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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2006, 08:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adtkart
You obviously have alot to learn, besides the proper way to do body work.
?????? What exactly did I say that was wrong?!

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2006, 08:38 PM
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Hey no ill feelings here!

May take you up on the offer. (Nov)

Problem with these places is a lot of bad advice can get posted and the experienced ones over look it but someone trying to learn can get into a major screw up.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2006, 08:41 PM
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Still trying to figure out where I "screwed up". Are you saying it is a "bad " idea to sand before you glaze??
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Old 10-05-2006, 08:47 PM
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See Barry changed his post and avoided a pee'n match. Maybe you took my post wrong, but I do apply fillers over epoxy without sanding, did it all the time at a place that did boat parts and also will on stuff I do at home. At home, if the epoxy has sat for a quite a few hours before I get to applying filler, I will scuff it up a little with 180. I know its not needed, but do it for my own piece of mind. So many years of making sure every square inch of a car is sanded so paint adheres and when starting out almost everyone was still applying filler over ground metal, Applying over a coarse grinding scratch get implanted into your head. But then again, lots of people still were using lacquer primers at that time. Things change. I guess I am just paranoid and have to cover my arse and it can bug me if I don't scuff it up if its been sitting for awhile. I also spend time sanding areas that are covered that you won't ever see, if I don't that bugs me too. At work its different though, cause trying to meet hours on many lowballed estimates.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2006, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adtkart
If it isn't necessary to sand before the next step, it saves me work.

Aaron

See, That sales rep attitude in you too! "Less work" is not always the best way to do evrything. I do "more work" to be sure. As far as me not being up to date, I assure you I am.

But, Hey thanks for your input.
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Old 10-05-2006, 09:02 PM
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CMC, If you catch the epoxy within it's recoat window there is absolutely no reason to sand it before applying plastic fillers. Epoxy and polyesters work well together and the bond between them is far better than filler directly over steel. Do some testing and see for yourself. If the epoxy is only one day old there's absolutely no reason to scuff, if it's older than a day then I usually scuff it up with 180 just to break the surface.

I often times shoot two coats of epoxy then allow it to set overnight, next day shoot 2-3 coats of polyester primer without scuffing the epoxy. Then block the panel and if any low areas I'll then skim those with plastic filler. Doing it this way saves some major time sanding and all the products work extremely well togther. The final priming and blocking is done with a urethane surfacer and never any shrinkage problems.
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Old 10-05-2006, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colormecrazy
You may have heard of Caliber Collision of Colleyville. I painted about 7 cars a day there for many years.

PRO-CO before it was bought out? Right?
You may want to keep that little nugget of information under your hat.
Caliber Collision Centers are not considered top notch body shops in most parts of the country.....especially Texas.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not talking about your work (I'm sure you do fine work) just Caliber in general.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2006, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank F
PRO-CO before it was bought out? Right?
You may want to keep that little nugget of information under your hat.
Caliber Collision Centers are not considered top notch body shops in most parts of the country.....especially Texas.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not talking about your work (I'm sure you do fine work) just Caliber in general.
The Caliber organization is my biggest reason for no longer being there. The original shop name of my employment was "Colleyville Classic" we had all the local high line European Dealerships trust in the day (that specific shop is still not too shabby). The shop actually was owned by a gentlemen who was a Chairman of ASE. We held national records for Insurance flag hours per square-foot of shop space. And had lots of excellence awards. Thus, Caliber (out of California) bought "Colleyville Classic and FortWorth Classic" for there Original 2 Shops in Texas. To build on what is now like 30 shops.
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Old 10-06-2006, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adtkart
You obviously have alot to learn, besides the proper way to do body work.
Yup. It's like they say, It's what you learn after you know everything that counts.
Bob
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Old 10-06-2006, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colormecrazy
The Caliber organization is my biggest reason for no longer being there. The original shop name of my employment was "Colleyville Classic" we had all the local high line European Dealerships trust in the day (that specific shop is still not too shabby). The shop actually was owned by a gentlemen who was a Chairman of ASE. We held national records for Insurance flag hours per square-foot of shop space. And had lots of excellence awards. Thus, Caliber (out of California) bought "Colleyville Classic and FortWorth Classic" for there Original 2 Shops in Texas. To build on what is now like 30 shops.
I know a guy that sweeps the floor for GM but that doesn't make him a car designer.
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Old 10-06-2006, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob C
I know a guy that sweeps the floor for GM but that doesn't make him a car designer.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2006, 05:03 PM
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KOOL! I'm just trying to make it understood that I have painted since '88. And it has been a long learning curve already for me. I've gained alot of quality oriented experience. I don't think that I should be dogged for saying sand the darn epoxy before you glaze it. Once again I ask is sanding it "wrong"? And, in my case I usually spray very large groups of bare steel parts at a time. The chance of my getting to glaze the entire mess with in the window is slim. Thus, I sand it before I glaze it. Scrubbing over it with 80 can aid in finding low spots in need of glaze. Sorry to be the horses butt, but I don't think it's bad to advise sanding epoxy before you glaze. Is reapplying epoxy after body-work OK? I find that I expose metal when I do my body work. So, I choose to reapply epoxy before I prime with a urethane primer. I hope that doesn't get me thrashed on too.

As for the GM comment, I say I've painted for many years, that makes me a painter... ...apples and oranges dude!
Actually at age 12 I sweeped a machine shop for a job, ...that makes me a machinist too. HE HE !

I always state that I'm giving an opinion, not the law. Maybe looking at things from all sides is not so bad. That's the advantage of these come one, come all forums, The more input we get from every angle the more knowledge we obtain. Let's not rail-road one another for having different opinions. I apologize for my ill outburst, but hey guys I KNOW I can paint. I prove it every chance I get! And I love to finish-out a sweet ride! I've lost my backside on sweet custom work, because of customers running out of money, but my passion forcing me to finish the job, "right". I've put tears in customers eyes. Making people look twice, that's what it's all about to me!

Keep the automotive faith folks!
Good grief!
Be happy!
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2006, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Everglase needs a mechanical tooth (scratches) to hold on to
Thats the only statement that is really wrong that you said. Its not wrong advice telling someone to sand, and normally state if you are in doubt, scuff up the epoxy, its not wrong or bad advice to error on the side of being safe. Lots of people are good painters on here and have been painting for a long time, they just don't feel the need to say how great they are. Bad Bob for example, Just getting a glimpse of his work he's posted a time or two and reading what others that had work done by him had posted on a different forum, he wasn't even involved in the thread. He gives a ton of good advice, and never once have I heard him tell someone how great he is or I've been painting since such and such and worked at such and such shop, and so on and so on. I've only been painting since 91 professionaly but first started experimenting in 1986 or so with centari. Does this necessarily make me a better painter then a guy who has only been painting a year or two, heck no. I've made enough mistakes and will continue to make them. Now I just do bodywork during the day and just paint at home. I haven't painted cars in a shop for awhile, but did for quite a few years. It doesn't make a difference how long you have been painting. Some are just naturals and can do an awesome job right off the bat. Having an open mind and being willing to accept new things and adapt and learn is what makes someone a good painter IMO, and there is always someone as good or better then you.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2006, 05:34 PM
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Totally agree with you Kenseth! Sorry, I'm not trying to be bostfull. I'm just a newby on this forum, guess maybe I'm trying to give some back-ground. Because, I got all flustered. You guys that have been here a while, surely you seen that happen before. Guess I kind-a take the stuff too serious sometimes, but, my reputation and abilities do pay my bills.

Big Hug everybody!
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2006, 05:54 PM
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No problem color, I agree with what you say the majority of the time. But its bad news if someone starts boasting. Its great to be confident in your work, and I see why you wanted to defend yourself after the backlash. Yes I've seen it before, in fact a heck of a lot worst. Some may remember paint tech instructor, this ain't nothing. The problem with paint tech instructor was he didn't know his arse from a hole in the ground but was constantly saying he was the best. I've gotten beat up on things a few times, mainly when I first joined, just like a lot of others have at times, so don't take it too hard. Just remain somewhat humble, give the best advice you can, and realize everyone isn't going to agree with you all the time, and you'll be okay.
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