67' mustang with 71 cougar 302, temp maxing out after a 10 minute cruise - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
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Old 10-14-2008, 05:38 AM
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67' mustang with 71 cougar 302, temp maxing out after a 10 minute cruise

Recently got my 67' mustang back together and moved from Wisconsin to Ohio. I drove it 470 miles, and aside from breaking the kickdown cable, everything was great..except I drove the entire trip with the heater maxed to keep the car from overheating. It has a '71 mercury cougar 302 in it, Edelbrock RPM performer intake, 600cfm edelbrock 4bbl carb, no ac, mechanical engine fan. To make matters worse, One of the transmission cooler line fittings on the stock radiator broke, so the trans is now using a standalone cooler mounted in front of part of the radiator. My question is, I've seen radiator flush fluid, is this worth trying? I've changed the coolant, doesn't help. Would a new water pump help? New radiator? (P.S. the temp transducer is new, when I put the new intake on.

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Old 10-14-2008, 06:03 AM
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Does the fan have a shroud?If it doesn't, I would put one on. What size pulleys are the pump and crank? Having a smaller pump pulley and larger crank pulley will give you an overdrive on the pump. That will increase flow at lower and higher speeds. If the radiator is stock, maybe having it cleaned would be a good idea. Also check the thermostat, going to a Robert Shaw or any hi-po t-stat may help. They open farther than a stock t-stat, which will increase flow as well.
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:08 AM
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Hrm

Well, by "fan" I should have said, large fan blades, bolted to the front of the engine. No it's not shrouded, stock (I think) pulleys, and no thermostat (because I wasn't paying attention when I put the new intake on, and the old one didn't have one in it either). My initial thoughts were to flush the radiator and remove the fan blades from the motor, and install a high CFM (~2,000?) electric puller to the backside of the radiator.
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:13 AM
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Put a thermostat in it..........with no stat, the flow is too fast and it doesn't have time to cool in the rad.

Also, if it had a shroud stock, put one on.
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:21 AM
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Heh

Heh, thanks I'll get a thermostat in there, I just assumed (go me) that it wouldn't be a problem, since I wasn't going to drive it once it got cold out. The car didn't have a shroud when I got it, there are about 3-4" between the rad and the blades, So I think I'll start with the thermostat plan and see where that gets me, thanks again!
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:44 AM
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Had the same problem once on an early Dodge van. Replaced the slant six with a 318 out of an identical van. After banging my head against the wall trying everything in the world to get it to cool, I went back to the wrecking yard and scouted up the fan shroud off the donor van (it had already been removed when I bought the engine.) Viola .... problem gone!

Good luck!
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:46 AM
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Running without a t-stat and having the bypass open is why the motor got hot. The bypass hose is the small hose from the manifold to the top of the water pump. It's just a loop of coolant going from the pump to the motor, never seeing the radiator. So without the thermostat in and the bypass open , you were diverting most of the coolant to the bypass and not the radiator. like Ponch said, put the t-stat back in.
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:51 AM
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Nice

Picking up the t-stat from Napa today, and I ordered a new shroud from NPDLink, I could have gotten a junker one probably, but my policy has been, "If it breaks, replace it with something shiny", e.g. tranny cooling lines / fuel hardline are now "racing" flex stainless steel lines, given this car's age (and the fact that it started life in Alaska), it's seems like the best policy =) The main problem I've had is, this is the first car I've actually worked on, so when things are missing (and/or not correct) I don't always notice until waaay later.
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Old 10-14-2008, 06:58 AM
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agree with poncho,
step #1 is put a 190* stock stat in it to balance the gpm flow...

step #2 is test to tell what the true actual temp is (is your 67' oem guage still reading/calibrated correct?)....

(ex: on my 65' vintage oem no numbers guage, 180* is dead center but when the needle is at the full hot 7/8th's line it is only 195-200*'s and that's not to hot at all)

$5? Walmart "stick in the turkey" oven thermometer...
motor cold, remove the cap and put the thermometer so it's into the coolant....
when the thermostat does open the flow will go from a babbling brook to a river worth of flow so you can know the temp that it is opening reading the thermometer and compare to the guage needle....
temp won't climb to the hot line, block off just some of the rad air flow with a piece of cardboard....

step #3, if it was running hot on the highway triple check that your ign timing total (base + centrifugal + vacuum advance) is correct....

my $.02
don't use a rad flush on a old car...
alot of the deposits were formed due to "electrolysis" and "if" the flush does remove them you are exposing a now thinner/weaker spot to corrode more sooner and cause a leak....
classic common scenario: flush a radiator and then heater core springs a nasty leak (because it has no ground to slow the electrolysis from day one)
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Old 10-14-2008, 07:04 AM
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The gauge may well be messed up, because it's the wrong engine, the thermostat that was in it originally didn't read properly at all (not sure if it was just dead, or if there is an actual difference, so I got the sender for a 67'). 3) Good idea, but the timing marks are basically invisible, even after spending a long time trying to clean them up, and the timing pointer simply isn't there. I set the timing by ear essentially, it idles smooth (in both park and gear) and doesn't backfire/skip going to WOT or coming off it, so I assume(there I go assuming again) that it's "close" to the correct timing. Eventually, I'll get a new gauge cluster (or just new gauges that fit in the old cluster) and a replacement timing pointer. And yeah, it was running just below the top end of the temp gauge on the highway, it was about 80f outside, with the heater on, going ~70mph. That being said, with no t-stat in, regardless of how fast I was going, it would have run hot, correct?

Edit: Didn't think about the issues flushing could cause in regards to causing a leak, but it makes TOTAL sense now that you mentioned it, thank you!
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Old 10-14-2008, 09:21 AM
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Also make sure you have a 50/50 mix of coolant and water.Pure water or pure coolant will also make it run hot.
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Old 10-14-2008, 01:08 PM
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Should have known it wouldn't be that easy

Update: Installed the t-stat, new fluid 50/50 concentration, gauge goes all the way to 'H' after idling for 10 minutes. I guess step two is to wait for the fan shroud, and while I'm waiting, check the temp while driving, and get some kind of direct temp sensor in place to verify the actual temperature, thanks for all the responses, I'm pretty sure the answer is in there somewhere, I guess I should be glad that I can actually drive it, since it did run for 8 hours non-stop with the heater on max
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Old 10-14-2008, 01:37 PM
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Get one of those long skinny cooking thermometers to stick down the filler neck and double check the temperature. You might be fretting over nothing if the dash gauge is misleading you.

But you probably do need a shroud to help pull air through the radiator when idling. At highway speeds a shroud might not make much difference, but can make a big difference when idling or at slow speeds in warm weather.
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Old 10-14-2008, 03:29 PM
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one of my friend owned 2002 mustang and his temp gauge would read very high. It turn out the 302 block needed to connect a ground wire to the frame, because current was flowing through the metal pipe to the temp gauge causing the pipe to heat up.
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Old 10-17-2008, 07:09 AM
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It's running fine

Got the meat thermometer and let the car heat up, dash gauge was all the way to H and the the thermometer wasn't even registering (under 100f). So I took it out, left the heater off, and drove the car pretty hard, on the highway, on normal roads, long WOT pulls to 6k rpm. Hour later, gauge still maxed, car didn't explode, radiator cap didn't blow, so I think I'm good
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