I had the front bearing in a 37 lasalle box lock up and that big heavy gear shift stick was beating the steering column and my leg ...the bell housing was scattered along the road. in a lot of little pieces.
chevy 327 .30 over, flat top 2 valve cut pistons, lunati bracket master 2 cam .480be .480 at 230 dur, 1.6:1 roller rockers, weind air gap intake, headers, 3 inch exhaust, 3200-3500 stall converter, new flywheel, red alto discks and kolene steels, fairbanks valve body reprograming kit, 3.89 gears and a full spool, 295 50 15 tires, new front motor mounts and new energy suspension trans mount.
I would check driver side engine mount, and the trans mount if the trans mount is good leave it if the driver mount is good or bad change just that side to a solid mount (DRIVER SIDE ONLY) and also check the drive shaft make sure its not to far into the tailshaft of the trans. And also check for proper pinion angle on the rearend. I am thinking it is from engine flex. I bet it busted from the starter around to the other side am i right? Hope this helps Cole
right on the way it cracked. trying to get some picks up. the front mount is almost solid its a fairly stiff rubber plastic material. and the trans mount is a energy suspension mount. drive shaft is not to long, but i am getting a fair amount of wheel hop and axle twist on launch drive shaft hits fuel tank,
what are my options i have seen replacement bellhousing but you have to cut this one off and the new one mounts to the front pump. any opinions
Are you using the front mounts by the timing cover, or the mid mounts under the second exhaust ports?
Bellhousings typically break when you use a front mount and a trans mount on the tailshaft of the trans. Hanging all that weight from the far ends puts too much stress on the bellhousing.
These style mounts are supposed to be used with the trans mounts that are on the bellhousing.
front by the timing cover and the tail shaft mount on the trans. it was like this for 8 years and never had a problem till i rebuilt everything. i am getting my camera will get pics up right now.
You need midmounts. It took 8 years to break your your bellhousing, some last longer than others.
The midmounts are closer to the center of the weight of the block, which takes the stress off the bellhousing.
It's been a well known problem for many years. The frontmount motormount was designed to use a transmission that was mounted at the bellhousing. All of the stock applications that used the front mount were set up like that.
I have thought about making some reinforcement bars that went from the block to the trans for those who don't want to use the right mounts, but never had the opportunity.
i cant use the side mount no room because of the steering.
can i just buy the mount plates that go between the block and the trans, that mount to the frame. i thought befor i put it in there the fist time that i should have but i think i will now.
i cant use the side mount no room because of the steering.
can i just buy the mount plates that go between the block and the trans, that mount to the frame. i thought befor i put it in there the fist time that i should have but i think i will now.
You don't want to mount the engine/trans in 3 places.
I'd either figure out a way to fab a custom mount from the frame to use the mid mounts, or make some reinforcing bars to go from the trans to the motor. Even if you picked up 2 or 3 pan bolts on each side of the pan and motor and bent up a piece of 5/8 solid rod to bridge between them it would help.
Also I would investigate curing the wheel hop and axle flex as when that happens it places an incredible amount of stress on the drive train which shows up as broken motor mounts and bellhousings..
Like has been said wheelhop is a big contributor to this. It will bust a lot of stuff in a hurry.
Ditto to the front and tail only mounts, puts all the stress on the bellhousing.
The bolt-on bellhousing that attaches to the pump is a race certified piece that is very thick and is certified to serve as a flexplate and converter explosion shield. these are nicely made and fit very well. It would eliminate a lot of worries in your case and save you from needing to build another trans, but I don't think I would rely on it as the cure to your mount system. Is there room to use the "batwing" style mount at the bellhousing-to-block bolts that the circle track racers use?? These bolt on using the bellhousing bolts at the dowel pin area. Look for them at Speedway Motors to know what I'm referring to.
EDIT: Powerrodsmike, could you chime in and say why you think three mounting points(front of engine, rear of engine, trans tail) is bad?? A large majority of race cars use front plate, mid plate and trans tail with no problems and it is the preferred method used.
EDIT: Powerrodsmike, could you chime in and say why you think three mounting points(front of engine, rear of engine, trans tail) is bad?? A large majority of race cars use front plate, mid plate and trans tail with no problems and it is the preferred method used.
A stock 34 pickup frame is not the stiffest frame around, and the motor/trans should be supported at 3 points to allow the frame to 'float" around the motor. If the frame twists, it won't try to twist around the motor, which is supposed to be fairly rigid. IMO, supporting the motor at 5 points, (2 in front, 2 at the bellhousing, 1 at the rear), would be asking for trouble in his application.
I can see a stock front crossmember in the OP's pics, and have no idea what kind of reinforcement was done to the frame. All those old rivets that hold that frame together allow even more flex. Chop out the center of the X member to clear a modern transmission and you get even more flex. The original suspension allowed all twist from motor torque and bumps and leaning taken up by 2 large balls at the end of the wishbones. Split the wishbones to clear a modern motor and trans and you start transferring more torsion into the frame. Put coilovers on the rear and you get even more torsion from the motor trying to twist the frame.
Those frames were designed to keep about 90 HP under control at blinding speeds of 60 or 70 mph.
Racecars typically have much more rigid frames.
JMO
Understood. not being a rod guy I didn't think about the Flexi Flyer frame. To the OP, the bell housing will cure the broken bell and save your trans, but may just put all that load into the front pump area and just break the case again there.
P-Mike, what about front mounts, mid-batwing mounts, and leave the bolts loose in the trans tail mount so it is there for weight support but will allow flex?
I'd ditch the urethane mounts, and go for the rubber ones so it will allow support and still allow some flex when needed.
Even if the batwings had the urethane mounts, having rubber mounts at the front and rear would allow the motor to "teeter" some at the front and rear when the frame flexes.
That's my guess anyway. I never had to really think that one out. :drunk:
If it were me, I'd build a set of frame mounts that cleared the steering, and use a set of the mid mounts. Or make up a set of bridge bars from motor to trans as I talked about in one of my previous posts.
Hate to even mention it, but I noticed a very minor thing (minor at this point that is, considering you have a busted tranny case!)- but remember to mount your ground strap to bare metal, not over paint.
If it were me, i would stay with the tail mount and build what I needed to use the side of the block mounting points. All domestic manufacturers changed to this style around the late 1950's when engines started making more power than a stock flathead or straight six.
You need to take care of the wheel hop or you will break anything you install.
You can do whatever you want. Our recommendations are based on our experience, and what we've seen happen.
Unless you boxed the frame from front crossmember to rear crossmember, and tied the crossmembers into the boxing plates, you will still get some frame twist. If you did a 5 point mount it may work fine, and it could stiffen the frame by tying the motor in. I wouldn't do it, but that's just me. I do things that go against the best advice of others and sometimes they work out ok..sometimes they don't.
The rubber mounts in your current configuration probably go away because they are not spaced out far enough. Solid mounting everything could send a bunch of vibration and shock into the frame, and create localized stresses. Things start getting tore up like that. If the batwing mounts were urethane they would control the torque from the motor alot better than what you have now, but with rubber mounts at the front, the frame would still be allowed to flex and not hurt anything.
There is a reason the OEM's went to 3 point mounts. Any time you take something that is designed to flex, support weight, and isolate vibration, , and you defeat the design by adding rigidity to only one section, you are looking for problems.
Experience is what you get, right after you needed it the most.
Later, mikey
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