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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
You do not have to remove all of the other plugs.
making sure I got this right....

disconnect the distributor battery lead, and remove the spark plug for the cylinder i'm trying to test. Install the fitting and give it a crank... 4 compression strokes or until the needle stops rising, Correct ?

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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 08:49 PM
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I always disable the ignition, and hold the throttle wide open, and crank it over six times.
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Old 09-22-2008, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
I always disable the ignition, and hold the throttle wide open, and crank it over six times.
Will do... I recruited the wife... I'll be back in about 30 minutes with a report.
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 09:03 PM
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Just in case you have trouble getting some baffles from edelbrock..
Spectre makes a rubber grommet for the valve cover with the baffle molded in.

http://www.spectreperformance.com/#CATALOG.5333


A quick googly search for "baffled grommet" showed me that moroso and mr gasket make them too.
Sometimes the grommet type will clear big rockers and high lift cams where the baffle won't always clear. (the grommet fits between the rockers.)

You can also make one from 20 gauge steel or aluminum..It's just a plate with the edges bent up.

Later, mikey
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  #65 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 09:11 PM
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If you are doing a compression check, remove ALL PLUGS, lock throttle wide open, pull off BATT wire off HEI, screw in compression gauge into each hole and do all cylinders noting, pressure on first stroke and then best compression on that cylinder.

First stroke tells you the kind of volume the cylinder is displacing and condition of compression rings. Subsequent strokes will deminish pressure per stroke as test goes on, and gauge reveals total pressure. An good compression engine with minimum wear should be within 5 to 8 % of the best and worst cylinders. Spiking indicates different problems.

The problem you are having with #2 cylinder could be anything from a guide to a cracked cylinder wall. Look at the compression test first.
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Old 09-22-2008, 09:25 PM
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Here is what I came up with:

The #2 read constantly at 120 after 3 tests....


Moved on to the #4 cylinder and that read at 125 after 3 tests:
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Old 09-22-2008, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alittle1
If you are doing a compression check, remove ALL PLUGS, lock throttle wide open, pull off BATT wire off HEI, screw in compression gauge into each hole and do all cylinders noting, pressure on first stroke and then best compression on that cylinder.

First stroke tells you the kind of volume the cylinder is displacing and condition of compression rings. Subsequent strokes will deminish pressure per stroke as test goes on, and gauge reveals total pressure. An good compression engine with minimum wear should be within 5 to 8 % of the best and worst cylinders. Spiking indicates different problems.

The problem you are having with #2 cylinder could be anything from a guide to a cracked cylinder wall. Look at the compression test first.

will removing all the plugs drastically affect the readings?
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  #68 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by powerrodsmike
Just in case you have trouble getting some baffles from edelbrock..
Spectre makes a rubber grommet for the valve cover with the baffle molded in.

http://www.spectreperformance.com/#CATALOG.5333


A quick googly search for "baffled grommet" showed me that moroso and mr gasket make them too.
Sometimes the grommet type will clear big rockers and high lift cams where the baffle won't always clear. (the grommet fits between the rockers.)

You can also make one from 20 gauge steel or aluminum..It's just a plate with the edges bent up.

Later, mikey
Good lookin out Mikey
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  #69 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 10:28 PM
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Those compression readings are a bit low for a somewhat fresh motor, 170-200 is a good reading for a fairly stock, fresh motor. I'm guessing that either the rings didn't seat, or got gummed up with oil from the unbaffled pvc, or you have some loose valve guides, which let the valves get burned. Or maybe the valve seats got all gummed up from the oil, and they burned from trying to close on the carboned up smegma from burnt oil..As your problem occurred over time, I'd bet valves are the culprit.

You can put a couple of squirts of engine oil in the spark plug hole, and re test, if the compression comes up 10 or 20 PSI, that indicates rings are the prob, if the compression does not come up, then it says valves are leaky.

You can also make a poor man's leakdown tester to isolate or confirm/disallow those theories., Take the hose from the compression tester, connect it to your air compressor,(if you have one), then put the cylinder at exactly top dead center, with both valves for that cylinder closed...Put some pressure in the cylinder,(if the crank turns, reset it back on TDC and try again..sometimes I leave the breaker bar on the balancer bolt and jammed into the frame to keep the crank from turning), ..Once the cylinder has pressure, you can listen for the air leaks at the carb throat, with the throttle open,(intake valve is NG,) the crankcase,(listen with a tube at the oil return holes with your valve covers off, that will say rings), or at the exhaust port....(ex valve leaking).


None of this sound good.


Mikey
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Last edited by powerrodsmike; 09-22-2008 at 10:34 PM.
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  #70 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 10:38 PM
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Hey Mikey, You forgot to mention, that to use the hose from the compression tester, you have to remove the schrader valve from the end of the hose so the air will pass through it.
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  #71 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 10:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
Hey Mikey, You forgot to mention, that to use the hose from the compression tester, you have to remove the schrader valve from the end of the hose so the air will pass through it.

I was testing sin7......

Good call I forgot about that.

Does the rest of my post sound reasonable? To me, although the unbaffled PVC is creating an oil burning problem, it's sounding like something the machine shop might have done, especially if it's found that the guides were too loose, (or a smidge too tight), it's hard to tell that though, without knowing how many miles since the rebuild, and what kind of assembly lube was used,(did the bores get dry after sitting for 2 years?).


He said it ran good, but how much driving was done on the open headers..I know that long tubes are usually no prob, but shorties could let cold air back up the header, and mess with an exhaust valve..He said the prob started when the exhaust and valve covers got put on, was that a short time into it's life, or was the motor run a bunch before with no problems.


The second part of the compression test will reveal alot.


You are way better at the motor stuff than me, I'm just tossing the things I'd think of out there.


Mikey
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  #72 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 10:51 PM
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well

looking at the spark plug, it's kinda clean so it's probably coming from other than the intake runners.

i mean if you were trying to ignite an oily mix the plugs would tell you about it. And this stuff is pouring out the pipe, looks unburnt on your finger.

what's the color code/brand for that engine paint ? if you don't mind...it's the same color as my chris craft 327's.

take it easy with the carb spray on the rockers, too. if you are using the o-ring valve stem seals, the carb spray could eat them up a little and you'll get oil runnin down the valve stems.

And the compression may very well be low on #2 because the gunk around the exhaust valve is preventing a seal.


I'm leavin now. Good Luck.


Enjoy
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 10:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sin7
will removing all the plugs drastically affect the readings?
There is less resistance on the turning mechanism, you are better able to isolate a cylinder or cross cylinder problem, ie. blown head gasket, etc.
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2008, 11:02 PM
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I've been following this whole post, and there's 2 things that kinda stick out which haven't been addressed. #1- How much actual running time is on this engine so far -namely;is it even "broken-in" enough yet for the rings to have fully seated? and #2- I saw the mention of "only synthetic oil" which makes me wonder if that was (attempted to be) used for break-in. I only mention these two things because of the fact that I see no further explanation on either of these matters after the first casual mention of either one. Both could have a significant impact, but obviously a baffled valvecover issue will need to be addressed. Also, what compression ratio was this engine built to? If it's a 10.5:1 then yes that 120-125 psi comp.test reading would be terrible, but if 8.0:1 then a 120-125 reading wouldn't be so far off the norm. I don't mean to interfere at all, I'm just wondering if this engine has been broken-in all the way yet, or at least enough for the rings to have fully seated, and if perhaps it was attempted to break it in with full-synthetic oil (which most folks would consider to be a pretty big no-no!). I hope that it doesn't turn out to be a major problem for you, as I know what a P.I.T.A. that can be, so here's hoping it turns out alright for you. -Jim
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Old 09-22-2008, 11:06 PM
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[QUOTE=seven up]well

looking at the spark plug, it's kinda clean so it's probably coming from other than the intake runners.

i mean if you were trying to ignite an oily mix the plugs would tell you about it. And this stuff is pouring out the pipe, looks unburnt on your finger.


And the compression may very well be low on #2 because the gunk around the exhaust valve is preventing a seal.


Two excellent points! Give the man a gold star. If the oil was coming from the rings it would be burned during combustion and the plugs would show it. The valve stem is heavily ladden with oily crust and the exhaust port is just as bad. The engine just never got hot enough in the open header mode because they were probably just short sprints and the oil exited really fast out of the engine and never got a chance to burn it like it did with the full headers and exhaust on.

Your next step will be removing the head, like it or not. This isn't some external fix where you force a can of DR. Good Stuff down the carb , and its fixed.
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