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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 09:25 AM
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stii gettin em, almost immediatly on first. both horizntal and vertical, Switching to a slow reducer and turning the air down. Sholud i stop or throw another coat on? Paint is already mixed

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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 09:34 AM
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If your still getting them it sounds like contamination...as I mentioned it's difficult to tell from pictures. First thing to do is put your paint in the fridge, if it's in the gun, you can put the entire gun in the fridge, the cooler temperature will slow down the activation...now, if the substrate is cured, you could use some reducer and take off the paint you just applied (hopefully it's not a large area) if it is a large area, you may need to let it cure and start again. If you can remove the paint, after it's cleaned of, let it sit so that the reducer has dried, scuff the area, clean it with Wax and Grease Remover, let it sit until dry and try a small area where your having the problems by apply a light coat over that area only, if you aren't getting the reaction, let it flash and give it a heavier coat....then finish the panel...like I say, if it's the same area, it does sound more like contamination, even though in the pictures it looks like solvent popping.

I'll stay by my computer, let me know how you make out.
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  #63 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 10:49 AM
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I actually took the remaining paint with the slow reducer and sprayed the fenders. No problem. gonna put 1 more coat on them and call it good,
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 11:06 AM
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Glad to hear that your finally at the end of this ordeal...If push comes to shove, you could cut and buff those areas seeing that it's a solid color. I wish I could have been more help but with situations like this it's so hard to give concrete advice unless your actually there.

Best to you my Friend.

Ray
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Old 06-11-2013, 12:30 PM
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The fenders came out beautiful (truth be known i did have 1 large run. Fortunately theselast couple months I have become proficient in removing runs). The doors di have a bit more orange peel than I would like. Pics dont really show it. It is probably just a bit worse than some factory paint. I am probably going to lightly colorsand the vhicle and give it a light polish. I still have to reshoot the shell. I hope to god that the reducer was the problem. I have been colorsnding and polishing as follows. Wetsand 1000, 1500, 2000. i then use wool pad with meguiars 85 followed by a foam pad with meguiars 83, Does that sound about right?. Thanks for you help it is so appreciated. I feel like a pain in the *** asking so many questions. One more, how long does that paint flow for and how long bfore colorsanding can begin?
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 04:44 PM
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Congrats...sounds like it's all coming together. As far as polishing goes, what your doing will work well. There are many different techniques to polishing. I use 3M's Perfect-it system along with their reversible foam pads. That's what works for me, Meguiar's makes excellent products as well, so what your doing is correct. You can finish sanding finer if you like but not needed.

As far as color sanding...your paint stopped flowing probably 15-20 minutes after you put it on, depending on reducer/hardner you used and how much paint you put on. I usually give paint 2 full days cure time before I start polishing, that's enough time for it to set up but not so long that it cat be cut by a good compound.

Runs...if a painter claims that they have never gotten a run, they haven't painted long enough.

Don't worry about the questions, just happy to help.

Ray
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  #67 (permalink)  
Old 06-11-2013, 10:53 PM
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I am going to go out and reprep the offending panels in the morning. So far i have lightly wetsanded with 400 to remove the pop marks. I spread a very light guide coat to make sure i dont miss anything. I am going to assume on the side of caution that the panel is contaminated. what is the correct sequence? My plan is a good sanding with 400 with dawn dishsoap and water followed by a pass with gray scotchrite. then wipe down the entire panel with paper towel and drinking water to remove any soap residue. I am going to leave the car in the sun the rest of the day. In the evening wipe it down with wax and grease remover. Thursday morning tack rag and spray. I intend to shoot the area of problem and see what happens. Let it flash and go for it. running low on material and really dont want to screw up any more, I really want to remove this as a variable
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  #68 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2013, 07:14 AM
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It's always difficult to give the soundest advice posible when your not there and have the advantage of physically seeing the problem. What your going to do is great, your doing virtually everything possible to eliminate contamination...I do have a question...the paper towels your using, what kind are they, please don't say "Bounty" or "Kitchen Catch All"...that type of thing. The towels you use are very important and you need to use the towels that are designed for the job.

With the problems that you've been having, it may be a good idea to go over the surface twice with Wax and Grease remover...When your done, blow dry the area, let it sit for 20 minutes (just to be on the safe side).

Contamination has been plaguing painters since the dawn of when painting began. An old trick to stop wrinkling and minimize contamination was to spray a very light coat...a mist coat...over the suspect area, let it flash followed by 2 heavier coats for flow. The idea behind this is that the contaminated area would be sealed off or bridged...does it work? This technique has bailed me out of a few jambs in the past (mostly back in the lacquer primer days)...with all the problems it might be worth a try.

To every painter that has painted for any serious amount of time...it seems every once in a while that car shows up that no matter what you do problems, arise. You can't keep the paint clean, contamination, runs, blotchy color, poor flow...and...the next one turns out virtually problem free...Why? Don't know, it just happens and all you can do is minimize the chances of it happening again...get it done and move on to the next job. Just like a Goaltender in Hockey getting blown out in a 6 - 0 loss one game and he bounces back the next game and gets the win, so it is with painting. You have done a good job minimizing, I'm sure your going to get that win.

Ray
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  #69 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2013, 07:39 AM
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I am guilty of the paper towels. For wiping it with water I used kitchen towels. For the wax and grease remover i used blue painters paper tiwel from tcp global. I will also refrain from the kitchen towels. Also sent you a pm
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  #70 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2013, 09:32 AM
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I have received your PM...and my most sincere Thank You.

Yes, refrain from the kitchen paper towels, on the other side of the coin, we ran out of kitchen paper towels at my house a while back and I gave my wife a role of my shop towels that I use for wiping a car down before I paint. Big mistake, or was it, it seems they work better in the kitchen as well as in the shop. It was however pointed out and justified to me why the shop towels are better in the kitchen and around the entire house...even better than "The Quicker Picker Upper". They are lint free and work great on mirrors, no streaks...also, my wife now refuses to use the regular dish cloth for dishes...I introduced her to 3M's Micro Fiber towels and that's all that apparently works now...LOL.

I guess it goes both ways...LOL

Ray
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  #71 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2013, 01:47 PM
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LOL!!
I know what you mean, my wife uses more
"wax & grease remover" than me for kitchen cleaning.
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  #72 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2013, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcclark View Post
LOL!!
I know what you mean, my wife uses more
"wax & grease remover" than me for kitchen cleaning.
Yes, I've made the mistake of repairing a few things around the house with panel bonding adhesive...I would save up the broken crap laying around the house, picture frames, a plastic fan, an attachment for the vacuum etc., just save up all the stuff and when I would be using body panel adhesive in the shop, I'd fix all the little things and save a few bucks not having to replace them.

One day I came in the house with a box full of repaired items and my wife was amazed. Now, that sounds great, except for her telling her family, showing the neighbors on the phone to her friends...I soon became "take it to Ray, he can fix anything". Which I don't mind...once in a while but, when it got to the point where the value the adhesive was more than the value of what I was repairing I had to slow it down and explain.

Now I still get a few requests but it's controlled...LOL

Ray
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2013, 11:55 PM
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I was planning on respraying the affected panels and I noticed when i was snding with the guidecoat that there are alot of pinholes. At this point i am not sure if they are a result of the defects in the paint or the cause.alot of these are only visible with a magnifying glass. I may reguide coat and sand one more time. i wonder if the pinholes were actually in the first paint job and I did not catch it during sanding. At any rate the pinholes need to go. Any easiter way of finding pinholes short of going over the whole car with a magnifying glass. They seem to small for the guidecoat to show them.
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2013, 05:26 AM
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In a perfect world, the paint would be sanded down, the contaminated area would be built up again and the problem would go away.

One of the biggest nemesis that can be found in this trade is pin holes. If you remember in one of my previous posts, I asked if there was body filler under the paint that this imperfection occurred as "Pin holes" usually start out in Body Filler. They are hard to detect...unless you use guide coat on your filler...they are most commonly caused by stirring the hardner into the filler as opposed to folding the hardner into the filler.

Now that being said, the response that came back was that if there was filler in that area it would be very thin...most often pin holes in filler need a bit of depth in the filler to form as they are air bubbles in the filler with the top knocked of by sanding.

At this point we want the problem to go away...so if your noticing pin holes in your paint, be they solvent popping or whatever...the other problem you have is that the car is white, this makes problem areas less visible...you can use a putty over top of the affected area, squeeze the putty into the holes (I have used a razor blade or a thin plastic spreader)...block sand with guide coat to make sure that the holes stay filled and paint. Sikken's makes a putty specifically for pin holes called "Combie" but any putty will improve the finish.

I don't know if the pin holes in your paint where caused by pin holes in filler, or , solvent popping, or contamination...this remedy will improve your finish without stripping the area to find the original problem.

Ray
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2013, 12:29 PM
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I was actually thinking of going around the vehicle with 320 and then 400. I figure the 320 will remove alot of material and possiblyany pinholes I cant see. Good idea or more work than its worth? I am amazed how smooth and flat it gets using guide coat. Randome question here. If you are using black paint and want to guide coat it do you use white?
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