full constsnt 12 volts for the pro comp dist.,hope you have better luck with the Pro Comp that i did or many others ,I had to remove mine with less than 200 miles,
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 04-27-2013, 08:40 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks 496
I thought I had but now you've got me wondering. It ran fine all last summer so I thought everything was cool. The orange colored flame at the plug has me wondering about the coil/dist also. What did you upgrade too?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 04-28-2013, 08:48 AM
496CHEVY3100's Avatar
Appalachian American
 

Last journal entry: ,
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Appalachia GA
Posts: 858
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 495
Thanked 330 Times in 289 Posts
I used a MSD with vacuum advance, to help improve fuel mileage,it works great,i have made some other upgrades almost ready to run again,mine is a 496 wish I could have found a 09,
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	ACCESORYS 002.jpg
Views:	49
Size:	395.8 KB
ID:	73606  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 04-28-2013, 07:45 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Sweet engine. I originally looked at MSD but decided to go the cheap route. I guess you get what you pay for. Now, it's going to cost me more in the long run but the way the car runs now I'm afraid to drive it. Thanks.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 04-28-2013, 09:58 PM
Registered User
 

Last journal entry: Update
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 56
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
You might post this problem on 348-409.com and see if there are any other suggestions.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2013, 05:53 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks. I'll do that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2013, 09:16 AM
Registered User
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 2,348
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 666
Thanked 252 Times in 225 Posts
My first guess would be the Pro Comp dizzy and coil. What about going to a OEM GM HEI? or converting your Pro Comp to a Pertronix Ignitor 2 (Im not even sure if this is even possible)?
Is the cap damaged? Is the plug or plug wire damaged? Do you have an old coil you can test to see if the coil is getting saturated and crapping out?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2013, 08:00 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanks Autogear,
Cap, plugs & wires all look good. I do have the old coil I could try. It almost appears coil is crapping out once it gets hot and not delivering a hot spark. I'm going to try this and will post results.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 04-29-2013, 11:47 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: California
Age: 68
Posts: 831
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 28
Thanked 23 Times in 20 Posts
Orange flame? Did the plugs seem fuel soaked? Maybe? 6.5 PSI might be high for Edelbrocks. Possible?

PatM
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2013, 06:04 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Plugs are dry. Shouldn't the flame be more of a whiteish blue? Pressure flucuates between 6.0 - 6.5; Edelbrock says no more than 6.5. The pressure was the same last summer and it ran great then. I'm open to any suggestions and appreciate your input.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2013, 08:44 AM
496CHEVY3100's Avatar
Appalachian American
 

Last journal entry: ,
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Appalachia GA
Posts: 858
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 495
Thanked 330 Times in 289 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 63SS View Post
Plugs are dry. Shouldn't the flame be more of a whiteish blue? Pressure flucuates between 6.0 - 6.5; Edelbrock says no more than 6.5. The pressure was the same last summer and it ran great then. I'm open to any suggestions and appreciate your input.
On the original point type ignition if a condenser was bad it would quit running after is bet hot ,also coils would get hot ,I have poured water on the coil to get it to crank ,on the coil not on the wire connections,it is on;y a temporary fix ,just to get it off the road or home,on an electronic coil I don't know the difference in voltage output ratings they are both 12v input are you using original or aftermarket coil,might be worth a try, are you gettind a full 12 v to coil while RUNNING. some ignition wires have built in resistors in the wire instead of having a ceramic resistor.?

Last edited by 496CHEVY3100; 04-30-2013 at 08:51 AM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2013, 11:31 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
It's an after market coil: ProComp PC-91. I haven't checked for 12v while running but that's a good idea. I had replaced ignition wire when I first installed aftermarket dist & coil in case it was a resistor wire, (no ballast resistor either). Thank you
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2013, 07:32 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Update: bad coil. Sorry I didn't post sooner but I've been having problems getting onto the site; page will start to load and then freeze. Anyway, appears coil was bad. The PC-91 is a rectangular, finned heat sink with a male terminal for high voltage wire versus the round coil with female connector. The insulation around this terminal was cracked on the back side of it and shorting to ground. I'm guessing the hotter the coil got the wider the crack got until it shorted itself out and engine died. Once it cooled off the gap closed enough to wear I could start engine again. I replaced coil and haven't had any problems since, (knock on wood).
Thank you to everyone who made suggestions; each one made me dig a little deeper and look a little closer and in the end it paid off.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Engine posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
64 impala SS 409 SS409 Introduce Yourself 6 09-28-2011 10:17 PM
SBC 350 dies when hot 57dreamer Engine 12 06-07-2011 07:17 AM
Streetable 409 banedt Engine 7 11-01-2009 07:39 PM
409 james clack Introduce Yourself 2 12-20-2005 03:05 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:55 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.