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53 Belair conv rust repair

1M views 6K replies 111 participants last post by  Eduramac 
#1 ·
I just brought home a 1953 Chevy convertible Monday that is 100% there. 100% there except for the bottom 6 inches that is. I have always built rusty cars no one else wanted but have tried to do a quality job of repairing them on a budget.

The key wordhere is budget. I admit to being frugal but friends all say I am cheap. Whatever, for me to be able to enjoy this hobby I must be able to build the car and have my money invested, not just spent

The cost of replacement floor pans, floor braces, inner rockers, outer rockers, lower quarter panels, tow boards, trunk pan, rear pan extension, tail pan, and rear splash apron is well over 3000 dollars. That is money that will buy front suspension, rear axle, and good buildable engine. Maybe even a complete parts car.

I have basic sheet metal tools but nothing exotic. Small 3' brake, Shrinker/stretcher jaws, home made slip roll, and a home made english wheel and 110v mig welder.

My purpose here is to show the new hot rodder who is apprehensive about what he can do what is possible with a little time and patience and not much money.

Below is the patient. She has stage four cancer but we are going to try to save her. If we don't who will? :mwink:








So far I have stripped the inside, removed the front fenders and adjusted the doors. If the body shifts or moves during the build process I want to know it before everything gets welded together. Frequently checking door gaps will let me make sure it has not moved.




Tomorrow I plan to cut the toe boards loose from the front floor brace and expose the brace. The first job will be to remove the brace and reproduce it.

I hope you guys follow along and feel free to comment share thoughts, opinions, etc.

 
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#3,238 ·
John, yes that picture explains a lot. I can read your little "this goes here" marks and understand completely. What maybe I missed was the solution to solve track width. I won't poke with stick, just wait for that part to come up. The discussion has been a little scattered between this and the today thread so it will be cool if you pile it all in a thread. Keep on rockin'.

Mark, color consistency is something you either do or nobody buys the paint. Just like cars have to run. You guys are blessed to be near the source of your favorite brand.
 
#3,239 ·
Well John. I WILL be hard on you because were friends and I know you can handle it, Plus YOU know how I am sugar coating aint my thang.
First I don't see any type of center line they both need a visible center and well marked, thats where everything is measured from, curves and tappers mean nothing the center is everything get both frames in line then slide the sub back or forward for the correct wheel base. If your sub goes off center line it back up at a glance.
Lawyers always say don't ask a question that you don't know the answer to, along those lines I always say Never cut if you don't have a solid plan to go by. Having both frames cut at this point removes a lot of options.
Here in Ga. a frame can not be cut and butted together even if its sleeved all four cuts (top, bottom and sides) need to be staggered by 6-8 inches, so the outside cut and the inside cut will be 6-8" apart same with the top and bottom. like the seams in a brick wall.
I haven't been looking at your frame as long as you have but my first impression was to leave the rails and cut out the cross member, then remove the cross member from the sub and only use that and its suspension. But THATS me, You may have something better and easier in mind but mainly I just don't see how any of this can be done without knowing where center is on both frames. That cant be changed so its perfect reference line. Something to think about anyways.
 
#3,240 ·
Hey John, since I'm not sure how much collision repair you've been around I'm gonna drop a couple links here in case a little more info about measuring is needed, for 100% confidence. The principle of a datum plane is very helpful in measuring big oddly shaped items such as your frame:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datum_reference

That is something you can establish even if your floor is less than level. A guy needs a flat, level reference to check progress with and thats what an imaginary datum plane provides. In addition, some folks make jigs to avoid repeating some measurements a lot while a chassis is under construction.

Here is a basic article that touches on the subject:

Measuring Basics - Body Shop Business

Bear in mind that for insurance work on late model body-on-frame vehicles, the unspoken tolerance is 5-7 mm. Older vehicles are rarely even within 1/4" over the length of the chassis. This is accumulated variances of length, width, and height, and on modern unibodies the spec is 1-3mm. Yikes!

I have measured just as many vehicles without computerized measuring systems as with. My structural repairs are well accepted. I confidently tell people if their frame "is OK" or not because I've studied and applied the knowledge successfully for years. However I don't splice frames, nobody ever asked me to. So the metallurgy and integrity of such is not my bag, but I'm just offering up some measuring coaching because thats what I can do.
 
#3,241 ·
I made a giant mistake when I did my first sub. I assumed both frames I was working with were straight and undamaged so I just took my measurements from the jig holes and didn't use a center line. Well, one wheel wasn't centered in the wheel well when the fender got put on. It wasn't until I ran a center line that I found one rail had been bent in around where the rear door pillar was. Something like this couldn't happen your case though I don't running over it with a bulldozer could bend that frame in the middle.
The Camaro that I got my sub out of didn't have any sheet metal at all on it (that's why I picked it, less work) if it did I would have looked closer because one rail was up about a 1/2 " it wasn't worth fixing so I got another one. Glad I caught that one. Common enough mistakes anyone could make but need to be watchful of. nobody wants to find out a frame was bent AFTER its all done and cant be aligned. You got to remember, these subs are about 30 yrs old most all of them have been in an accident, heck its tough to find a 5yr old car that hasn't been in an accident. Running a few reference lines before getting started isn't complicated and can save a lot of grief.
 
#3,242 ·
You know, the only centerline I used was the center holes in the sub cross members. Before I cut anything off the sub, I cross measured it from corner to corner as well as corners to the center holes. I also cross measured the convertible frame at several places and it was good also. On top of that, I ran a line from bottom king pin to bottom king pin on the floor and marked that.

I tacked the the sub into position today. The lower ball joints and spindle nuts match the convertible marks plummed on the floor And the front frame horn holes and center hole in the cross member all cross measure to the body mounts on the convertible frame within 1/32". Also, a 4' carpenter square reads exactly the same at 4 locations, 2 on the convertible and 2 on the sub. If it isn't right, I don't know what else I could have done.

I would be willing to bet money, This frame will be closer than the body. Will it need to be shimmed? Of course it will.:D
John







 
#3,246 ·
Hey guys. Thought I would drop in for a quick update. I wish I had more shop time but life has to be lived.:D

I made the ouside plates and welded them in.



Next I made gussets to go inside the plates for rigidity. I have them welded in on both sides.



The templates are made for the inside plates and top plates and hope to get started cutting them out tomorrow.



The plasma cutter has sure payed for itself during this process. This is a picture of the gussets I cut out to go inside the frame rails. This would have been a major job with a cut off disc or band saw.

John

 
#3,249 ·
I will have to fab new ones for sure. That is ok because the factory ones are really ugly. On a convertible their main function is to keep the door from sagging. They actually pull down instead of supporting weight.

I am going to paint the frame a semi gloss black using SPI Epoxy as soon as it comes back from blasting. Then I am going to finish the bottom of the floor pans and paint them. After the body and frame are mated and shimmed I will fab the front body mounts. One other thing to consider is I have to fabricate those mounts around the big block. Motor mounts, transmission crossmember as well as body mounts will have to be made.

Touch up of the frame will be required but with the semi gloss I think I can do an acceptable job of it. I do not want to take this thing back of the frame again once it is shimmed.

John

 
#3,250 ·
Getting the frame blasted is a great mile post. Next pictures should be of a semi gloss black frame. I am going to put 2-3 wet coats of SPI black epoxy primer on it, fill any rust pits with a thin wipe of Rage Ultra and another couple of coats of black epoxy.

The blaster did a really good job. It is exciting to see it in the basement all clean.:)

John











Hopefully I am just a couple of weeks from getting back to the body. After all, that is what this thread is about. It will be exciting though to see some paint on this chassis and have it waiting for the body. :thumbup:

John
 
#3,258 ·
Actually the bottom of the floors only have paint on the panels I epoxied before I installed them. I will have to touch up some welding and fill in some very small patches. Once I have that done and the welds ground from the bottom I will put at least 2 wet coats of epoxy on it, sand that with 400 and one more coat of epoxy then shoot it with SS Red urethane.

Of course a red Scotch brite pad could be used instead of the 400. Also, the Epoxy primer has a seven day window where it will not require sanding but I personally do not work fast enough nor have a good enough paint booth to make that work. Most likely I will have to sand it, shoot one more coat of epoxy and paint.

Bare in mind, I am not building a show car. I want the frame to be a smooth satin black and the bottom of the body to be shiney red paint but this old girl will not see trailer time nor will there be mirrors under it. My goal is to make sure who ever buys this car can put it on a rack and know the are buying a quality car that will still be a good investment ten years after they buy it.

John
 
#3,259 ·
I just bought SPI 2k epoxy and I don't think you need to sand it after it sits past the cure date. I was on their forum and it seems most just spray another coat of epoxy and then paint.

I am looking for top coat paint right now in a single stage and will have that on hand when the time and weather are right for the epoxy. The goal would be to follow thru with the top coat within a couple days and be done with the underside.
 
#3,261 ·
Your epoxy plan sounds good to me, John :thumbup: I am amazed at how many different epoxy scenarios pop up here. The tech sheet on that stuff is long and informative though.

Sanding rather than scuffing (where possible) prior to applying the final coatings will result in a more professional (valuable-looking ;)) underside than scuffing alone. It adds o's to your smooooth. :cool:
 
#3,262 ·
The 53 sat about 18 months ,but is was sanded a couple days after priming,when I got ready to paint it wipped down with G/W remover shot a coat of epoxy and shot paint,,the 55 1st design on the frame machine sat about 2 years it turned out great,mabe we were just lucky,i would follow manf suggestions,Barry has put a LOT of time into application process for his paint,:rolleyes:

John your work amazes me every time you start a new step in your project,:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
 

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#3,263 ·
Today we ran over the chassis with a DA and 80 grit paper to clean the silicon dust off of it and got 2 good wet coats of SPI epoxy on it. It has about the right amount of sheen for my tast. It is good to know Barry puts UV protection in it allowing people to use it as a chassis black if they so desire.

I am going to the Cleveland cruise in tomorrow but would love to get home in time to flip the chassis over and paint the bottom as well as the suspension parts.

The next step will be to go over the frame rails with a thin coat of Body filler to get rid of some of the rust pits, blemishes, and other eye sores. Fortunately for me the top is the worst by far and that won't show once the body is back on it.

John






 
#3,269 ·
Today we ran over the chassis with a DA and 80 grit paper to clean the silicon dust off of it and got 2 good wet coats of SPI epoxy on it. It has about the right amount of sheen for my tast. It is good to know Barry puts UV protection in it allowing people to use it as a chassis black if they so desire.



John, in this pic theres what looks like a piece of plywood leaning against the wall that looks like a wheel arch pattern cut out of it, is that what it is or are my eyes deceiving me again? Top left corner
 
#3,266 ·
Agreed:)



It does look great! :cool: And I bet it sure is satisfying to look at. Its like you're standing on third base now, looking for a hit. :mwink: Go gitum.

What little filler work you mentioned will go a long way towards a pro look. I'd squirm knowing the pits were still there too. Nice work, sir. :)
The worst thing about leaving the pits is you will never get it to look clean again. You can wash a smooth surface but if it is rough or pitted you will never get it to look fresh and clean again.

John
 
#3,265 ·
It does look great! :cool: And I bet it sure is satisfying to look at. Its like you're standing on third base now, looking for a hit. :mwink: Go gitum.

What little filler work you mentioned will go a long way towards a pro look. I'd squirm knowing the pits were still there too. Nice work, sir. :)
 
#3,267 ·
It seems my garage time has been a little scarce lately but I have managed to mud the frame within the 7 day window of opportunity and also prime the rest of the suspension parts. It is about 50 percent sanded at this point and will need another couple of coats of epoxy, one more sanding and a final coat or two.

It is going to make a good solid OEM looking chassis.

John





 
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