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Old 10-24-2010, 03:17 AM
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bypass CCC EST HEI distrib ? which wires?

i once read somewhere you can somehow bypass or make the CCC EST style HEi disitributors run without the ECM by changing or connecting together a couple of the module wires

does anyone remember which ones? or how?

this CCC HEi distrib has vac advance and mechanical weights also.

but is CCC

such as the 1103465 ones are.

1982 1985 years.

i basically want to make it run totally off the vac and mech advance controls without any ECM input for the timing control

i separated the big flat black ignition module connector coming out of the distrib base on pass side,
but it wont start or run with that connector apart,,

so hmm,,

thanks for anything.

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Old 10-24-2010, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast68
i once read somewhere you can somehow bypass or make the CCC EST style HEi disitributors run without the ECM by changing or connecting together a couple of the module wires

does anyone remember which ones? or how?

this CCC HEi distrib has vac advance and mechanical weights also.

but is CCC

such as the 1103465 ones are.

1982 1985 years.

i basically want to make it run totally off the vac and mech advance controls without any ECM input for the timing control

i separated the big flat black ignition module connector coming out of the distrib base on pass side,
but it wont start or run with that connector apart,,

so hmm,,

thanks for anything.
As I noted in your carb post, if the distributor has vac and mechanical advance, it is NOT a CCC system and there is no ECU. There is only the ESC anti-knock sensor. You already ARE running on the mechanical and vacuum advance only, except for the knock sensor. Look under the dash. You won't find an ECU unless your truck has Calif emissions, and if it did, it would NOT have a vacuum advance on the distributor. Again, you may want to get a factory service manual and fully understand your vehicle before disconnecting things.
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Old 10-24-2010, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast68
i once read somewhere you can somehow bypass or make the CCC EST style HEi disitributors run without the ECM by changing or connecting together a couple of the module wires

does anyone remember which ones? or how?

this CCC HEi distrib has vac advance and mechanical weights also.

but is CCC

such as the 1103465 ones are.

1982 1985 years.

i basically want to make it run totally off the vac and mech advance controls without any ECM input for the timing control

i separated the big flat black ignition module connector coming out of the distrib base on pass side,
but it wont start or run with that connector apart,,

so hmm,,

thanks for anything.
Disconnect the 4 wire connector at the distributor, jump the pins on the DISTRIBUTOR SIDE connector, pins labeled A and C
This will give you what you are looking for. The system has ESC electronic Spark control which retards the timing when the knock sensor generates a signal (as it will when detonation occurs) and wiring the dizzy in this fashion cuts it out of the loop. Just be sure to recheck/adjust your base timing for a non est spec... say 12 degrees @ 500 rpm W/O vacuum hose connected to start. Then re adjust base idle.
Also for 83 it does show a CCC system in place and there is an ECM. Which means that your carb probably wont work properly( probably doesnt anyhow) with the dizzy unhooked and wired in the fashion I outlined earlier in this post.I do not advocate removing and or tampering with emission devices, and the electronic carb is designed with emission controls in mind, so you should repair it as it is ,but the choice is up to you.good luck
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Old 10-24-2010, 04:04 PM
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the mix solenoid in the carb is dead and does nothing and theres nothing else electronic on the carb, IE no TPS or anything else

the A and C wires are black and green

is this correct?

its hard to keep track of the variants of electronic spark controls and timing they used and kept modifying these years since 80 or so

the problem im having with this truck is that it acts like one xcylinder is not hitting when under load trying to acelerate and go

[i just pulled all the plugs out and they are new but most are very odd looking and the tips are half white clean and the other half are weird dark but ot sooty

one got a small chip out of the center porcelain
and one or two are sooty a little and evenly black unlike the others

what do you think

thanks
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Old 10-24-2010, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast68
the mix solenoid in the carb is dead and does nothing and theres nothing else electronic on the carb, IE no TPS or anything else
One more time then I'm done.

Your truck DOES NOT HAVE CCC.

The mixture control solenoid is "dead" because it doesn't exist. If there is no TPS connector, there is NO computer. Here's a thought: take the air horn off the carb and take a picture of the mixture control solenoid, then post it here. I got $100 that says you won't find one. You won't find an ECU in that truck either, just the ESC module for the knock sensor.

One more thing. All CCC cars and trucks have a green single wire connector in the harness that goes to the M/C solenoid. The connector has nothing plugged into it and is located right in front of the carb. The purpose of this connector is to allow you to connect a dwell meter to the harness and monitor the M/C solenoid duty cycle for adjustment purposes. Please locate this connector on your truck and post a photo of it here also. Non-CCC vehicles don't have the connector.

I don't know how to make this any more clear: You have one of the oddball Q-jets with the dual-volume accelerator pump. It is NOT a CCC vehicle and there is no computer controlling the distributor or the carb.
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Old 10-24-2010, 04:23 PM
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A chipped porcelain can cause a misfire. Carb sounds plugged at least on one side. That "solenoid" is probably an aeneroid for cold start enrichment,if there is no tps.
This would fall in line as to what joe was saying.EST was used on 49 states emission certified vehicles and EST and CCC was used in california certified ( at least in 1982 from what I can find)

Green and black would be correct on those wire colors for terminals A and C

If it were mine I would replace the plugs,bypass the EST as I described and rebuilt the carburetor (most important) as I think your carb is the main problem. JMHO L A TECH
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Old 10-24-2010, 04:45 PM
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yeah i understand the no CCC thing you dont have to keep telling me, i get it, since it has advance weights and vac advance i realize its not CCC i just got ahead of myself without realizing it, my OP above. i knew already from the past years of messing with these when they were lot more common and still running around all over the place, but had forgotten etc. been working on too many new vehicles since then, here at the shop, you tend to forget older stuff as time goes on and older stuff disappears from existence, and therefore none to work on anymore.


and then i was just saying that the solenoid on the top of the carb has never worked as long as ive had the truck here


i jumped the A and C wires and it started right up and is running great at idle, as it always does though

if this didnt fix it then yeah gonna be a carb issue for sure

all compression is perfect all cylinders, timing sitting perfect at idle, vacuum reading perfect also

so...

thanks!
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Old 10-24-2010, 05:05 PM
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83 chevrolet pickup had a mc solenoid.82 back not so.83 did not offer a 350 either just 2 different 305 in a 1/2 ton At least thats the info I have. It may be incomplete but I dont think so. 3/4 ton had 305, 350,454
Maybe your truck has a newer motor than the truck and was never fitted with the correct O E carb from the original engine?
I would like to see a pic of that carb and what is the number on it by the way?
I know what you mean about working on all the new crap being built ,it does take away from the familiarity of the older stuff.I am not much into chevys , but they keep my tools from rusting.
What year chevy is this anyhow?
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Old 10-24-2010, 07:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by latech
83 chevrolet pickup had a mc solenoid.82 back not so.83 did not offer a 350 either just 2 different 305 in a 1/2 ton At least thats the info I have. It may be incomplete but I dont think so. 3/4 ton had 305, 350,454
Maybe your truck has a newer motor than the truck and was never fitted with the correct O E carb from the original engine?
I would like to see a pic of that carb and what is the number on it by the way?
I know what you mean about working on all the new crap being built ,it does take away from the familiarity of the older stuff.I am not much into chevys , but they keep my tools from rusting.
What year chevy is this anyhow?
The truck is an 85 C10 per his other post. The CCC system was only used on Calif emissions vehicles in those years. As I stated in his other thread, 49 state versions of these trucks used a dual-volume accelerator pump. Read the factory service manual for more info about it - the system is explained in detail. The connector looks just like a mixture control solenoid connector on the CCC carbs, but it is NOT a M/C solenoid. This solenoid valve simply switches the size of the accelerator pump shot depending on a coolant temp sensor. It has NO effect on the idle speed, so I'm not sure how you know it's not working. It does not buzz like the M/C solenoid. There is no ECU. The truck DOES have a knock sensor and an ESC module that can modify the distributor advance curve based on the knock sensor. That's all it can do.
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Old 11-10-2010, 06:28 PM
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good info thanks did learn alot here and alot that i had forgotten and etc also,

cali and 48 state do differ quite a bit and this 48 state one i actually never seen many of even here in IL, usually thesde 80s trucks around here all had a knock module and a TPS and such

but this one is one of the very few that ive ever sene that doesnt

even our 85 elky 305 has a full blown ESC and E4ME with TPS in it and was built in mexico i found out, and was brought up here form texas years ago


and this is the way at least 90% of the '80s light duty chevies have been around here that ive ever seen

so this 4.3L '85 one is an oddball and unusual to me

i see 5 pin modules and theres 7 pins one too,

depending on federal, or cali.

the 7 pin ones are the common ones here and this 5 pin one i only have one other of in my parts storage, a v-8 one

thanks thanks
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