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  #76 (permalink)  
Old 09-25-2006, 07:22 AM
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Pigjam, I think you have that backwards...the air doesnt warm up, it cools off. That is when the moisture is released; warm air retains moisture as vapor then as it cools, it forms condensation, much like the condensation that forms on the outside of a cold glass of iced tea. The room-temperature air (provided its above freezing in the room lol) releases its moisture as it is cooled by the cold glass, and forms water on the glass, thereby causing the table to get wet and wifey to yell at you because you forgot to use a coaster

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  #77 (permalink)  
Old 09-25-2006, 08:49 AM
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CD, You are right he does have the hot and cold backward however the vapor will condense in that hose because, as you pointed out, the air will cool somewhat allowing the vapor to condense.

Pigjam, You are on the right track by adding line as a cooling device however you are creating another possibly more serious problem with those loops in the hose. Because there are no "drops" for the water to collect in it will collect and sit in the lowest point of the line which will in this case be the bottom of the loops. The problem with this is that the water will be directly in the air flow and although nothing much will happen at first eventually the water level will reach a point that it starts to restrict the air flow at which point it will be picked up by the moving air and forced out of the line in "surges" probably in large amounts, most separators will not remove this much water and it can wind up in your air hose. The system needs to be plumbed so that there are NO low spots ANYWHERE in the line that water can drain to and collect where it will be in the air flow. ALL low points must have a "drop" where the water can collect to be drained but will be passed over by the moving air. This means that there can be no droops in the line or no places where the line is run down then back up unless there is a collection "drop" at the lowest point, also no loops in the line ANYWHERE before the separator but it will not matter at any point after the separator.
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  #78 (permalink)  
Old 09-25-2006, 09:08 AM
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Ya, I was thinkin that that hose looped would be OK if it werelooped upward so that any water would have a place to flow and be drained. Itd probably also be better to have it around that drain so itd be able to be drained out instead of having to be caught with the seperator. My thinking is its best to let natural occurences help as much as possible. So getting as much water out as possible using the valve on the drain would mean less demand on the filter/seperator, enabling it to work better.
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Old 09-25-2006, 09:58 AM
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That's the idea behind having extra line, so the water can be trapped and DRAINED before entering the separator. Collecting large amounts of liquid water in lines with no place for it to drain can do more harm than good.
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  #80 (permalink)  
Old 10-01-2006, 08:21 AM
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OK, from the wisdom shared on this great forum I have decided upon an air compressor. A Kobalt 80 gal. 5 running HP from Loews for $799.00.
K7580V2
-7.5 HP Peak 5.0 HP Running
-208-230V/22A
-17.1 SCFM @90psi
-15.2SCFM @175psi
-Max Pressure 175psi
-80 gallon tank

I will be installing it in my current garage/barn. I have plans in the next 2-3 years for enclosing a larger pole type barn that is located about 75 feet from where the compressor will be installed. I will want air in both buildings once I do this so won't want to have to move this monster to the new building. Can I run air line underground to the new building. It is slightly down grade from the current. The reason I ask now rather than later is in case there is anything I should take into consideration in installing the new compressor. I will be running all new 3/4" blk iron pipe now.
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Old 10-01-2006, 05:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUICKMAN
OK, from the wisdom shared on this great forum I have decided upon an air compressor. A Kobalt 80 gal. 5 running HP from Loews for $799.00.
K7580V2
-7.5 HP Peak 5.0 HP Running
-208-230V/22A
-17.1 SCFM @90psi
-15.2SCFM @175psi
-Max Pressure 175psi
-80 gallon tank
I bought that same compressor about a year ago and am very satisfied with it for my home shop. I'm glad that I didn't buy anything any smaller.

Danny
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Old 10-04-2006, 09:38 PM
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Best Air Compressor Pipe

PVC is not recommended. Take a look at Transair pipe. It is aluminum that quick connects so that it can be changed or removed at a later date, but is extremely reliable and very easy to install. It is expensive, but the costs are comparable to steel id you take into account self installation.
CompressorProfessor
www.compressoroils.com
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2006, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUICKMAN
OK, from the wisdom shared on this great forum I have decided upon an air compressor. A Kobalt 80 gal. 5 running HP from Loews for $799.00.
K7580V2
-7.5 HP Peak 5.0 HP Running
-208-230V/22A
-17.1 SCFM @90psi
-15.2SCFM @175psi
-Max Pressure 175psi
-80 gallon tank

I will be installing it in my current garage/barn. I have plans in the next 2-3 years for enclosing a larger pole type barn that is located about 75 feet from where the compressor will be installed. I will want air in both buildings once I do this so won't want to have to move this monster to the new building. Can I run air line underground to the new building. It is slightly down grade from the current. The reason I ask now rather than later is in case there is anything I should take into consideration in installing the new compressor. I will be running all new 3/4" blk iron pipe now.
You could, but I don't think it would work very well. The underground pipe would be the low point, and collect condensation, and you won't have a good way to drain it there.

If you use the air mostly in one building, and only occasionally in the other, I would go with a temporary line or hose that can be easily disconnected and drained. Of course you may have to move the compressor.

An acquaintance with a separate garage and workshop ran the black pipe overhead at truss level, but it was a relatively short distance.
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  #84 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2006, 08:56 PM
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OK, I think I got everything figured out and my parts list ready. Will be going to Loews tomorrow to bring the Kobalt monster home. I plan to install the compressor in the coolest part of the barn which is in a 12x40 ft lean-to type room in the shade of a big ol double pine, I will come off it with a flexible pipe then a a 3/4 inch black steel 5 foot riser, travel along a wall ,still in the cool, for about 30 feet, make another two foot rise with a drain drop at the bottom of it,(this is where I will add a hose later to furnish air to the pole barn I inquired about earlier) change to 1/2 inch here, turn left and go into the main garage. Run about 15 ft, add a 4 inch rise and a 5 foot drop to my beadblaster and sandblaster room, continue on about 10 more feet, turn left again, enter my prep and paint room, run about 20 feet, add a 4 inch rise and 6 ft drop for air tools, run about 5 more feet and end at a rise and drop for painting. Does this sound workable?
I have a couple of questions. What kind of flexible pipe and fittings do I use coming off the air compressor. Where do I need regulators and water filters and what kind. I hope to buy as much at Loews so I can get the 10% off new credit card deal but if there are better seperators i can get them later.

Last edited by BUICKMAN; 11-02-2006 at 05:14 AM.
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2006, 06:24 AM
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Anything that I've seen at Lowe's is way too small for what you need. My own is a dual setup that seems to work fairly well. It consists of a cheapy $20 Harbor Freight unit that I use as an initial knock-out unit. I then final filter with a Sharpe 707F. It's all at the outlet end of the 50+/- foot air line. In the picture you can also see a drip leg with a valve - needed. This will also collect water and need draining. The second picture has my hookup to my compressor. It's a 6 foot piece of 3/8" hose that plugs into my compressor - a 6.5 Hp, 30 gallon tank unit. I have to keep it portable so I can move it around. Note the drip leg and valve here for draining - it's needed as well.

http://www.sharpe1.com/filters.htm

I paid a lot less than list - shop the internet for the best price
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  #86 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2006, 09:09 AM
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Buick, That not only sounds workable but it sounds like you have done a really good job at planing this. You may want to consider hydraulic hose for the flexible part, inexpensive and capable of a great deal more pressure than it will ever see in service here. Just ask for a 1/2" hose (or what ever size you plan to use) the length you will need with NPT ends in either male or female, which ever you need, and it will fit the pipe threads on the compressor, the female ends are even available as a swivel fitting to make it even easier to hook up. The filter/regulator should be mounted at the takeoff where the air hose will be attached and as far from the compressor as possible. If you do use hydraulic hose all you will need is the 1500-2000 psi rated hose (you don't need that much rating but that is the low end for hydraulic hose) and not the more expensive and much stiffer multi wire higher pressure hose.
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Old 10-26-2006, 02:20 PM
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I had a 8' piece of 1" rubber airline with the proper fittings for screwing into the compressor on one end & into the 1" metal pipe on the other end made up for $35.00 out the door at a local electrical motor place that also does hydraulic hoses.
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  #88 (permalink)  
Old 11-02-2006, 05:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUICKMAN
OK, I think I got everything figured out and my parts list ready. Will be going to Loews tomorrow to bring the Kobalt monster home. I plan to install the compressor in the coolest part of the barn which is in a 12x40 ft lean-to type room in the shade of a big ol double pine, I will come off it with a flexible pipe then a a 3/4 inch black steel 5 foot riser, travel along a wall ,still in the cool, for about 30 feet, make another two foot rise with a drain drop at the bottom of it,(this is where I will add a hose later to furnish air to the pole barn I inquired about earlier) change to 1/2 inch here, turn left and go into the main garage. Run about 15 ft, add a 4 inch rise and a 5 foot drop to my beadblaster and sandblaster room, continue on about 10 more feet, turn left again, enter my prep and paint room, run about 20 feet, add a 4 inch rise and 6 ft drop for air tools, run about 5 more feet and end at a rise and drop for painting. Does this sound workable?
I have a couple of questions. What kind of flexible pipe and fittings do I use coming off the air compressor. Where do I need regulators and water filters and what kind. I hope to buy as much at Loews so I can get the 10% off new credit card deal but if there are better seperators i can get them later.
Well I have been advised by the warden that the room I intended to use as my blasting room is to remain as HER garden and potting room and that she doesn't see a need for air in there. SO, I will not be making that first left turn but rather t'ing into a vertical piece with a 2 ft riser and a drop with drain, then running it back toward the AC and into another vertical riser/drop-drain and making a right and going about 1ft into the same "prep-paint" room I would have previously ended in. The blaster will be located in the 12x40 lean to room about midway into that second run. I will ensure that I have positive drainage away from the AC at all times. My question is how much benefit would be had by increasing the size of black pipe from 3/4 and 1/2 to say 1 inch to the first about face (about 38 ft) then 3/4 inch back toward the AC (another 38 ft) and using 1/2 for my tool "outlets".
waddayathinks
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Old 11-02-2006, 07:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BUICKMAN
Well I have been advised by the warden that the room I intended to use as my blasting room is to remain as HER garden and potting room and that she doesn't see a need for air in there. SO, I will not be making that first left turn but rather t'ing into a vertical piece with a 2 ft riser and a drop with drain, then running it back toward the AC and into another vertical riser/drop-drain and making a right and going about 1ft into the same "prep-paint" room I would have previously ended in. The blaster will be located in the 12x40 lean to room about midway into that second run. I will ensure that I have positive drainage away from the AC at all times. My question is how much benefit would be had by increasing the size of black pipe from 3/4 and 1/2 to say 1 inch to the first about face (about 38 ft) then 3/4 inch back toward the AC (another 38 ft) and using 1/2 for my tool "outlets".
waddayathinks
If my ciphering is correct you won't gain that much in air line volume. It would be a little over a gallon more capacity with the increase of air line size. You would gain a lot of cooling capacity. The air travels much slower through the bigger line and has more area on the outside to cool it.

One US gal. has 231 cubic inches in it. 1" pipe has 9.42 cubic inches per running ft. 3/4" pipe has 5.298 cubic inches per running ft.

It takes a lot of air line to increase your air capacity very much. I think my calculations are correct but let me know if they aren't.

Kampr

Last edited by Kampr; 11-02-2006 at 09:30 AM.
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  #90 (permalink)  
Old 11-02-2006, 07:28 AM
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Kampr thanks for taking the time to do those calcs(and everybody else that's helping me out here).Since it is already an 80 gallon tank, I am more interested in knowing about the cost/benefit of the cooling/condensing/draining of the water in the larger lines than the smaller. In other words how much more condensate am I gonna get with 40 ft of 1'' + 40 ft of 3/4 in vs... 40 ft of 3/4 in + 40 ft of 1/2 in or what would be really simple is 80 ft total of 3/4 in.
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