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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2013, 05:33 PM
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I dont think so. If there is it is a small amount. I am wondering if I might have inadvertantly made a 2nd pass on that area on the 1st pass and trapped solvents. Would you guys attempt to colorsand and polish that or shoot another coat?

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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2013, 06:00 PM
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In this case a question i would ask is there a cut off line where you could hard mask to. or where is this area, is it a fender. door or is it a rear quarter. The reason I ask is if it's a fender or a door, you could prep the entire panel, clean up the affected area and re paint the panel, if it's an area like a rear quarter where you haven't got any cut of line, you may need to clean up the area, blend your color out and polish back your blend. If this is the case, let me know and I will try and walk you through it.

Ray
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:06 PM
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It is the area directly behind the sunroof on a 62 ragtop vw. I coulactually respray the whole top and there are a few good cutlines availlble. The thing that concerns me is tha this was the third attempt and I dont want the paint to get to thick. But then again ive sanded so much off after that last attempt I am not sure how much is on there.
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:14 PM
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If I go the respray route how long will the existing coat need to gas off so I dont make the problem over the entire area? I am going to spray the doors quarter panels and hood tomorrow morning. I am sprying the vehicle in 2 sessions to avoid averwhelming myself.
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:25 PM
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Your best bet would be to re paint the area, clean up all of the imperfections with say 400 or 600 grit wet paper...it may not be a bad idea to wet block sand the entire panel that you are going to re paint (it just does a much nicer job if all the Orange peel is gone...you could even use the paint as a leveling substrate to get the panel even straighter). After you have prepped the panel, let it sit a day or 2 to ensure that the solvents have left the previous painted surface. Mask off everything that you don't want color on and apply 2 medium wet even coats over the entire panel and you should have one shiny finished Bug.

Ray
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2013, 06:32 PM
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Ill see how the rest comes out. Hopefully an isolated deal. I sprayed the decklid and it was fine. everything prepped the same. Go figure. How much paint is to much. The car is going to florida so I guess a littl extra material isnt a bad thing..LOl
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Old 06-10-2013, 06:51 PM
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The wonderful thing about painting is that no matter how long you've done it, no matter how good you are, no matter how well you know your equipment or your material...this kind of thing happens. To the seasoned pro and to people with lesser experience, every once in a while one job will come and bite you in the backside. Don't worry about the amount of material, with all the sanding and removing of material between jobs and the fact that it's all the same material...I'm sure you'll be fine. When I do a vehicle for the car show side of the trade, it's not uncommon for me to put on 5 coats of clear before I cut and buff. Granted, the vehicle with all the clear on it isn't a daily driver but your Bug probably has only half of the amount of material on it...you'll be fine.

Ray
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Old 06-10-2013, 07:00 PM
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At least it is a different problem lol
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2013, 07:10 PM
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Yes and Thank God for that. Anyone and everyone who has been at this trade for any length of time time has run into that one vehicle that no matter what...nothing goes right. I actually know of a shop that had so much trouble with a vehicle that they ended up buying it so they could stop working on it...LOL.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2013, 10:03 PM
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Ill let you know how it goes tomorrow. Any thoughts on how to minimize solvent pop? I am using medium reducer. I have some slow. What baffles me is the deck lid is glass with no pop. shot out of the same gun with the same paint at the same time. Go figure
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Old 06-10-2013, 10:36 PM
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It can be very difficult to tell you exactly why this type of a reaction could occur, especially not being there before, during and after. What I can do is give you the reasons why it does happen.

If product is put on to heavy and the top cures or dries before the solvents underneath have a chance to dissipate. The solvents still need to escape and when they do, they create a little volcano looking blemish on the surface of the paint. Top curing can occur when there is to much air movement. With to much air movement the solvents on the upper area of the paint are carried away, curing or drying the top of the painted surface before the inside solvents can reach the top. This situation is accentuated if the wrong temperature of reducer or hardner is used. If, for example, the air temperature is 85 degrees...the painter is using a reducer or hardner rated for temperatures of 65 degrees, the top of the paint where there is air movement removing the escaping solvents cures, leaving the inside solvents to push their way through the already curing layer of paint...and causing the volcano or solvent popping effect. It should also be noted that in most cases solvent popping occurs on top panels. The reason is that top panels allow the painter to apply the paint heavier without getting runs, meaning more paint which in turn means more solvents.

Lets say it's 85 degrees, your spraying the material with a reducer or hardner rated for 95 degrees and you still get solvent popping...You then need to look at the amount of material put on and examin the amount of air flowing over top of the panel. The reducer and hardner is correct for the temperature but, if there is excess air flow, the same solvent popping effect can happen.

These are the most common causes and in your case it would appear as though there was a little more product put on that area of the car than others and perhaps the air flow at that position was greater than another area causing a perfect storm and giving you the solvent popping that you now have. This can be minimized by allowing a little more flash time, applying the product a little lighter on the first coat and you should be fine.

Just on a point of interest...There are also times when baking a product can cause solvent popping. Spies Hecker had a clear out about 20 years ago that if it was baked, the clear would pop...all tech sheets where followed to the written letter and solvent popping was still a major issue. It turned out that when the tech sheet was translated into English, it was stated that the product should be baked at 160 degrees for 35 minutes...however, when the German version was read it stated that the clear should be baked with a metal temperature of 160 degrees...not air temperature. Talk about getting things lost in the translation.

Hope this helps
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 06-10-2013, 11:24 PM
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I had a thought. i had the shop door open with the sun shining on the back of the car. The largest cluster of pop was in this area. i think i used medium reducer on metal teperature that was perhaps to high and perhaps a little to thick. The other smsll cluster was on the front quarter paned (vertical surface). I am going to get up early and reevaluate, Even the 2x2 test panels on the old car in the shop were great,thanx so much for you time and help,,,,steve. Re you in ontaio canada or ontario calif?
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 06:04 AM
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Metal temperature can be a major factor in what you are experiencing. As far as the other cluster being on a vertical surface, this is less common but with condition not being ideal (not in a booth, intermittent, non consistent air flow and less than controllable temperatures) virtually any type of problem from fish eyes to dirt/dust and solvent popping is possible. Just take it slow, eliminate what you can and minimize the rest variables. I've painted in everything from air conditioned down drafts with humidity control to a dirt floor with a plastic curtain drawn around the vehicle (that one turned out pretty good until the German Shepard came in for a visit...LOL) and in all cases, a good painter eliminates what potential problem areas he can to achieve the best paint job possible. The problems that your having can be looked at like a PITA, which they are, or take this experience as learning and when you apply what you've learned here, the chances of it happening again are much less. If they do, you will know what to look for.

Ontario Canada Steve, for a little while longer, hope to be moving back out west soon.

Ray
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 06:17 AM
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I actually end up in toronto from time to time. Calgary, edmonton, regina, sakatoon and a few other canadian cities as well. llI let you know how it goes this morning
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Old 06-11-2013, 06:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benchracer1 View Post
I actually end up in toronto from time to time. Calgary, edmonton, regina, sakatoon and a few other canadian cities as well. llI let you know how it goes this morning
I've lived in all of the cities you mentioned except Toronto and Regina...Edmonton still feels like home to me....Yes, please let me know how you make out, I'll check my messages from time to time this morning in case you may need some advice.

Damn close on the spelling of Saskatoon...now try spelling Saskatchewan...bet you can't do it...LOL

Ray
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