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Old 05-27-2013, 04:22 PM
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600+ horsepower sbc

I'm sure it's been addressed several times in this forum, but I can't seem to find the posts or correct keywords for the search. So I ask...

If one wanted to build a somewhat streetable, pump gas/octane boost aided, cast iron small block chevy with over 600 horses, how would you do it? What cid? Blown, Turbo, or Naturally aspirated? Aluminum heads I suspect. Keep a budget of sorts in mind. More than $5k is fine, but $25k is a bit out of hand.

Would you build a big block and forego the extra weight? For that matter, what is the weight difference between a BBC and SBC?

Just gaining thoughts and knowledge. Any and all suggestions welcomed and appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
Racer Rex

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Old 05-27-2013, 05:06 PM
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It's a no brainer if you want it streetable, IMO a very low compression build, say 7.5:1 along with a turbo or supercharger, with a shot of NOS in reserve. With a respectable budget, why an iron block? Count of splayed mains and top notch machine work.
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Old 05-27-2013, 05:15 PM
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Iron block because I have a .30 over 400 block on hand. Ran a 406 in my stock cars. Any other block would be an added cost. The thought of nitrous scares me, but many use it with good results. Just not sure it's for me. Not sure I'm coordinated enough to hit the button at the right time either. How are blowers for long drives (150-200 miles)?
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Old 05-27-2013, 05:31 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
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Lmao, you're not going to do it for long with your .030" over stock 400 block.

Essentially you don't have a block.

For a cheap 500hp slap a turbo and cam on a stock Ls engine of your choice, even the 4.8l can get there pretty easily. Total cost when done right will be between 2 and 5 grand depending on what you do.
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Old 05-27-2013, 05:41 PM
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I did a ton of research before building my current combo. Over 675HP at the crank

421 SBC
Dart Block. Pistons are .004" in the whole.
Callies Dragon Slayer Forged crank 3.875". SFI Balancer, SFI Billet flywheel.
Callies forged rods
Probe forged pistons 10.8:1 SCR, 8.5:1 DCR .043"quench
Lunati 60133 solid roller cam and lifters. 247/253*@0.050", .632/.644" lift 110LSA, 4* advanced
1.65 Scorpion Rockers and stud girdle.
Manley .120 wall push rods.
Airwolf 220 heads Flow 312cfm @ max lift
Ported Hurricane plus intake
Powerjection III fuel injection.
1 7/8" to 2" stepped headers, Magnaflow "X", 3" pipes, afterburner mufflers.
Electric water pump and fan. No smog or cats.

Could be built with a similar spec hydraulic roller, SCAT forged crank and rods and an 850 carb for less than $7K. Fuel injection makes it a lot more streetable. I've got over $10K in it now including the fuel injection, but no where near $25K.

Idles at 1000rpms. Drives great in traffic or at the track. Shift at 7300rpms. I drift and road race it often. Broad torque curve. I have been very happy with the 421.

Or you could pay for a turn key 400sbc form Bryce at Dr.j's performance that will make over 600Hp with a hydraulic roller for $9K
http://www.j-performance.com/index.p...ask=view&id=37

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Old 05-27-2013, 05:49 PM
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Perhaps my mention of stock cars was a tad misleading. I have a disassembled 406 that I ran in my asphalt late model stock car (oval track). With the 390 cfm carb we were limited to I managed close to 500 hp from the combination I ran. I know I can't run that same motor on the street, but my point is that in a more streetable configuration (cam), even with the added hp, I suspect the block should be just fine.

At any rate, my motor "plan" will end up in a late 30's Chevy and a turbo, in that combo, just seems too out of place for my tastes..

Thank you for your thoughts and suggestions though. I'll take them to heart. And since most of you know more than me about rodding and motors, I'll listen.
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:27 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
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Turbos were around then... And the sbc wasn't... So what's really out of place?

Stock 400 blocks are notorious for problems you can probably get 600hp out of it but no promise of it lasting. A Ls engine is better in pretty much every way but it's definitely out of place. My next suggestion would be a turbo on an older engine with more displacement and durability. A simple 10psi on a 454 could easily hit your goals.

For street able power you need boost and turbos are the easiest, cheapest, and most efficient way of getting it, but it won't have the look you want.

As far as looks go, nothing can be more boron than yet ANOTHER sbc swap. An inline 6 would be pretty awesome though.
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ap72 View Post
Turbos were around then... And the sbc wasn't... So what's really out of place?
Touche' Point taken

Just looking for a semi-traditional hot rod with a small block. Boring I know, but for my first, and probably only rod, it's what I want. If I were on project 6 or 7 I'd do things a little different. Sticking with what I know the most about, however little that may be.

Big block isn't out of the question, but I'm concerned about the weight and fit. What is the weight difference?
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:46 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
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Go with a Cadillac 500. Weight difference is negligible from a sbc but they have their own problems. Most factory blocks that old have design or casting flaws. I'd definitely go boost and go as modern as you can on the blower, the designs of the past decade are far beyond anything from the 70s.

Going cheap and using a factory block that old is going to mean questionable reliability at best though. So be aware.

Guys run $500 junkyard 5.3l past 700hp on bone stock long blocks and if they pop they just swap it out for another. Your plans won't really allow for that.
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:48 PM
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My engine,slightly less power than Landshark:
434 dart block/dart 227 heads
256/264 solid roller
10.75:1
vic Jr intake/950 holley HP
rocker shafts with 1.6/1.5
NOTE: 1 7/8 stepped 2 inch headers
My cam makes peak power at a mild 6500 RPM (6470 on the dyno)
idles @ 950-1000 breaks the tires loose in 1st and second with out dumping the clutch,using 3.50 gears.
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:52 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
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The engines laid out are good too but notice neither uses a factory block nor is cheap they used good parts.
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:54 PM
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Old 05-27-2013, 10:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Landshark928 View Post
I did a ton of research before building my current combo. Over 675HP at the crank

421 SBC
Dart Block. Pistons are .004" in the whole.
Callies Dragon Slayer Forged crank 3.875". SFI Balancer, SFI Billet flywheel.
Callies forged rods
Probe forged pistons 10.8:1 SCR, 8.5:1 DCR .043"quench
Lunati 60133 solid roller cam and lifters. 247/253*@0.050", .632/.644" lift 110LSA, 4* advanced
1.65 Scorpion Rockers and stud girdle.
Manley .120 wall push rods.
Airwolf 220 heads Flow 312cfm @ max lift
Ported Hurricane plus intake
Powerjection III fuel injection.
1 7/8" to 2" stepped headers, Magnaflow "X", 3" pipes, afterburner mufflers.
Electric water pump and fan. No smog or cats.

Could be built with a similar spec hydraulic roller, SCAT forged crank and rods and an 850 carb for less than $7K. Fuel injection makes it a lot more streetable. I've got over $10K in it now including the fuel injection, but no where near $25K.

Idles at 1000rpms. Drives great in traffic or at the track. Shift at 7300rpms. I drift and road race it often. Broad torque curve. I have been very happy with the 421.

Or you could pay for a turn key 400sbc form Bryce at Dr.j's performance that will make over 600Hp with a hydraulic roller for $9K
Dr J's Performance - Small Block Chevy Street Bruiser Engines
Just curious and off topic, but i was looking into that powerjection III but it says its good for 500hp.what did you have to do to make it good for 600+? Pm me the info if you could..
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Old 05-27-2013, 10:27 PM
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PJIII has 2 limiting factors.
1. Stock pump
2. Stock injectors

Rated at 550HP stock, turn the fuel pressure up from 43.5 to 65psi and you're good for 600HP, assuming you also go with the larger pump or swap in a walbro 255L HP (GSL392)

I run dual walbros and 80# injectors @ 60spi. TB is rated up to 930cfm, so my set up now can go much higher.

FAST has a new TB set up rated to 1200HP. I picked the PJIII since it had easy self learning but also the ability to unlock the programming and go in deep if you want. It is also the only stand alone TB system that is boost and nitrous ready out of the box. I run a 200HP nitrous hit at the track with my PJIII. Works great.
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Old 05-27-2013, 10:36 PM
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200 nitrous

Quote:
Originally Posted by Landshark928 View Post
PJIII has 2 limiting factors.
1. Stock pump
2. Stock injectors

Rated at 550HP stock, turn the fuel pressure up from 43.5 to 65psi and you're good for 600HP, assuming you also go with the larger pump or swap in a walbro 255L HP (GSL392)

I run dual walbros and 80# injectors @ 60spi. TB is rated up to 930cfm, so my set up now can go much higher.

FAST has a new TB set up rated to 1200HP. I picked the PJIII since it had easy self learning but also the ability to unlock the programming and go in deep if you want. It is also the only stand alone TB system that is boost and nitrous ready out of the box. I run a 200HP nitrous hit at the track with my PJIII. Works great.
thats what a little volkswagen needs! 200 shot on top of 600 plus.How many MPG does it get @WFO?
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