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-   -   700R4 Problem (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/700r4-problem-210991.html)

muffmaned 12-26-2011 09:24 AM

700R4 Problem
 
I`m a New Member, Old Rodder, I have a Nice 1961 FORD STARLINER and have had a 700 R4 installed in lieu of the standard "Cruiseomatic". The Car has the "401" engine in it. 4:11 Gears .
The problem is that it seems to either go thru a half gear or is slipping from 2nd to 3rd. I can`t stand this. I want it to go 1,2,3,4. It acts like it`s going thru
5 gears. I`ve been told that it`s in the "Lockup". I don`t understand what this means, What is a "lockup?"
What can I do to get this to shift right?
Thanks
Ed
fsd2@cox.net

Prof. T. Soggmeyer 12-26-2011 09:45 AM

700r4
 
The 700r4 should lock-up in 4th gear (stock set up). The torque converter is locked in by a solenoid when the trans is in 4th. There is a switch inside the trans that triggers this. This trans needs 12v key on power to operate. There should also be a vacuum switch that is in that hot wire to only allow it to lock under vacuum. This is a stock set up. You can put a kit in it to let you manually
lock it in 2nd and 3rd. I just did mine with a tci kit this way. I also put a little l.e.d. light between the manual switch and ground just for kicks. There is plenty of info here for you to check out. Hope this helps..Brad

T-bucket23 12-26-2011 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muffmaned
I`m a New Member, Old Rodder, I have a Nice 1961 FORD STARLINER and have had a 700 R4 installed in lieu of the standard "Cruiseomatic". The Car has the "401" engine in it. 4:11 Gears .
The problem is that it seems to either go thru a half gear or is slipping from 2nd to 3rd. I can`t stand this. I want it to go 1,2,3,4. It acts like it`s going thru
5 gears. I`ve been told that it`s in the "Lockup". I don`t understand what this means, What is a "lockup?"
What can I do to get this to shift right?
Thanks
Ed
fsd2@cox.net

i am not a transmission guy by any stretch of the imagination but just from being around this stuff it seems that a lot of the issues are in the TV cable adjustment. If it is incorrect it will shift wrong and burn up the transmission in short order. There are several threads on this adjustment and I believe it gets trickier with retrofits.

adantessr 12-26-2011 11:57 AM

1 Attachment(s)
The factory recommended adjustment of the 700R4 TV cable is as follows. Hold the throttle at wide open by what ever means available. Easiest to have somebody hold the go pedal to the floor. Depress the tab on the TV cable adjustment and tighten the cable until all the free travel is gone. I mean 'tight' . If it shifts too hard for your liking from 1st to 2nd, you can loosen the cable (very slightly), I mean, don't go more than 1/16" at a time. It is very sensitive. I attached the wiring diagram for manual control of the lockup converter. Don't forget to ground (pin D). :embarrass :sweat: :confused: :thumbup: It works fantastic great in my T-bucket. BTW Since neither you nor I are using a factory GM brake light switch, a 5 pin relay works great. Let me know if you need help wiring the relay. But if you have any electrical knowledge at all, you won't need my help.

adantessr 12-26-2011 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prof. T. Soggmeyer
The 700r4 should lock-up in 4th gear (stock set up). The torque converter is locked in by a solenoid when the trans is in 4th. There is a switch inside the trans that triggers this. This trans needs 12v key on power to operate. There should also be a vacuum switch that is in that hot wire to only allow it to lock under vacuum. This is a stock set up. You can put a kit in it to let you manually
lock it in 2nd and 3rd. I just did mine with a tci kit this way. I also put a little l.e.d. light between the manual switch and ground just for kicks. There is plenty of info here for you to check out. Hope this helps..Brad


Good info there, Prof. I wired mine up with a LED lighted rocker switch. :cool:

Overdriv 12-26-2011 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muffmaned
I`m a New Member, Old Rodder, I have a Nice 1961 FORD STARLINER and have had a 700 R4 installed in lieu of the standard "Cruiseomatic". The Car has the "401" engine in it. 4:11 Gears .
The problem is that it seems to either go thru a half gear or is slipping from 2nd to 3rd. I can`t stand this. I want it to go 1,2,3,4. It acts like it`s going thru
5 gears. I`ve been told that it`s in the "Lockup". I don`t understand what this means, What is a "lockup?"
What can I do to get this to shift right?
Thanks
Ed
fsd2@cox.net

All the info above is good. But you must assure you have the correct geometry on the carb linkage. There are many threads in the section on this very subject just search on 700R4.

Also, the 700R4 should shift three times and then the converter clutch should lock, which will feel like a 4th shift. Sometimes the 3rd shift and the converter clutch will lock nearly at the same time, so you might not feel the lockup.

Try this thread first.

Good luck and come back with more questions and don't forget to post when you get it going correctly.

Oh, Welcome too!

joshp83 12-26-2011 05:13 PM

tv cable setting is definally important the lock up drops rpms about 300 rpms by locking the torque converter directly to the transmission elemating slippage it is done electricly unless a mechanical lock up conversion has been done .Under normal driving it should shift about 2500 rpm give or take afew rpms like mentioned in the aboved post you have to hsave the correct tv linage and adjustment

revspan 12-31-2011 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adantessr
The factory recommended adjustment of the 700R4 TV cable is as follows. Hold the throttle at wide open by what ever means available. Easiest to have somebody hold the go pedal to the floor. Depress the tab on the TV cable adjustment and tighten the cable until all the free travel is gone. I mean 'tight' . If it shifts too hard for your liking from 1st to 2nd, you can loosen the cable (very slightly), I mean, don't go more than 1/16" at a time. It is very sensitive. I attached the wiring diagram for manual control of the lockup converter. Don't forget to ground (pin D). :embarrass :sweat: :confused: :thumbup: It works fantastic great in my T-bucket. BTW Since neither you nor I are using a factory GM brake light switch, a 5 pin relay works great. Let me know if you need help wiring the relay. But if you have any electrical knowledge at all, you won't need my help.

so...under normal operation, when you use this lockup system, you will only lock up in 4th gear?

BTW, thanks for the information.

adantessr 12-31-2011 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revspan
so...under normal operation, when you use this lockup system, you will only lock up in 4th gear?

BTW, thanks for the information.

If you have it wired up through a toggle switch like I do, it will lockup in 3rd speed also, maybe even 2nd. Not sure on that, but it will lockup in 3rd for sure. I have driven with the switch on and it does suffer on acceleration because of not having the torque converter letting the rpm come up, and it also shifts harder. The 5 pin relay has a wiring schematic of the internal wiring of the relay embossed on the side of it, so betwee the wiring diagram I attached and that, you can't go wrong with even a little electrical knowledge. The reason that you want the relay in there is so that the torque converter unlocks when you apply the brakes, even with the switch on. Big Al

Overdriv 01-01-2012 08:23 AM

1 Attachment(s)
If you want 4th gear lockup only, Go here.

This is the most desirable setup for completely automatic operation of the TCC.

Or if you want more control of the TCC, which is more desirable to me check out the picture below.

ETA: the references to switch locations and wire colors is for my application only. Yours will differ depending on how you do it. Good Luck!

Happy New Year!

revspan 01-01-2012 08:43 AM

Relay needed?
 
The first schematic shows no relay used, the second one shows a relay. Does the current draw demand a relay? Either way is fine for me...just don't want to overcomplicate it if it isn't needed.

Overdriv 01-01-2012 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revspan
The first schematic shows no relay used, the second one shows a relay. Does the current draw demand a relay? Either way is fine for me...just don't want to overcomplicate it if it isn't needed.

Who are you talking too?

revspan 01-01-2012 10:20 AM

oops, I looked closer at your post(ovrdrv), and now see that the relay in your drawing is not part of the transmission TC lockout. Sorry, I should have looked closer.

Overdriv 01-01-2012 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revspan
oops, I looked closer at your post(ovrdrv), and now see that the relay in your drawing is not part of the transmission TC lockout. Sorry, I should have looked closer.

The inline photo of my wiring for the TCC does indeed use a relay as does the WiKi linked diagram.

One could do it without a relay but I've found a relay helps unload the switches and lets you use smaller wiring in your control section. Each to his own, I prefer to use relay for nearly everything these days.

dieselnut 01-12-2012 10:56 PM

my vehicle is completely stripped of all the "factory" electrical stuff. everything is on switches now, the "brake" switch has a normaly closed switch but when you press down on the brake pedal it goes to an open switch, any reason why i shouldnt wire my tcc through that switch?


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