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-   -   A-518 transmission questions (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/518-transmission-questions-209614.html)

pjc360 11-30-2011 08:57 PM

A-518 transmission questions
 
I just recently had the A-518 transmission in my 1991 dodge ram fully re-built this fall and the builder told me to flush all the fluid out after 1000 miles and put 14 quarts of new fluid in it along with a new filter and pan gasket, when i asked him what kind of atf to use he said we put atf+3 in it.
Since then i have been trying to do my homework on what the best fluid for this transmission is and some people swear by atf+4 and say thats the only fluid that should be ran in a overdrive chrysler transmission, but builders and mechanics that i have talked too tell me that atf+4 is not what they would reccomend because it has alot of friction modifyers in it that mine does not need because i do not have a lock up torque converter. and with them friction modifyers the transmission will be running hotter and shifting softer.
The transmission people i know all seem to recomend dexronIII and some have told me dexronVI is the best atf other then amsoil or royal purple, what im trying to find out is if a person can run type f atf in the A-518? i know my old man ran type f in all his 727's with great results and never had any problems, but he did have his transmissions beefed up quite a bit more then stock, and he is passed away last year so i cant ask him how type f would work in the A-518, the only difference between the 727 and the 518 from what i have been told is that the 518 has the overdrive unit on the back of it. so has anoyone ran type f in the A-518 or know of anyone who has with good results? this is the fluid i would like to run if it can keep the overdrive unit happy, if it cant i guess i will run dexronIII or dexronVI.

pjc360 11-30-2011 09:21 PM

more A-518 transmission questions
 
I was going to add this in with my first question regarding the best atf to use in the A-518 but figured it would be too long, anyways my transmission is the A-518 in a 1991 dodge ram 4x4 it was re-built in september and only has about 500 miles on it. When i first got it back from the transmission shop i noticed everytime i went over any kind of bump i could feel clunking going on under my feet in the floor boards, took me awhile but i discovered it was the bottom transmission mounts, they were totally shot sqaushed down to nothing. I changed the passenger side bottom mount because it had the most movement when prying under it with a pry bar an after i put a new mount on passenger side i drove it and i could still feel clunking in the floor boards, so i got the drivers side bottom transmission mount and replaced itand drove it and solved the clunking feeling in the floorboard was gone, but i had a new problem, a vibration :pain:.
So i checked the engine mounts, the drivers side was prety bad, so i ordered 2 new engine mounts and replaced those, it got rid of the vibration while it was just sitting there at an idle but when its in park and at an idle and i give it some gas up to about 2 thousand rpm the dash starts vibrating same with steering wheel? so the next thing i did was ordered 2 new top transmission mounts, thought maybe thats whats causing it? put the new top mounts in and its still doing the same thing didnt make any difference at all :smash:
After installing new engine mounts and new transmission mounts top and bottom and still having this vibration i decided to check the belts, the belts are brand new but my power steering pump was squeeling at a high rpm whether driving and getting high in the rpms or while sitting parked it squeeled to beat hell so i figured the bearing must be bad in it and maybe thats whats causing this vibration and since all my mounts were shot maybe i couldnt feel it before but now i can since i have new mounts, so i pulled the old pupm off had to order a new pump parts stores never have anything i need in stock, the new power steering pump got in yesterday and i took the pulley off my old pump and put it on the new pump and mounted the new pump in and im getting new power steering hoses tommarrow and will be able to fire it up and see if that take care of the vibration? :confused:
Another thing i forgot to add is i never had any problems with vibration untill i changed the drivers side bottom transmission mount, and i have noticed that since this vibration has appeard so has a whine or humming niose, i am almost positive it is coming from the transmission, when i put it in drive and just slowly take off it has a whine/humming noise to it, its hard to explain it almost sounds like a transfer case does when in four wheel drive and coming down a mountain road in 4x4 and getting going pretty fast and letting off the gas you know that sound a transfer case will make when your in 4x4 coming down a hill or a steep road and your going pretty fast and let off the gas that humming noise they make? thats what this sounds like? and i can not figure out what it is? i got a brand new torqe converter with my re-build and a new pump and it does not make this sound while its in park or nuetral only when driving at slower spped, it might do it at higher speeds to but if it is doing it i cant hear it? any suggestions? i will let everyone know if the new power steering pump took care of the vibration or not.

Crosley 11-30-2011 09:34 PM

Welcome to Hotrodders.com

I merged your two threads on the same topic into one.

joshp83 11-30-2011 11:33 PM

518
 
basicly it is a 727 with a overdrive some diffrences but still a tf the problem with type f fluid you have a lock up torque converter and type f can cause a shudder
when the lock ups engaged i had used dexron 3 in 500/518s with no drivability complaints but atf4 is supposed to allower smoother operations i usually use castrol tranny fluid in the garage and lude gaurd additive as for the vibraton with out seeing the trucks its had to say check the harmonic balancer if it had the vibration after the trans install it couyld have the wrong converter but it would of vibrated from the get go

SSedan64 12-01-2011 04:37 AM

Have you checked the Trans to Engine mounting bolts?
Torque Converter mounting bolts?

You should have the Trans Shop check the Whine out, possibly a Planetary going bad.

tnsmith10 12-01-2011 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pjc360
I was going to add this in with my first question regarding the best atf to use in the A-518 but figured it would be too long, anyways my transmission is the A-518 in a 1991 dodge ram 4x4 it was re-built in september and only has about 500 miles on it. When i first got it back from the transmission shop i noticed everytime i went over any kind of bump i could feel clunking going on under my feet in the floor boards, took me awhile but i discovered it was the bottom transmission mounts, they were totally shot sqaushed down to nothing. I changed the passenger side bottom mount because it had the most movement when prying under it with a pry bar an after i put a new mount on passenger side i drove it and i could still feel clunking in the floor boards, so i got the drivers side bottom transmission mount and replaced itand drove it and solved the clunking feeling in the floorboard was gone, but i had a new problem, a vibration :pain:.
So i checked the engine mounts, the drivers side was prety bad, so i ordered 2 new engine mounts and replaced those, it got rid of the vibration while it was just sitting there at an idle but when its in park and at an idle and i give it some gas up to about 2 thousand rpm the dash starts vibrating same with steering wheel? so the next thing i did was ordered 2 new top transmission mounts, thought maybe thats whats causing it? put the new top mounts in and its still doing the same thing didnt make any difference at all :smash:
After installing new engine mounts and new transmission mounts top and bottom and still having this vibration i decided to check the belts, the belts are brand new but my power steering pump was squeeling at a high rpm whether driving and getting high in the rpms or while sitting parked it squeeled to beat hell so i figured the bearing must be bad in it and maybe thats whats causing this vibration and since all my mounts were shot maybe i couldnt feel it before but now i can since i have new mounts, so i pulled the old pupm off had to order a new pump parts stores never have anything i need in stock, the new power steering pump got in yesterday and i took the pulley off my old pump and put it on the new pump and mounted the new pump in and im getting new power steering hoses tommarrow and will be able to fire it up and see if that take care of the vibration? :confused:
Another thing i forgot to add is i never had any problems with vibration untill i changed the drivers side bottom transmission mount, and i have noticed that since this vibration has appeard so has a whine or humming niose, i am almost positive it is coming from the transmission, when i put it in drive and just slowly take off it has a whine/humming noise to it, its hard to explain it almost sounds like a transfer case does when in four wheel drive and coming down a mountain road in 4x4 and getting going pretty fast and letting off the gas you know that sound a transfer case will make when your in 4x4 coming down a hill or a steep road and your going pretty fast and let off the gas that humming noise they make? thats what this sounds like? and i can not figure out what it is? i got a brand new torqe converter with my re-build and a new pump and it does not make this sound while its in park or nuetral only when driving at slower spped, it might do it at higher speeds to but if it is doing it i cant hear it? any suggestions? i will let everyone know if the new power steering pump took care of the vibration or not.


ok, there are a few things i can see that right away will point out a bad converter or the wrong converter or improper "clock" position of the converter.
first, when you get noise/whine in gear but not in park or neutral, that would indicate a converter problem internally and, is either just a bad build or the converter wasnt pulled up to the flex plate evenly.
2nd, a vibration is possible from the converter for 2 reasons, either the wrong converter was installed, or the right converter was not clocked to position where it needs to be. the early converter mounting pads are offset and need to be oriented so all the bolts can be installed. the converter hubs are the same between a 518 for a 5.2 and 5.9 but, the 5.9 converter will have a weight on it as where the 5.2 wont. if it has the correct converter installed, id rotate the engine around by hand with the dust shied off to check to see if all the converter bolts are in place because, if the converter is not clocked right, you cant get all the converter bolts in.
as far as fluid goes, atf+4 is what that trans calls for. it has friction modifiers built in to eliminate converter shudder on tcc apply.

pjc360 12-01-2011 11:03 AM

ok some of you mis understood what i have, i do not have a lock up converter. so is type f fluid ok to use in it since i do not have a lock up torque converter? As far as the vibration, it was smooth as glass untill i changed the drivers side bottom transmission mount, i had changed the passenger side bottom mount first and it didnt vibrate but it was still clunking around when going over bumps, so i replaced the drivers side bottom mount too and that got rid of the clunking. Before that tho no vibration what so ever ran really smooth no matter what the speed or rpm. Im going to get that power steering pump put on today and if that dont fix it im going to take it back to the transmission shop who re-built it and tell them that somethings going on with it and that it needs to be fixed because i plan on hauling a trailor and working this transmission. I looked around when finding a shop and everybody told me the shop i took it to is the best in town. I'm just trying to make sure its not something else because i dont wanna bring it to them and have them find out that its something else other then the transmission and charge me for fixes it because only the transmission is under warranty.

pjc360 12-01-2011 11:18 AM

Another thing that kinda makes me think its not the wrong converter is cause these guys have re-built enough A-518's and 46re and 47re's to know what parts these transmissions require, they are suposidly the best in town and i dont live in a small town ether, there are 7 other transmission shops in town that i can think of off the top of my head, i mean i dont live in a big city but its not a small town ether. One of the builders told me when i first called them about doing the transmission that they have done alot of 518's, told me they have put a 518 into a 71 charger before, and another in a 70 super bee, and told me they had put a few in the dakotas so they were not strangers to this transmission. not saying they could have screwed up anybody can, id think if it had the wrong torque converter in it wouldnt i have been expierencing problems with it right from the get go? like i said it was smooth as glass untill i changed them bottom mounts, i un-bolted the back end of the transmission off the cross member deal that holds it to the mounts then i un-bolted the bolts going thru the bottom mounts and i lifted up on the transfer case untill the back end of the transmission was high enough to where i could pull the old mounts out and put the new mounts in

pjc360 12-01-2011 07:52 PM

well i just finished installing the new power steering pump and hoses on the truck today, fired it up and it don't squell like a pig anymore when you give her some gas, but the vibration problem is still there??? this is so frustrating i could spend countless money and hours trying to guess what the hell is causing it.
Its strange like i said this vibration never came about untill i changed the bottom transmission mounts, i made sure all the bolts on the torque converter are tight and they are tight, all the bolts that bolt the transmission up to the engine, the bolts i could get too anyway are tight, its got brand new engine mounts, brand new top and bottom transmission mounts, its got a brand new power steering pump and a brand new altenator and the altenator and power steering belts are both brand new??? im confused and do not know what is causing this, if it makes it easier to pin point the problem i will add that it vibrates while in park or nuetral and i can put the transfer case in nuetral and that does not change the vibration ether.
Its a vibration specially when its cold and you fisrt start it up i can feel the vibration pulsating thru my seat and the steering wheel and the dash, and it seems to be coming from right under the dash so where the transmission and engine meet. I'm going to go to the transmission shop who re-built and installed the transmission toommarrow and tell them whats going on and im going to suggest that they take a good look at it because here in a few weeks this truck is going to be seeing some work, i will be moving and renting a U-haul trailor and i will be making a few trips with the u-haul trailor traveling 240 miles round trip each trip. so im just going to say im worried about it holding up and dont want to get stranded somehwere so you guys might wanna pull the transmission mount and make sure the torque converter was installed right and make sure it was balanced correctly and make sure the flex plate is not broke.
At this point i dont know what else it could be other then the transmission/torque converter any thoughts?

pjc360 12-01-2011 08:03 PM

what could have went wrong upon installing new bottom transmission mounts? because ever since i put new bottom transmission mounts is when this vibration problem occured? someone told me on the dodgetalk web site that if the transmission was bolted to the engine and bolted in the truck when i changed the mounts that there isn't anything that couldve happened to the transmission just from lifting it up high enough to get the old mounts out and he was thinking it was not a transmission problem, but what makes me disagree is the whineing noise im getting from it when first taking off, and today it had not been started in a few days and its been really cold out the last few days, anyways when i fired it up something was squeeling under the truck and it sounded like the torque converter. made a quick second high pitched chirpping noise

pjc360 12-01-2011 08:50 PM

oh and another thing i been wanting to know is can i run type f atf? i do NOT have a lock up torque converter, i seen a few people posted no not to use type f because i have a lock up torque converter but i forget to add it in that i do not have a lock up converter, if i did have one i would not have asked about type f because i already know type f does not jive well with the lock up converters. know type f works great in the regular 727 wich mine basically is it just has the overdrive unit on the back, so can i run type f? or would it be a wiser choice to use dexronIII or even the new dexronVI?

tnsmith10 12-02-2011 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pjc360
oh and another thing i been wanting to know is can i run type f atf? i do NOT have a lock up torque converter, i seen a few people posted no not to use type f because i have a lock up torque converter but i forget to add it in that i do not have a lock up converter, if i did have one i would not have asked about type f because i already know type f does not jive well with the lock up converters. know type f works great in the regular 727 wich mine basically is it just has the overdrive unit on the back, so can i run type f? or would it be a wiser choice to use dexronIII or even the new dexronVI?

its not that you cant. these trannys normally have a lockup converter and its typically known for having shudder on apply if you dont use a fluid with a friction modifier. one question, the plug that goes to the case connector, is it 2 wire or 3?
actually type f is used by quite a few drag racers because of its known added frictional qualities but, it lacks other minerals and detergents that the ATF+4 has purposely put in for the dodge trans and components.

as far as the noise coming from the bell housing area with the noise you described, it definitely has a bad converter, and it could be from manufacturing or installation. and just because the shop is supposed to have the best reputation in town doesnt mean at the time of install of your trans that they had a experienced, and qualified tech to do the installation.
just because they can get it together doesnt mean they know what to look for or do to ensure that the install doesnt come back on them.
cleaning out the back of the crank and taking some scotchbrite to the pilot of the converter is usually necassary to help keep the converter from "side loading" on the pump bushing, along with pulling the converter up flush to the flexplate before tightening a single bolt will help make sure that the converter doesnt do this.

pjc360 12-02-2011 04:04 PM

so the converter sounds like it went out? they gave me a brand new torque converter with the re-build? just seems odd it would go out that fast and seems how they are supposed to be the best transmission shop in the area but maybe cause something is going on, i have a vibration and noise when taking off from a stop. i just dont see how any shop specially a shop thats spos to be the best could mess up like that, but i will be bringing it back to them because it is under a 2 year warranty and they will be fixing it or giving me my money back.

pjc360 12-02-2011 04:07 PM

oh and to answer your question it has a 2 pin connector, sorry i got side tracked writing back about that shop, it really ticks me off that i pay 2400 bucks for the re-build in cash mind you and it has problems not even 500 miles later what a joke. :embarrass

pjc360 12-02-2011 04:38 PM

so since it is a non lock up converter type f atf fluid can be used in this transmission? it is old and does not have alot of the additives the newer fluids have but it can be used in the A-518 transmission that does not have lock up? correct?


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