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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2005, 03:27 PM
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And if it explodes, it's like shrapnel.

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2005, 05:23 PM
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In my shop, I run Black iron and galvanized pipe ( I got most of the supplies ( Black Iron ) at Home Depot but when I needed some more, local hardwares don't carry it, and I wasn't running an hour for a couple couplers and 1 4" peice. I run half inch. I have 2 good regulators on the 2 inside supplys, the outside 1 dosn't have a regulator yet. It is only an 8'X8' shed. There is 1 big diffrence between PVC and metal black iron and galv pipe. PVC is NOT ANSI rated for air use at all, the pipe is rated for 150 PSI of compressed air, and it will say that on any sticker ( on the pipe ) and every coupler or peice of hardware that is made in black iron or galvanized pipe right under the size..
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2005, 05:50 PM
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Matt, plus that iron pipe don't give a hoot how hot or cold it is and you would have to be pretty dang careless to knock a hole in it and even if you did all it would do is leak.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2005, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldred
Matt, plus that iron pipe don't give a hoot how hot or cold it is and you would have to be pretty dang careless to knock a hole in it and even if you did all it would do is leak.
I found it easy to assemble also.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2005, 07:19 PM
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Oldred:
I didn't even notice the dates on the messages beginning this thread until after I saw your reply. I thought it was a new version of the old PVC airline argument.

One thing included in that OSHA document gave me a grin. It was an interoffice memo from Eslon Thermoplastics, Inc. to "The Eslon Sales Force":

Quote:
The dangers involved in using rigid vinyl piping products for compressed air transport are well known in our industry. Numerous disclaimer bulletins and letters have been circulated for almost three decades. It will not surprise you to learn that our government has just recently recognized the problem.

Attached you will find a copy of a memorandum that was issued by the "U.S. Dept. of Labor, Occupation Safety & Health Administration" (OSHA). You may wish to give copies to your customers and any other interested party. The government has finally made this danger "official."
[bold added]

Ain't that the way it goes?
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 09-30-2005, 03:44 PM
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copper

I was just reading all these great posts as I am looking for suggestions for a nice air system. I was looking at garage-pak.com which offers a very nice looking system. However, I have no problem installing copper and it may be a bit cheaper. Anyone have any guidance for selecting the hardware and pipes? Are there different types of copper tubes? Any have good luck with this type of system?

Anyone know of any other purpose made airline products?

A few things to consider from the systems I have built and used before:
1) Not all iron pipes are the same. Make sure to get cold rolled (black) pipe and have it cut and threaded at the hardware store. The danger for other pipes is the type of seam used and some are not appropriate for pressurized systems (ie: galvanized pipe)
2) I had a cold rolled system in my last house and not looking forward to debugging another system (leaks, service connections, etc). One leak in the middle and you are spending hours tearing into the system to reach it one threaded pipe at a time. Take your time with each connection and test often! Once you get it right, it will last for ever.
3) Any vertical run should ALWAYS have a tee connection for your tools and have the vertical line continue to a lower point where you can put in a valve to cleanout occasionally. This trap will take most of the moisture out of the air. I rarely had water in my filters and never in my paint. Use a 30 or 45 degree angle to allow the water to spray away from the wall otherwise you may stain the wall!
4) PVC Ė please donít. My first system was a nice PVC system in a shop about 12 years ago with drains and all. We even had it inside the wall in our tool room, pretty sweet. A section in the wall exploded after about 1 year of professional use (12 hr days @ 100 psi). It was inside a wall and luckily only split open but the noise had my ears ringing for a while and gave me a new respect for the forces at work. We had even picked PVC that was rated at 400psi and chose fittings that were air rated and like others thought that was sufficient.

Any info on copper would be great!
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Old 09-30-2005, 03:57 PM
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quick comment

I should clarify, by galvanized pipe I meant to describe electrical conduit - it's not suitable for air pressure. Other types of galvanized pipe might be if its rated as such.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 09-30-2005, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcederquist
I should clarify, by galvanized pipe I meant to describe electrical conduit - it's not suitable for air pressure. Other types of galvanized pipe might be if its rated as such.
Right, the Black iron and Galvanized pipe that threads togther are both ANSI rated for 150 PSI air preassure. I recently put the system I have in, and I used both types in the system, mostly because of the availability of black iron compared to galvanized, galvanized is everywhere, black iron is hard to find in small towns, and some fittings I needed, I could not find in Black iron so I got in galv.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2005, 09:31 AM
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air lines,, pvc or not

Hey,,
I used sch40 in my shop in Washington state for 9 yrs. without a hitch, The shop was heated had all the drains at each down pipe used a flex line from comp. to hard line never had a problem.. Moved to AZ brought it all with me. The sap that bought my place up there can just bite me.. whole different story..
Keep it simple, get the drains in the low points and you'll be happy.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2005, 01:41 PM
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Added to Hotrodders Knowledge Base

This discussion has been added to the Garage - Tools Discussions category of the Hotrodders Knowledge Base.

Also, the article from Oldsmobility.com has been added to the Garage - Tools Articles section of the Knowledge Base. Thanks RetroJoe for posting the link . I've reviewed the links posted by grouch too -- good research. The relevant sections are quoted in this discussion, so I didn't think it necessary to add each individual one to the Knowledge Base.

--For the main page of the Hotrodders Knowledge Base, click here.

--For more information on the Hotrodders Knowledge Base, click here.

--For information on becoming a Hotrodders Knowledge Base Editor, click here.
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 12-08-2005, 07:38 PM
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the one everyone misses if you like it is the overhead line(s) for a retactable air hose keeps it off the gound and clean and a 50' hose has a long reach whenits in the center of the work area

i love drop lights ,air and electric coming down from the ceiling if the shop is tall enouph

and their relatvly cheap at harbor freight

SR66

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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 12-08-2005, 09:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcederquist
I was just reading all these great posts as I am looking for suggestions for a nice air system. I was looking at garage-pak.com which offers a very nice looking system. However, I have no problem installing copper and it may be a bit cheaper. Anyone have any guidance for selecting the hardware and pipes? Are there different types of copper tubes? Any have good luck with this type of system?

Anyone know of any other purpose made airline products?

A few things to consider from the systems I have built and used before:
1) Not all iron pipes are the same. Make sure to get cold rolled (black) pipe and have it cut and threaded at the hardware store. The danger for other pipes is the type of seam used and some are not appropriate for pressurized systems (ie: galvanized pipe)
2) I had a cold rolled system in my last house and not looking forward to debugging another system (leaks, service connections, etc). One leak in the middle and you are spending hours tearing into the system to reach it one threaded pipe at a time. Take your time with each connection and test often! Once you get it right, it will last for ever.
3) Any vertical run should ALWAYS have a tee connection for your tools and have the vertical line continue to a lower point where you can put in a valve to cleanout occasionally. This trap will take most of the moisture out of the air. I rarely had water in my filters and never in my paint. Use a 30 or 45 degree angle to allow the water to spray away from the wall otherwise you may stain the wall!
4) PVC ? please don?t. My first system was a nice PVC system in a shop about 12 years ago with drains and all. We even had it inside the wall in our tool room, pretty sweet. A section in the wall exploded after about 1 year of professional use (12 hr days @ 100 psi). It was inside a wall and luckily only split open but the noise had my ears ringing for a while and gave me a new respect for the forces at work. We had even picked PVC that was rated at 400psi and chose fittings that were air rated and like others thought that was sufficient.

Any info on copper would be great!
I ran copper from my compressor in the basement closet to the garage and all through my basement shop.. It works great!
There are two kinds of copper pipe at most stores, Home Depot and Menards ect.
The thin wall I believe has blue lettering on it and the heavy wall has red and sometimes black lettering.
Once you know there are two types it is easy to tell just by looking, the heavy stuff is usually a dollar more per length but well worth the extra money IMHO

When you clamp the copper pipes to the wall, use copper clamps not galvanized EMT clamps because dissimilar metals will react with each other and rot the pipe and clamp.

I used a 2' section of hose 3/4" from my compressor to isolate vibration then switched to 3/4" copper for the main manifold and reduced the drops to 1/2"..
I also used a lot of ball valves so I can work on different parts of the system without shutting the compressor off and just in case I do something stupid and knock off a quick disconnect there is a valve close by...
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 01-24-2006, 03:58 PM
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When I plumbed my shop 1st time used cpvc. However I was a little nervous about it when I upgraded my compressor. I'm damn glad I did it was extremely brittle. Now I used plastic tube (designed for air brakes) to connect to my dryer and regulator, used 1" hydraulic hose to connect dryer to line and used 3/4" steel pipe throughout shop. Hey at least I know what won't kill me.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2006, 04:44 PM
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The best way to install air lines & reduce moisture

Here's a very useful diagram of how to plumb your garage or shop air lines.
http://www.tptools.com/statictext/ai...ng-diagram.pdf

Cheers!
Garth
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2006, 05:29 PM
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Garth, Excellent info especially the parts about using metal pipe to control moisture. However I will have to take exception to their suggestion to only use black iron pipe and not galvanized because they say the plating on the galvanized will come off and plug filters, tools etc. In my years of installing air systems I have found this to not be a problem and indeed the rust in unprotected pipe will be more of a problem. Also they suggest not using copper again over the years I have found copper to be the best choice and I have yet to see any of the problems they mention. Just my opinion.
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