Big Block vs Small Block Chevy - Page 2 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Engine
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2002, 08:57 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Southern USA
Posts: 61
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

Critter, what is the difference between a 454 and a 427? Aren't they based on the same block? What about the infamous Chevy LS-6 motor from the 1970’s?

Based on the LS-6 data which was rated at 450 hp and enough torque to out-pull a Powerstroke diesel, your comparison of two Chevrolet engines that share basically the same block is not valid.

If you assemble both engines from the ground up with comparable parts the 454 will make more power and torque. It is a basic rule of physics and it all equates to displacement.

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2002, 09:59 AM
F-1Rodder's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 517
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

Readers challenge: This dispute will go on as long as blocks are available.

My suggestion to bigjoedo is to take an afternoon and go to your local "run what you brung" bracket racing drag strip and see what kind of perfomance is available. Take a notebook and note the car descriptions and note what times they are running. You will see that the big motors run faster...usually. You will also find that there are some really fast 355's and some really fast 383's.

I have absolutely no reservation that you can build an unstroked 355 that will burn the tires off that car, even as heavy as it is if you are willing to spend the money.

It is also my opinion that there is more bang for the buck in a 383 stroker up to about 450 hp compared to building a similarly perfoming big block. Big blocks cost more and you will know this in the end of a BB buildup. If you want to build the ultimate high winding super grunt strip terror motor, big block is the platform.

Speed is money, how fast do you wish to go? Look at <a href="http://www.speedomotive.com" target="_blank">www.speedomotive.com</a> for 383 kits.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2002, 10:54 PM
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 25
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

you already have the 350. if it's going tobe daily driven then go with what you got. there's a reason why the 350's so popular. it's cheap to get, cheap to mod and produces good power numbers. sure you might miss out on some crazy torque but who cares, you're going to be running 411's that'ill make up for it easy. everything about the big block is going to cost you more including the fuel tanker that you'ill need to follow you around. go with the 350 you won't regret it ever.
__________________
it's all good as long it's not a Honda
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2002, 10:57 PM
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 25
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Talking

hey liquid_larry you can bore a small block out to 454 cubes. it's been done and documented by one of the mags i read (hot rod or car craft??). it's probably pretty finiky but high reving 454 small block has got to go pretty damn fast
__________________
it's all good as long it's not a Honda
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 04-19-2002, 02:44 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: little rock,ark.
Posts: 123
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Wink

bigjoedo,hey! are you all confuzzed now? i know iam! what do you want to do?what do you want? if you want something you can light up the tires on command with and not get radical in the build process go with the big block ! i have both and though everyone allways try to point out the dollar difference.....well phooey,you are not doing this to save money! if you want to save money dont spend it!liste guy ,even a relatively mild built 454 will put the hurt on a 350 that is not so mild mannered[read cost more to get there!] so,if you decide to go big give me aholler,see ya! jimm
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 04-19-2002, 08:55 PM
1meancuda's Avatar
At a loss for words
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Northern Wisconsin
Posts: 364
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

If your simply looking at the tire smoking aspect, I can light up the tires with my stock 3100 V6...... I don't think an engine's worth is measured in tire squealing capabilities. Just something to think about.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 04-20-2002, 03:46 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: little rock,ark.
Posts: 123
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Wink

dear mr. cuda,please forgive my simplistic approach,as i did'nt mean to imply that such abilities are a good indicator of an engines merit!by the way, how big a tire/s and for how long/far?[no brakes now!] see ya !,jimm

[ April 20, 2002: Message edited by: jimm ]</p>
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2002, 09:46 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: waterman,ill
Posts: 87
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

PCHotrod, equating a 454 to a 427 is like equating a 454 to a 366. They are all BBC based engines. However I dont recall GMC using a 454 in anything bigger than a 1ton truck.(just an observation)(by the way last no.s I saw theres a 6cyld under 6L producing more power than the ford diesel)

everyone else, big blocks are definately torky motors, but that is where the benefit ends on the street. the small block offers so much more on the street. The biggest is economy. But its your money and my opinion.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 05-03-2002, 03:34 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Southern USA
Posts: 61
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

From my experiences with big block and small block engines you will always have to incorporate more radical parts into a small block to achieve the same output of a mildly modified big block.

As the saying goes, "No replacement for displacement".

A good example would be to compare a big block and a small block engine with nearly the same horsepower and torque.

I did some calculations based on engine size, horsepower and cost of the engine by dividing the cost of the crate engine by the horsepower output. The results are interesting. This calculation gives you a cost per horsepower.

Chevy 502ci Ram Jet, 502hp/567ft-lb of tq cost $7095 = $14.13 per hp

Chevy ZZ 502ci base kit, 502hp/567ft-lb of tq cost $5850 = $11.65 per hp


Chevy 383 stroker, 325hp/415ft-lb of tq cost $3975 = 11.31 per hp

Chevy Ram Jet 350ci, 350hp/400ft-lb of tq cost $4525 = $12.93 per hp

Chevy 502ci, 338hp/512ft-lb of tq cost $5295 = $15.67 per hp

Chevy 350ci HO, 330hp/380ft-lb of tq cost $2495 = $7.56 per hp

The last crate motor listed as the Chevy 350ci HO is the best bang for the buck.

Keep is mind that some of these engines are not as complete as some of the others.

This is the links to the websites where these engines are sold.

The ZZ 502 is also an awesome deal!

http://www.greenwoodchevy.com/engine1.htm

Another thing you must realize is that in comparison horsepower is cheap and strength is expensive.

Allot of companies sell 400 plus horsepower small block engines that are assembled with lesser parts making them more prone to failure if stressed.

Sure, your engine has 400 hp but how long will it last?

Big block engines are built with strength in mind and are able to withstand abuse more so than a small block.

Thus to get reliable high horsepower out of a small block you have to sink a pretty fair amount of money into it and will most probably come up short on the horsepower and torque department.

A 500 hp small block will be less street-able than a 500 hp big block since the level of modifications to the small block will be much greater in order to build the horsepower to that level.

In essence, the small block will be a more radical setup directed more at the strip than at the street.

In an effort to wrap this up, if you want big reliable horsepower there is only one way to go.

[ May 03, 2002: Message edited by: PC Hotrod ]</p>
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 05-03-2002, 01:35 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: little rock,ark.
Posts: 123
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thumbs up

bigjoe,hey! i'm with pchotrod on this subject.a very streetable 500 hp big block with mild manners is easier to come by than a 500 horse small block[speaking naturally aspirated] i've read the mags,seen hp to dollar comparos and when i've built my own its come the way i've told you!there is no substitute for cubic inches at this level!granted ,there will be a difference in fuel consumption[at least in my experience]but that is life ,tradeoffs are part of everything we do.my advice is to go with what you feel most convinced [that is to say most confident ] in and then learn!you are probably going to do this again and each time can be a growth process.best of fortune!holler if you need to,see ya!jimm
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 05-03-2002, 05:33 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: TEXAS
Posts: 32
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

That 325hp seems low for a 383, it is real easy to get 400+ hp with a 383 without getting too radical. My 383 is getting real close to 500hp but I will admit it is pretty radical but alot of fun.
Thanks
Drifter
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2002, 10:48 AM
1meancuda's Avatar
At a loss for words
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Northern Wisconsin
Posts: 364
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

jimm, I was in the parking lot of my church and my wife's cousin was saying it can't be done. Well, I'm never one to turn down a dare, so I dropped it in the lowest gear I could and mashed the pedal. Well, there were people all around and I didn't feel like getting a lecture from the wife, so I had to let up. I left a mark about 2 1/2 feet long though.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2002, 03:51 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: little rock,ark.
Posts: 123
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

mean man,i mean cuda man, no! i mean imeancuda man!i'm still giggling,sounds like your church is a good place, if they dont excommunicate ya or just kick youse out they must be ok!cudaman you get high marks for the humor,but the 2.5 ft. strip [think you could have made 20?]dont get it. tell you something funny,or sort of anyway.my son and i built engines [i forget, should that be motors?,oh well, i'll just ask chuck]his a 454 .30 over, mine a 350 .40 over. to make a long story a little shorter, i'll cut to the chase. that big block kicks my sb's derriere[*** ].we spent about the same dollars[i know, i was paying for both!]and had pretty much the same things done.we are also running the same gear ratios on almost identical rides.one major difference, he's running 36 tires and i'm running 35 inch tires[his measure 36 inches on the truck, mine measure 34 inches on the truck] i know that we all have preferences and generally folks are hard to convince to try something different.and for sure ,my experience is not all encompassing!!thats why i suggested that bigjoe jump in and get his feet wet and grow from there.i've yet to build one that even before it was installed i did'nt have things in mind that i would change on the next one.thanks for the laughs,you the man!see ya,jimm oh yeah,his 454plus will turn over those 36 tall 14.50 wides for about60 ft!hubba!

[ May 04, 2002: Message edited by: jimm ]</p>
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 05-05-2002, 03:40 PM
1meancuda's Avatar
At a loss for words
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Northern Wisconsin
Posts: 364
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Post

jimm, I didn't even have 20 feet to fully work with! My in-laws were sitting in their car about 20-25 feet ahead of mine. I'll try to see how far I can really get that mark up to! The squeal was fairly loud. Loud enough for everyone outside to turn and see the smile on my face! To tell you the honest truth, I think it was one of the first times I ever even tried to squeal the tires on the 'ole girl. Maybe a build-up of my 3100 is in order?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 05-05-2002, 04:40 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: little rock,ark.
Posts: 123
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Talking

cuda,the man!no,no,no,tempting as it don't put the dinero in the family ride.best to put it in that meancuda.i think thats what you want to do anyway! and besides,all that family ride business was for fun! isaac,you have an honorable name,and i already know you attend a place to worship.god bless you and yours!!my place is your place!see ya! jimm
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Engine posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:23 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.