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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 04-12-2013, 05:08 PM
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[QUOTE=
That is the number thing many painters do wrong when they use a product they have not yet used. Most products will do the job you want it to do, BUT, first you have to learn how the product sprays, how it reacts under certain conditions.
How long does it take to dry?
How does it like to be sprayed?
Max amount of coats? (We custom painters usually do more than 2 coats.)
How long before its hard?
What does it take to really flow it out?
I never just use a new product on a customer's project. Never, cos every time I do, it bites me. So I slow down and learn.[/QUOTE]


I love to hear someone else say this. I've been away from the spray booth for 30 years. I've spent over $800.00 on 'stuff' to try out.... everything about this is new to me - it's just like learning nitrocellulose when I was in HS. I'm a year from painting my 34 coupe, but I've got 20+ panels here with varying degrees of success all over them. A few that have purposeful 'problems' just to see what happens if something goes wrong. That's what this hobby is all about, right?
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 04-12-2013, 05:17 PM
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Most of the time, when you hear about a painter having a problem its usually cos they are using a product for the first time.
And my best buddy when I painting, the tech sheet that goes with that product. I've been painting for 33 years and I am always opening up the binder I keep all my tech sheets in. I may use something all the time, but I still like to make sure I am correctly remembering the details of the product.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 04-12-2013, 05:53 PM
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When your in a situation that allows you to slow down and learn, that it is the way to go, unfortunately in Canada we were mandated to use VOC compliant Envirobase (if you wanted to use PPG, I reread my last post and I wrote Aqua Base, my bad, Aqua Base is from Nexa, the same product just re-branded for the old ICI line that PPG bought out) Base Coat and VOC compliant clear as of January 1st 2010. It wasn't until fairly late 2009 that the VOC compliant clears were released in Canada and many shops never had that opportunity to learn, experiment or really test the product before they didn't have any other choice but to use it...Now to be fair, they may have changed the formulation but there were a fair amount of problems with respect to curing when the clears first came out, that's why I was wondering if you had tried them yet.

The Base Coat (Envirobase) is great, color match is incredible and the number of specialty colors is, as always from PPG fantastic. The Vibrance clear mid coat that replaced DBC500 is now a catalyzed mid coat but still uses the same dyes for candy's and other Vibrance colors.

Ray
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Old 04-12-2013, 06:07 PM
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The changes started hitting here hard with the "clean air act" of 1993. The HVLP requirement came the next year as I remember, lacquer, gone, and a number of other products, gone. And it happened much faster than we thought, the first HVLP guns were CRAP! I cheated big time with my Devilbiss JGA502 hidden away like I was running a meth lab. A few years later they took the urethane primer, that really hit us hard, water borne was all they had and it was CRAP, CRAP, CRAP. Then the first 2K was Polyester, then the next urethane was reduced with acetone and people applied it like the old days pounding it on and it would NEVER cure. The learning curve was a steep one, very steep.


Brian
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Old 04-12-2013, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by MARTINSR View Post
The changes started hitting here hard with the "clean air act" of 1993. The HVLP requirement came the next year as I remember, lacquer, gone, and a number of other products, gone. And it happened much faster than we thought, the first HVLP guns were CRAP! I cheated big time with my Devilbiss JGA502 hidden away like I was running a meth lab. A few years later they took the urethane primer, that really hit us hard, water borne was all they had and it was CRAP, CRAP, CRAP. Then the first 2K was Polyester, then the next urethane was reduced with acetone and people applied it like the old days pounding it on and it would NEVER cure. The learning curve was a steep one, very steep.


Brian
So Brian, are you guys using water born base coat or is solvent still Okay? As far as I'm concerned the new paint guns did and do more for the environment than mandating that everybody use VOC Compliant material. Let me rephrase that...the paint guns we have today have done more than mandating VOC Compliant material.

Ray
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Old 04-12-2013, 07:26 PM
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Ray, once all the dust died it ends up being fine, but damn that learning curve, holy crap did it kick our butts! The first HVLP guns only cow they were bad, there weren't any better than a Black and Decker airless from Home Depot! OH MY GOD that was a bad time for paint. We have been using water borne for....um..I think it's three years now. Some of the compliant stuff like acetone is a joke, it's HEAVY it doesn't pollute the air it pollutes our ground water!

Brian
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Old 04-12-2013, 07:43 PM
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Yeah we haven't been able to by quality solvent for three years now as well, if we want a good base coat it's gotta be water born...and to be honest, I like it, It lays down flatter because it's thinner than solvent, colors are more sharp overall it's a decent product. As far as being better for the environment, I have my doubts.

I remember the first HVLP's, they were crap, we didn't have to use them but some shops bought them and they turned into primer guns real quick...I seem to remember one that had a 2 air lines going to it one for regular use and another one that would turn paddles in the pot to stir metallic's while you painted...I can't remember the name of it but it didn't sell well at all.

Ray
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