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-   -   Cam Selection 292h or XE284 . (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/cam-selection-292h-xe284-227385.html)

stackitup_91 12-20-2012 07:54 AM

Cam Selection 292h or XE284 .
 
I am in the process of doing a SBC build it's a Chevrolet 350 bored over .30, I have 2 valve relief Speed Pro pistons which puts me at 10 to 1 compression
as far as my cylinder heads go I have a set a vortecs with screw in studs ,new guide plates, and also new springs that can handle up to 550 lift.
I have an EdelBrock rpm air gap intake, 1 5/8 hooker headers (shorties),
I was going to use 1.5 ratio full roller rocker arms, my gear ratio is 3.73 the Motor will be going in a 84 z28 Camaro
I wanted your opinion on which cam I should go with the 292H comp cam, or the XE284 comp cam?, and I also wanted to know whether the 1.6 ratio rocker arms will help me? my goal is to get at least 325 horsepower to the wheels..

vinniekq2 12-20-2012 11:38 AM

you are wanting 400 hp with a flat tappet hydraulic cam and small tube headers? Have the heads been ported? at least on the exhaust side? Its possible,I dont see it though

techinspector1 12-20-2012 01:18 PM

Here's a Dynosim I did a while back....
350 SBC L31 heads
Flat tappet hydraulic cam, stock self aligning (SA) rockers, some head work for better springs.
In this build, a tight budget is called for. To that end, use stock self aligning rockers. Lift is under a half inch, so the SA rockers should be OK. Check to see if using a -0.050" lock will be needed to insure the valve tip sticks up far enough above the retainer so that the retainer top surface doesn't get loaded by the side rails of the rail rockers. More on checking clearances, etc. under Resources, below.
Bore the block 0.030", use these or similar 12cc dished pistons w/5.7 rods.
Makes 9.6:1 static compression ratio. Cut block decks to zero and use a 0.040" head gasket.
Use XE274H Comp cam, installed at straight up.
http://www.compcams.com/Company/CC/c...x?csid=87&sb=0
Needs MINIMUM 2200 stall converter.
This cam closes the intake valve at 41 degrees ABDC @0.050" tappet lift and is all the cam you need to pull past the capability of the heads to flow. If you can't get the power you need from 1,800 to 6,000 with this motor, you need a bigger motor and bigger heads, not more cam.
Comp p/n 981 valve springs, p/n 750-16 retainers, p/n 630-16 keepers and stock 1.5 rail rockers. 1.250" springs should be OK because the cam is a moderate grind, hydraulic flat tappet.
Machine the OD of the guide bosses to less than the I.D. of the damper spring and cut for PC-type positive seals.
Cut top of guide for 0.550" play from bottom of retainer to top of guide seal. Pin the pressed-in rocker studs with this kit.
Performance Distributors custom curved HEI distributor, p/n 12720, or build your own from a GM HEI.
http://www.performancedistributors.com/gmssdui.htm
Edelbrock RPM Vortec intake mounting a 750 vacuum secondary carb of your choice. Edelbrock, Rochester 5 psi max at the inlet, Holley 6 psi max at the inlet.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-7116
Performer RPM Vortec w/natural finish: p/n 7116, w/EnduraShine finish: p/n 71164, w/polished finish: p/n 71161, or look for a used manifold on craigslist to save a few shekels.
Long-tube 1-5/8" headers with X or H pipe right after the collectors, 2-1/2" to 3" pipes to the rear through mufflers of your choice.
Use 2200 or looser stall converter, shorter rear gears.
Results
RPM HP TQ
2000 138 364
2500 176 369
3000 224 392
3500 281 421
4000 331 435
4500 370 432
5000 402 422
5500 405 386
6000 375 328
Peak dynamic compression ratio 8.16:1 on KB's calculator.
Peak volumetric efficiency 97.2% @5000

Even with 10.0:1, use the same cam I used here. It will make 8.496:1 Dynamic Compression Ratio. Pay attention to the squish and set it at 0.035" to 0.045". A tight squish is the key to making high cylinder pressure on pump gas without detonation. Throw the shorty headers over the fence and pop for some quality long-tube 1 5/8" headers. I'd just as soon use the stock cast iron manifolds as to use shorties. Bolt on all the air filter element that you have room for. The motor has to breathe to make power, so don't choke it down with some fosdick undersized filter element (I like 14" x 4"). If you have room, 14" x 6" looks really cool in my opinion.
Nova Parts | K & N AIR FILTER ELEMENT 14" X 6" | Classic Industries

One more thing, if you chose those pistons because they were advertised as 10:1, the actual measured SCR will likely be less....and that's OK.

vinniekq2 12-20-2012 04:09 PM

OK,Im going to see if I can pick a fight with Tech?
I look at the iconic LT-1 that makes 370 hp. I see this engine combo as less than an LT-1 so where am I wrong?
Does the engine sim give ideal results based on perfect tune?

techinspector1 12-20-2012 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinniekq2 (Post 1625181)
OK,Im going to see if I can pick a fight with Tech?
I look at the iconic LT-1 that makes 370 hp. I see this engine combo as less than an LT-1 so where am I wrong?
Does the engine sim give ideal results based on perfect tune?

I was told the software assumes "on the money" tune. Also, when I did these sims, I often spent several hours changing this and that to tweak the combination to produce max power. I can offer no rebuttal to the LT-1 power, other than GM rating the engine for less power than it actually made in order to conform to FED regulations or to appease the insurance underwriters. We know the Z-28 made more than 290 hp, but that's where it was rated by the factory.

vinniekq2 12-20-2012 07:50 PM

Tech it looks like we are both conservative but in different ways.You make conservative recommendations and I make conservative estimates for power.I wonder if the two of us could collaborate on a successful build?

techinspector1 12-20-2012 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinniekq2 (Post 1625314)
Tech it looks like we are both conservative but in different ways.You make conservative recommendations and I make conservative estimates for power.I wonder if the two of us could collaborate on a successful build?

I have no doubt about it Vinnie.

F-BIRD'88 12-21-2012 12:47 AM

Of those two cams, the Xe284H-10 would be my choice.
Get a 10" 3500+ stall for it, when using either cam.

gearheadslife 12-21-2012 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinniekq2 (Post 1625181)
OK,Im going to see if I can pick a fight with Tech?
I look at the iconic LT-1 that makes 370 hp. I see this engine combo as less than an LT-1 so where am I wrong?
Does the engine sim give ideal results based on perfect tune?


30 years of head/chamber advancement might bring something to the table..
tho. I do think a 180cc head is a tad small for the 292.. it's been used with much worse...
the 3rd gens loose a ton in exhaust.. be very carefull here.. my best set up was hooker headers(I had big pipe headers on trackI heads) with 2.5" pipes going to under pass side footwell(just like the factory dual converter set up, into a y pipe into a 3-3.5" single pipe over axle and into the best muffler you can afford.. (not a flowfarter) and one tail pipe.. the mufflers with two tail pipes make a mess of the flow.. if you have to have dual tail pipes, hang one.. for the look..

the 292 will bleed off the lower end, and if you haven't worked over the 3 link rear and torque bar. it's mighty help get the car out of the hole.. and may save the rear end from going boom..

F-BIRD'88 12-21-2012 05:02 PM

my best set up was hooker headers(I had big pipe headers on trackI heads) with 2.5" pipes going to under pass side footwell(just like the factory dual converter set up, into a y pipe into a 3-3.5" single pipe over axle and into the best muffler you can afford.. (not a flowfarter) and one tail pipe.. the mufflers with two tail pipes make a mess of the flow.. if you have to have dual tail pipes, hang one.. for the look..

You are bang on the money here. with your exhaust system design.

These cars are very easy to make them hook. too.
But you got to start with good rear tires. The rest is easy, low cost too.

gearheadslife 12-21-2012 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by F-BIRD'88 (Post 1625633)
my best set up was hooker headers(I had big pipe headers on trackI heads) with 2.5" pipes going to under pass side footwell(just like the factory dual converter set up, into a y pipe into a 3-3.5" single pipe over axle and into the best muffler you can afford.. (not a flowfarter) and one tail pipe.. the mufflers with two tail pipes make a mess of the flow.. if you have to have dual tail pipes, hang one.. for the look..

You are bang on the money here. with your exhaust system design.

These cars are very easy to make them hook. too.
But you got to start with good rear tires. The rest is easy, low cost too.

haha low cost. maybe now.. wasn't much aval. in '85 tho. the g.m. dana 44 rear was a nice upgrade..
moved from that to southside bars/connectors and a 9"

F-BIRD'88 12-22-2012 08:53 AM

Making a 3rd gen , 4th gen f body hook up.
Camaro Suspension | F-Body Suspension | G-Body Suspension | Spohn Perf
Air Spring Air Suspension | Air Lift Company - Tow and Haul with Safety and Comfort
UMI Performance Inc.

The Drag Bags + frame connectors works wonders.
Lower control arm relocation brackets really help too.
The stock 7.5" axle is not that bad once the diff is replaced with aftermarket
and the R+P is installed correctly.


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