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auto body repair? would you do it again

12K views 56 replies 15 participants last post by  MARTINSR 
#1 ·
hey everyone im sure this isn't the right place to ask but i want to ask anyone who has or is working in auto collision repair (autobody man) how is the career? is it stressful? ******y bosses? long hours? pay? enjoyable? satisfying? job security? advancing? do you hate cars now? i know that every career has its up and down but i really would love to hear your answers. my final question is ultimately if you were 23 years old would you pursue this career again or would you choose a different career?

your answers will greatly appreciated. thank you and have a wonderful day.
 
#2 ·
If I had it to do over again. NO. I got out of it years ago. Because at the time, paint products/technology were changing rapidly and causing problems to the end user.

So many variables and labor intensive. More so back then as a lot more "bodywork" was done. Not just panel replacement. Insurance companies.. That was a story in itself..
 
#3 ·
I am young relatively speaking but I have about 15 years in this kind of work now. We do everything from insurance work, collision repair, to frame off restorations and everything in between. I personally love it. I like the challenges it presents, the feeling of accomplishment when you know you have touched every bolt in a car and it looks better than it did new. It has its days and some things can be aggravating but you have to just walk away and come back. If you think it is something you want to do I say go for it. Good luck if you do.

Kelly
 
#4 ·
I should also add that I worked with my dad until I saved up the money to go out on my own. It is a bit more stressful and there is more to keep up with, but I wouldn't change it for anything. IF you can do bodywork and metal repair/fabrication or learn to do so, instead of being a school trained parts changer, you will be in high demand because a lot of parts are not available for some older cars and have to be made. There are a lot of people who can buy and change parts, but very few that have the talent and ability to actually repair something. There are several very skilled people on this forum and a wealth of knowledge to be gained from them. I try to learn something everyday when I log on. Always be willing to learn and remember that there is always someone who has done more than you, better than you have done it. One last word of advice, even though the customer may not own the car forever your name will be on the work forever, so always do work and repairs that you can be proud of and that will last for years to come. It only takes one bad job to ruin your reputation. Best of luck if you decide to go this route.:thumbup:

Kelly
 
#5 ·
"my final question is ultimately if you were 23 years old would you pursue this career again or would you choose a different career?"

HELL NO, not even maybe. Straight up, don't do it, you'd make more money at Denny's or McDonald's, literally.

Autobody is a sunset industry on the back end of the 'bell curve', it is nearly as obsolete as buggy whips. It will take 5 years hands-on and $50,000 minimun in tools before anyone treats you as anything besides the shop mule or a trainee. That's after-taxes take home pay, (add sales tax - you're the end user). That's everything YOU don't ever get to do, Disney World, Vegas, ski trip to Aspen, ect.

5 years AND $50,000 is a colledge degree, it's also buying a few fixer-upper homes to turn-and-burn, rent them back to section 8 housing for guaranteed money and rate increases, or any other thing you want to do for a paycheck.

As a hobby it's fun, as a job it is actually the bottom of the barrel, don't do it.
 
#30 · (Edited)
As depressing as it is...
I gotta agree with the Old man I love doing this crap but if I did it for the money I'd starve theres much better ways to make money...Unfortunately You have to learn at a shop (many shops) if you want to get good enough to do satifactory work and make it a great hobby....
once you learn you can flip cars to make money and work up to flipping houses.
I love this work ,I've done it since I was 14yr old and all these years later I cant wait to get to the shop and get started....But I'm one of the lucky ones ,I work for myself and dont do it for the money .If your the type that has to work for someone ,dont even think of it...but if your the independant type working at a few shops is a great idea as a means to an end....and if its not for you you'll still learn something and learning is a good thing...
So theres my advice ...Go for it young blood it'll be a good experiance for ya but dont stay long learn what you can as fast as you can and get out....
 
#6 ·
I'm with Kelly, it has been a wonderful living for me and my family.

I went to work full time at a bodyshop one week after graduating high school in 1977. Getting Married in 1979 (first wife) and she never had to work, my forever wife whom I married in 91, never had to work. And we live in the SF bay area, it ain't cheap here. I own a home and pay my bills and save a little all on my income, so yes you can make decent money.

But aside from the money, I honestly can compare it with an actor or someone else in the arts, I have enjoyed what I do for a living for 35 years. I have not limited myself to one part of it, I have done most everything in the industry from used car junk work, full on restoration and custom, paint and body, late model collision, parts sales for a year (couldn't make good money but I loved it) a paint rep where I traveled here and there and had a territory that covered a good part of California including up in the redwood country of the northern areas. I owned a shop, estimated, everything. I have been at the same very large family owned shop for the past 12 years with 8 in the shop three in the office and now a year or so as the partsman. This is a very large shop where we do about 3.5 $million a year in sales. I am open to learning anything new and because of this I could go anywhere in the country and find a job, in a heart beat.

One of my friends who left high school and went right into law enforcement retired, I am ten years away from that. I was talking to another old friend of mine who had also went into law enforcement and when I was telling him how I should have went into law enforcement too (we studied the subject together) he said I couldn't be more wrong. He told me "our friend was retired after 35 years of cleaning vomit out of the back of his patrol car, at seeing the world in the worse possible light, at seeing mothers beat up in front of their children. While you have enjoyed what you do, you have made show cars, you have won awards, you have traveled, you have fixed peoples cars when they were in a very bad time, made things better for them. Brian he said, you have enjoyed the last 35 years and if you need to work 10 more so what, you enjoy it, you are the lucky one, I wish I would have done that."

And I know he is right, I have really enjoyed it, every day of it. One of the greatest things that ever happen to me was meeting someone at a shop near mine when I was in my twenties who enlightened me on protecting my body. I wish I could find her now, I have tried but can't, I owe her a lot. I am as healthy as a horse (thank God) because I protected myself from the harmful things we work with. And I am damn thankful my mom bought me that spray gun for a graduation present. :D

Brian
 
#7 ·
If you want money and less dust go production. If you'll take less and deal with dust just so can see your creations shine than go restoration. Big hits are fun in production but hearing insurance people and estimators talk is annoying. Restoration is a lot funner and less people with suits and ties.
 
#8 ·
Would you be a bodyman ?

If you dream about cars , spend every penny you get on cars , save up for weeks to buy a junker then go into the car business. If the Idea of taking something ratty and worn out and making it new pervades your thinking, then do it . As you can see , youre going to get many different answers. If you work at a good shop and get a good boss , youll do well . You get paid for what you get done , not by the hour , so if youre fast you can rock and roll , you can make money. If you dont and havnt lived and breathed cars as long as you can remember , sell insurance or swing a hammer but you gotta, work anyway !:rolleyes:
 
#9 ·
One thing else to consider.

When I took an early retirement offer from At&T I had several people wanting me to build cars for them. I had the shop space and decided that I would do restoration work for a living. I was never without work and was never cheated out of a dime ....BUT......In less than a year I lost all interest in my own cars. I realized that I could have a career or I could have a hobby but could not have both. I went to work at a heavy truck dealer and went back to playing with my cars for fun.

There are a few people who can work on a customer's car all day and go home and work on there own but they are few and far between. There are also guys who would just as soon work on a customer's car as their own.

For me, My old cars and my social life are all tied together and I don't want to turn it into a living. There definitely is a demand for good technicians. Unfortunately not many of them are earning what they deserve.

John L
 
#10 ·
I know one thing, this industry is NOT going anywhere! Some dude in India isn't going to fix Mrs. Smith's Lexus that she wrecked over the weekend. :D

Brian
 
#12 ·
It's been talked about for years, it won't happen. For that matter, Volvo bumper covers have came painted for a long time but that is actually dying off. Think about the stock! How much more room would you need to stock all the colors of all the bumpers compared to just a few of each bumper?

No John, the cars are getting more complex and higher skilled technicians are getting more and more important. Believe me, we have a variety of skills at the shop and there are a couple of guys who are NEVER going to see a complex hit on one of these late model cars, they just couldn't handle it.

With all the different metals and welding needed, and the electronics, holy crap! Just today I had a car leaving and the windows wouldn't work from the drivers door. All that had been done was one rear door panel had been removed. But the windows wouldn't work. I had to reset each window. That of course is just a tiny issue but it's an example. SRS systems, accident avoidance systems. Heck we had an Infiniti G35 that the ABS was messed up because we put a different brand tire than it had from the factory!

It won't be long you will need a college degree to work on these things. It ain't the old hammer and dolly work anymore.

As far as restoration or collision, you make of it what you want to make of it. Personally, I look at doing collision repair on a 2012 Ford Focus the same as restoration on a 1958 Ford Fairlane. If you "restore" that Focus with the same passion as you would a vintage car for the concourse judges it is just as fun. That is how I look at collision repair. I love creating something that didn't exist yesterday, custom work is awesome. But if you don't have any at the time, putting the same passion into a Prius works for me.

Brian
 
#13 ·
I just re read my above post and decided it may be a little out of line. I believe Brian is correct that the skilled auto body tech will always have a job. There will always be a need for intelligent skilled people who can work with their hands. That will apply to many trades whether they are body men, trimmers, plumbers or carpenters. Years ago it was an apprentice's dream to learn a trade and someday own a business of his own. It is just so difficult for a small business owner to overcome the costs and regulations of doing business and have enough left to pay for health insurance and all the other expenses. I am very skeptical of what the future holds for a small business owners. I told a friend not too long ago who owns his own business, "I admire you but I sure don't envy you".

I was practically a high school drop out. Joined the Navy at 17 and was blessed to have worked for 2 large companies and retire from both. Not many young men without a college degree will be as blessed as I have been. In the years to come good jobs with benefits will become harder and harder to find.

John L
 
#18 ·
By the way to show you the value in the industry a co-worker of mine just left California after being here about 25 years. She has worked around the autobody industry for all that time and did just about everything. She came to work for us as a tow truck driver and did that for about a week when the receptionist quit. She took over that and next thing you know she was writing estimates. She knows her stuff and did a great job. Well her personal life changed in a big way and she wanted to get back to Missouri to help her elderly mom. She decided this early December. In two days over the phone she had a job as an insurance estimator in Missouri. A couple of days later she had another one lined up as side work.

Brian
 
#21 ·
of course, the insurance companies run the industry now. No surprise a lot of the hard working blue collar techs are in the back inhaling toxins with no health insurance while the insurance agent who doesn't even work for the shop has his own office in the shop and has his whole family insured.

That said, it's another opportunity for bodytechs who can't physically handle the demands of the work anymore. So in that aspect, it keeps old body techs working and finds another use for those years of knowledge.
 
#20 ·
Been doing this for 35 years. Was never really interested in this trade, to make a long story short this is where I ended up. My spare time is taken up with other hobbies not related to body and painting. Every job can be boring no matter what it is. I have been working where I am now for 15 years, primarily painting, it is an independant production collision shop about 10,000 sq ft, doing approx 3 million plus yearly, 95%insurance work. Small town in the oil patch in Alberta. It can be stressful at times to get stuff done right and on time, insurance companies and customers can be very demanding. I've done restoration, hot rods but prefer collision for the money and the variety of different jobs, it's never boring. I found restoration boring, working on the same car for months, while it was nice to see the finished product and you got a sense of accomplishment when it was done, the whole long and drawn out process bored me to tears. Working collision I work on newer clean rust free vehicles with new parts and get a sense of pride everytime I paint something which could be several times a day.

I work flat rate, get payed by the job not hourly. What I have found over the years is there are many and varied types of shops, some in the dark ages and some state of the art. If you find the right shop, they are few and far between, you can make a good living and work decent hours in a clean, dry and warm environment. Find the prosperous looking shop that has a clean office, nicely presented, tidy building, office management that is professional, modern equipment, etc. Talk to the employees, are they wearing proper safety equipment, are they happy and motivated, do they get along? If so it is possibly a good shop to work. Avoid the shops that are sloppy, cluttered with parts laying all over the place, garbage cans overflowing and trash all over the floor, employees not wearing proper safety gear, radios blaring, dirty paint booths etc, there are some real turds out there.

Your not likely to get rich but you can make as much or more than your average tradesman plumber, electrician, carpenter, mechanic, welder, machinist, etc. If you learn the ropes from someone that is good, if you are conscientious and willing to put the time in it's not a bad trade. I find the biggest enemy of the autobody industry is the autobody shops themselves. A well managed shop with talented employees will be nothing but successful. There is a great demand for good shops and good tradesmen..
 
#22 ·
BI've done restoration, hot rods but prefer collision for the money and the variety of different jobs, it's never boring. I found restoration boring, working on the same car for months, while it was nice to see the finished product and you got a sense of accomplishment when it was done, the whole long and drawn out process bored me to tears.
I can understand that. I remember one time finishing up a car I had been working on for many months and I came up with what I think is a pretty profound thought on the subject. When someone asked me what I was making on the car I told him "I would like to get a million dollars because that is what it is worth, but on the other hand if it left and I got nothing I would be happy just seeing it leave my life would be enough pay for me". :D

But now after being in the business for so long and learning so much about production and about the business side of it, it would be a lot different for me. Things would get done so much faster. I believed in the myth that every restoration job was so different, and really they aren't. You can do it more efficiently that I use to and make money still putting out a nice product. I use to "store" more than "restore". :rolleyes:

Brian
 
#26 ·
Anthem for our family and also vision and dental. Never even used the vision but I need to go get some $60 sun glasses and have it reimbursed...I say that every year! Saddens me there's babies out there uncovered and people in need of doctors who can't afford it.
 
#27 ·
I love the trade and think the future for good tech's is bright. Over the last two decades fewer people have entered the trade, vocational schools are graduating smaller classes, supply and demand for good tech's will make the wages go up.

There are many things to decide, do you want to be a painter, a body man, or a combination paint and body. Also there are different shops, from small to very large production shops, the atmosphere is quite different and is something too consider. Its the craftsmanship part of auto body repair that keeps me interested, to me its an art.

Good luck
 
#33 ·
The cool thing is you don't have to stick to any one of them, I haven't and have made a good living. Changing when the need arises makes you stronger and more valuable.

Brian
 
#28 ·
I have enjoyed every minute of working on all the cars... so I supose I stayed longer than most do.
I probably would work in the industry for a few years then get out after about 10 years . Isn't hindsight a wonderfull thing.
I have semi retired now(I only work when I want to):)

Can anyone tell me how much $$ per week the average bodytechs / Spraypainter makes each week on wages.
 
#32 ·
A good tech should make more than an insurance adjuster, office manager, or estimator. The more the techs make the more the shop makes. If they aren't the shop is running backwards. If the office staff is taking higher wages than the guys generating the shop income that shop is going nowhere. If the tech has no influence in the estimates and insurance supplements something is wrong. Every techs work station has an I-pad or laptop and camera, we document everything with pictures and bill the insurance companies for every operation and email the customer keeping them in touch with the entire operation and status of the vehicle. When we show the customer that the insurance wants to repair something that should be replaced and the customer is supplied with this information, the adjustors email and phone number we generally get what we want. We use the customer, they are informed how the system works and take part in it.. Essentially the tech writes his own estimates. I make the easiest money of the day money taking a few minutes with a camera and a couple emails. The problem with the shops vs. the insurance companies is shops taking the adjusters estimate for face value. We do the work on our terms. We have a great loyal customer base, they refuse to go else where when directed by insurance companies. If you let the insurance companies step on you they certainly will.
 
#35 ·
I have to tell you, you are working with some top notch technicians! There is no way that I can see that this would work in the shop I work at. I have been the supplement guy where I work before I took over the parts, and I still go out there and do this. In my down time I will walk out and look at a car that has already had a supplemented, and add another $300-500, EASY. For that matter, sometimes it's $2000 more! I am amazed at what these guys don't see. And we go by manufacturers and ICAR standards. Yes we replace a LOT of structural stuff, because that is what the guidelines say to do. But anyway, yes we never go by the adjusters est, are there really shops who do this? REALLY? That would be the most ignorant thing I have ever heard! I have wondered how the heck they will write such poor estimates, "really, you really think we would do it this way?" REALLY? So I have wondered if there are shops out there that do what they say? We work with the insurance, to our advantage. We get paid for EVERYTHING we do, we get paid for EVERYTHING the car needs for OUR customer. Be it a direct (we are direct repair with a number of companies) or someone else, we get paid properly. Don't get me wrong, it takes a lot more work to do it these days with trail fitting AM parts and then going to OEM or turning down used parts, and all that crap, but in the end we get paid.

On the tech making more money than anyone else, looking at business as a businessman (the guy who CREATES the job) should a guy in the toaster factory putting toasters together get the same pay as the salesman who brought in the $million dollar a year account?
Just something to think about.

Brian
 
#50 ·
While on this subject of old dudes, Henry, protect yourself! 54 years old comes so damn fast you won't believe it.
That goes for everyone, Randy, John, everyone, protect yourself. Get anal about it, protect yourself around this stuff. I have seen too many horror stories.

Brian
 
#52 ·
I play basketball all the time and am known for my hustle play at the gym, take my vitamins, drink lots of water, take organic apple cider vinegar, and eat decent food. I wear solvent proof gloves when cleaning my bondo board, wear a mask all the time but I slipped up yesterday. Welding a patch and behind it was por 15 burning away. Everytime I saw the smoke I blew it away and stepped back but I probably should have had my charcoal mask on instead of the pancake weld approved filters. Already had a couple scares with my eyes and for a while I'd see a glare out of one eye from streetlights or any bright light. It eventually went away the last time I checked...by closing one eye at a time and comparing. They both were equal...unless I messed up my other eye without knowing. :mwink:

Yeah, that's one thing to consider when entering this trade.
 
#53 ·
Good to hear you keep on top of it Henry, good going. You want the welding mask for sure, weld thru primer (most of it) is 95% zinc, you do NOT want to breath zinc fumes. All metal in cars made the last number of decades is zinc coated (galvanized). Real good to hear you are doing that, I hate seeing people not protecting themselves, this stuff is very dangerous.

Brian
 
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#54 ·
I've read all of the posts, all the positive, all the negative....There are issues dealing with people, insurance companies, adjusters that know and don't know what they're doing. As in any other career there are employers that are excellent to work for and those that are difficult...there are fellow technicians that feel they know everything when knowing very little but, because they have been around the trade longer than a relatively new technician, garner more respect than they deserve. To sum this part of the equation up, your 23 years old....you will find this no matter what career path you chose...the players will be different but, there are always players.

The question you need to ask yourself is, where does your passion lye? Are you passionate about cars? What part of the industry do you want to become a big part of your life, because no matter what career you choose, what you do does become a big part of your life.

I have been in the automotive trade my whole life, would I choose any other trade if I could go back in time...no, I'm passionate about what I do. I've loved cars since as far back as I can remember, I wanted them to go fast and cosmetically stand out. I did however get tired of repairing belly button cars and did loose my passion for repairing them after they where involved in an accident but never lost my original desire. Now after over 40 years in the industry I am in a position to do what I've always wanted, to build and work on cars that I choose to build and work on. It's now fun again, but it did take many years of learning, figuring out what I needed to do to get to where I wanted to be...years of not getting the respect that I felt I deserved and struggling through that to finally get that respect. Today, as I had always hoped, a restoration or custom vehicle is my canvas and I do consider it art.

If you have the passion, if you have realistic goals and a plan to achieve them, if you have the drive to overlook all of the downsides of the industry and are focused on what you want to achieve, you will be successful. The keys are, the passion, the desire and the ability to withstand all the obstacles in your way to reach your end goal...the obstacles are in every path you choose regardless.

On a final note...if you do choose this trade, as many people have mentioned, take all the precautions available to protect your health...in my opinion this is a much larger downside than any adjuster, co-worker or employer.

Hope this helps.

Ray
 
#55 ·
Brilliantly said Ray, you put it much better than I could have, honestly, to the original poster, read Rays post over and over, print it out and put it in your wallet and read it once in a while, truer words have not been spoken.

Brian
 
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