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Old 04-22-2014, 04:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alittle1 View Post
It may not be the right plug wire and it might be firing early or late, but it will fire the spark to the closest plug wire that is closest to the rotor's location.
were you trying to say you know of isolated situations where the PIP sensor was damaged in such a way that it gave spark but messed up timing to the point of a no start?

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Old 04-22-2014, 05:44 AM
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I did not read through all of this but to answer the OP question. Yes you can have spark with a bad crank sensor. It happened to my 98 Tahoe with a Vortec engine. It had spark, blue spark too with a spark tester, but it would crank and crank and kick back like pull starting a gravely tractor and kicks back.I had 62 psi of fuel pressure so the fuel was good. The crank sensor was bad. There was a GM TSB on this as it gives the wrong reading to ECM and advances the timing to over 50 degrees. This could also cause starter and flywheel damage. Put the crank sensor in and it runs like new. Again, this was a GM.
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:51 AM
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ive not had the kick back since i readjusted my timing but thank you for verifying that TJ. I only read one other person on another forum say they had a bad crank sensor with spark but figured it was possible.
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Old 04-22-2014, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJSBBC View Post
I did not read through all of this but to answer the OP question. Yes you can have spark with a bad crank sensor. It happened to my 98 Tahoe with a Vortec engine. It had spark, blue spark too with a spark tester, but it would crank and crank and kick back like pull starting a gravely tractor and kicks back.I had 62 psi of fuel pressure so the fuel was good. The crank sensor was bad. There was a GM TSB on this as it gives the wrong reading to ECM and advances the timing to over 50 degrees. This could also cause starter and flywheel damage. Put the crank sensor in and it runs like new. Again, this was a GM.
While I wont dispute the plausibility of this on your GM, the OP has an 87 Taurus, with a 3.0 batch fire type injected motor with only a trigger wheel in the dizzy.
I guess it all comes down to how you define "Bad".
Intermittent signals from a crank sensor on the OP car could cause a backfire etc. I guess we all assumed "Bad " meant inoperative and not intermittent which is possible. Good post.
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Old 04-22-2014, 04:20 PM
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While I wont dispute the plausibility of this on your GM, the OP has an 87 Taurus, with a 3.0 batch fire type injected motor with only a trigger wheel in the dizzy.
I guess it all comes down to how you define "Bad".
Intermittent signals from a crank sensor on the OP car could cause a backfire etc. I guess we all assumed "Bad " meant inoperative and not intermittent which is possible. Good post.
yes thats definitely what i meant by bad. did you read my other replies to your post LA?
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:08 PM
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You have to determine if it is intermittent or completely bad. If you crank the engine and you have a spark then not and then again ..that is intermittent.
The PIP in the distributor can be intermittent as the module can also be.
But if that was the only issue, turning the distributor and getting it to run a while is not what your symptom would be.
If you have turned the distributor in the past and then it ran, but then it wouldn't restart without moving the distributor again, then you either have a timing chain problem or the distributor gear is spinning freely from the distributor shaft at times...ie: sheared roll pin. Not an intermittent crank sensor.
You may have a handful of issues making it very confusing for you.
I remember you said you had the timing cover off.Was the chain good?Replaced ?
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:22 PM
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like i said the chain had slack in it but it wasnt gap city or anything. I could line the marks up and not see the chain jump when it was turned over manually or by the engine running. none the less i replaced it just to get it out of the way so it has a new solid slack free chain on it. im certain my issue is timing i just wondered what created the timing issue. the only thing i could do before to get it running was mess with the dizzy or the crank pully to get results until even that stopped working. Again I ask you what am i looking for as far as a sheared pin? would that bhe a case of the gear going over the pin and moving freely, would the gear looked cracked, what am i visually looking for in my inspection?
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:45 PM
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Look around for a video on how to change the gear on the distributor.
You just need to use a small punch to move the pin to see if it the pin is intact. Just drive it out.If it is in one piece you are good to go. Put it back in,Then move on.
Chances are when you get to looking you may see a problem.
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Old 04-22-2014, 06:46 PM
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I did many many hall effect switches and modules on fords. Pretty easy to do. Use motorcraft parts. I replaced the module and hall effect at the same time.
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Old 04-22-2014, 08:50 PM
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Based off what everyone has said here I'm gonna get a new dizzy I guess and see what happens. We got everything we need to run period, hands down so I'm gonna look at this gear and get a new dizzy.
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Old 04-23-2014, 06:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by One to Remember View Post
Based off what everyone has said here I'm gonna get a new dizzy I guess and see what happens. We got everything we need to run period, hands down so I'm gonna look at this gear and get a new dizzy.
Why? Is your original distributor cracked or something. All that is in these are the hall effect/pickup/stator (all the same thing) and the module, cap and rotor of course. Be careful of aftermarket overseas distributors. Just use the factory ford dist. housing and knock the roll pin out of the gear, remove the gear (mark original location) and then pull the shaft out to get the stator out. Remove the stator, replace with new, reverse repeat. You may need to wd-40 the shaft a little when pulling it up. Putting the distributor in a vice with alum. jaws helps with this process.

Again, use motorcraft parts, module and stator. Replace them both. You are in there anyway.
T.J.
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Old 04-23-2014, 11:55 PM
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Originally Posted by TJSBBC View Post
Why? Is your original distributor cracked or something. All that is in these are the hall effect/pickup/stator (all the same thing) and the module, cap and rotor of course. Be careful of aftermarket overseas distributors. Just use the factory ford dist. housing and knock the roll pin out of the gear, remove the gear (mark original location) and then pull the shaft out to get the stator out. Remove the stator, replace with new, reverse repeat. You may need to wd-40 the shaft a little when pulling it up. Putting the distributor in a vice with alum. jaws helps with this process.

Again, use motorcraft parts, module and stator. Replace them both. You are in there anyway.
T.J.
im just afraid to buy that damn pick up and it not work and i be stuck with a 20 dollar buy. atleast if i get the new dizzy from my junk yard and it doesnt work i got me a returnable part and junk yard credit. i got about 30 bucks to my name.
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Old 04-24-2014, 06:06 AM
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im just afraid to buy that damn pick up and it not work and i be stuck with a 20 dollar buy. atleast if i get the new dizzy from my junk yard and it doesnt work i got me a returnable part and junk yard credit. i got about 30 bucks to my name.
Ok. Understood. However, nothing is new at a junkyard. That is why it is there. Let us know how you make out.
T.J.
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Old 04-24-2014, 01:15 PM
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Ok. Understood. However, nothing is new at a junkyard. That is why it is there. Let us know how you make out.
T.J.
yea i get what your saying but the good thing about the modern junk yard is you got a standard part price and i can keep coming back over and over again until i find the replacement that works. it would be really bad luck if these other cars are at the yard due to the same issue but probably not all of 'em.

another reason im going to the yard is because i hear aftermarket parts getting so much heat. basically this is my way of getting a ford part and the fact that my issues could be due to LA Tech's theory about the pin and other people's belief in the pip sensor, this allows me to replace both at once.
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Old 06-16-2014, 05:17 AM
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i finally got around to getting a new dizzy. i had began rebuilding my old one and had gotten a good new pick up installed and ran into too much trouble getting the gear off and then ordering a new one and finding a spacer. i retook the timing cover off ust to make sure the chain wasnt slipping and it looks good but now every spark plug period is weak. all orange and one barely sparked. They were blue when i had the old dizzy on them but i also had checked them months ago. im wondering if the "new" dizzy made them weak or if they just degraded naturally from sitting for 2 months? i put one of the plugs in my blazer and it wasnt missing or anything but the other 5 probably compensated for it too. im wondering with all 6 plugs conveniently faltering at the same time if i should just replace them all and see if that gets it cranked or what? i doubt looking at the coil or the plugs is really necessary again. iTS just all six at once?? and 4 or 5 of them are pretty fouled too, alot of black..
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