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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 09-25-2011, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outerrealm
So where are the stories of catastrophic failures of these? Accidents must have made headlines, big fat consumer alerts must have issued, Ralph Nader must have weighed in? By the way, I'm driving a geo metro, I might reconsider in the case of a bigger or more modern car
To all the folks besides

outerrealm

This poster has dug up a old thread from 2004 ...
ALL his posts ( 5 ) are in this one thread. and is determined to convince everyone that the compression fittings are safe.
He is entitled to his opinion ... but we will never convince the guy that that are unsafe ... ( although I suspect he really knows they are unsafe ).


I suggest we just ignore this thread and this misinformed dribble and continue to double flare and build safe rides.

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 09-25-2011, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by outerrealm
Prove what? What are you talking about? I'm not making choices to prove a point. I make choices based on reliable substantiated information and advice from those I trust. Still waiting on that link to one of the many fatalities there must have been that were caused by these
You still don't get it do you. There is no link because only an idiot would use compression fittings on automotive brake applications and, thank God, there aren't very many of those idiots around anymore... with at least ONE exception.

Do what you want but you had best check your state's regulations first. Not only are there federal ISO standards for brake fittings (which compression fittings can't pass), many states also have laws and regulations which make the installation of non standard equipment illegal. I don't know who is telling you that compression fittings are OK for automotive brake lines but you can be assured they have no clue. I just hope you only kill yourself and not take someone else or their family with you.

Not going to waste any more time trying to convince a fool he's wrong. Its like fighting a war against an unarmed enemy. There's no honor in it.

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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 09:10 AM
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it was NAPA that sold me the comp fittings when they were out of the others, otherwise I would've used flares. Now, still no one has provided any actual stories of accidents caused by a comp fitting failure. Nonetheless, since the issue has such vehement opinions I'm going to swap mine out
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outerrealm
it was NAPA that sold me the comp fittings when they were out of the others, otherwise I would've used flares. Now, still no one has provided any actual stories of accidents caused by a comp fitting failure. Nonetheless, since the issue has such vehement opinions I'm going to swap mine out
I just completed a search for your home state of Connecticut and the regulations concerning brake lines. Compression fittings are NOT allowed. I have attached the pdf file. Left click on it to read. Scroll down to the title 'BRAKE LINES'.

You can do a further search with regards to the Federal regulations pertaining to double flared steel lines and about stainless lines.

As to NAPA selling you the compression fittings. There is no law against them selling you the fittings. There IS a law against you using them for automotive vehicle hydraulic brake lines.

Because the use of double flared steel lines for hydraulic brake systems has been required by state laws and Federal laws for many decades, it is unlikely that many accidents would have occurred due to brake failure using compression fittings. I would imagine that an unknowing individual might have used compression fittings for a repair, but that doesn't make it safe, legal or the correct method for the repair. I'm sure you have heard stories of vehicles being "fixed" using baling wire as well. Is that something you think is the best way? I doubt it.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf R-157[1].pdf (1.59 MB, 319 views)

Last edited by Frisco; 09-26-2011 at 09:59 AM.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outerrealm
it was NAPA that sold me the comp fittings when they were out of the others, otherwise I would've used flares. Now, still no one has provided any actual stories of accidents caused by a comp fitting failure. Nonetheless, since the issue has such vehement opinions I'm going to swap mine out
I don't know of anyone who's read from a Russian roullette player that lost, either. The odds are in your favor.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 01:12 PM
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Ok heres why you dont use them...

Brass compression fittings are rated at 500 Working PSI
Hydraulic brake systems operate around 2,000 PSI

There not rated for the pressure and Can fail. They might not. I have seen them fail at 50 PSI installed wrong.. Compression fittings are sold at autoparts stores not for brake systems, but for fuel systems, where the preassure will be well below 500 PSI.. If a Napa employee suggests the use of compression fittings for brake lines, that's nice. There employing an idiot. My local advance auto had a kid trying to sell Cetane booster to increse gas MPG to a guy. Doesent make them right and doesent change the fact that could do damage. Not all countermen are experts
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 02:43 PM
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these are a new design made of steel. They are branded Weatherhead compression fittings. They are made by Eaton , eaton.com. I spoke with their technical expert and was told these were good for 4000psi. They are sold by ACME, NAPA and others. The Eaton part # is 7305x3 They are not rated by most states because they are relatively new and have not been submitted for rating. They are not specifically illegal. So, people, instead of throwing out hysterical rants about old outmoded products do your research so that you will know what you're talking about. By the way, it is just like any other sort of repair wherein if you do it wrong it will fail. That is irrelevant. It is safe if installed correctly just like every other mechanical device.

Those who doubt me here's the number for Eaton (800) 386-1911
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 03:10 PM
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According to this Chart, the Ermeto 7000 Series Fitting (in either 1/8-3/8") re only good for 5000 p.s.i.-I wouldn't use them-

seekpart.com/keywordpdf/2011/3/31/20113319553279.pdf
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outerrealm
these are a new design made of steel. They are branded Weatherhead compression fittings. They are made by Eaton , eaton.com. I spoke with their technical expert and was told these were good for 4000psi. They are sold by ACME, NAPA and others. The Eaton part # is 7305x3 They are not rated by most states because they are relatively new and have not been submitted for rating. They are not specifically illegal. So, people, instead of throwing out hysterical rants about old outmoded products do your research so that you will know what you're talking about. By the way, it is just like any other sort of repair wherein if you do it wrong it will fail. That is irrelevant. It is safe if installed correctly just like every other mechanical device.

Those who doubt me here's the number for Eaton (800) 386-1911
Wonder how much they cost?......and do the same job as a $4 piece of doubled flared tubing....
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 05:57 PM
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My initial post was under the assumption that the user would be looking at brass compression fittings from the hardware store. Of course steel SwageLock and other high performance compression fittings would do the deed with safety to spare IF they are applied correctly. How many of you have installed a compression fitting to have it blow apart because you didn't tighten it correctly; or am I the only one!

Many states outlaw them in hydraulic braking systems for some reason. I know, I am assuming a lot when applying logic to government! I believe it is for the reason stated above; install a compression fitting incorrectly and you chance catastrophic breach of the system. Install a flare incorrectly and the tubes are by definition mechanically captured and you maybe have a bad leak but not a blowout.

You don't hear about disasters using compression fittings because they are illegal and there are a relativley few out there to fail. Again they are illegal in most states if not all and most people don't want to go to the extra expense to install them when they are not cost competitive with good old flare fittings.

Finally, price out a couple SwageLock fittings and you will scurry back to your Harbor Freight tubing flare tool and happily flare from then on!!
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 07:00 PM
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OK, looks like some people did the sensible thing and actually researched this. Why is there so much harping about installing these correctly? It's not hard to do if you know anything about cars and have experience with them. Pay attention to what you're doing. I said before, any job on a car can be done incorrectly if you don't know what you're doing. If you're new to this but otherwise have reasonably good skills get some advice from the manufacturer, a friendly mechanic, or watch a youtube tutorial. If you're a klutz don't mess with it. It's like the signs we see on the highway, "motorcycles use caution" as if we might otherwise not. If you don't know enough to be cautious on a motorcycle without being told you're an accident waiting to happen. The Eaton Weatherhead fittings are $5 each at NAPA. By the way, I came to this forum looking for helpful advice and found anything but, instead finding out what I needed to know from the manufacturer. Everyone thinks they're and expert

Last edited by outerrealm; 09-26-2011 at 07:08 PM.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outerrealm
OK, looks like some people did the sensible thing and actually researched this. Why is there so much harping about installing these correctly? It's not hard to do if you know anything about cars and have experience with them. Pay attention to what you're doing. I said before, any job on a car can be done incorrectly if you don't know what you're doing. If you're new to this but otherwise have reasonably good skills get some advice from the manufacturer, a friendly mechanic, or watch a youtube tutorial. If you're a klutz don't mess with it. It's like the signs we see on the highway, "motorcycles use caution" as if we might otherwise not. If you don't know enough to be cautious on a motorcycle without being told you're an accident waiting to happen. The Eaton Weatherhead fittings are $5 each at NAPA. By the way, I came to this forum looking for helpful advice and found anything but, instead finding out what I needed to know from the manufacturer. Everyone thinks they're and expert
Last time..... Doesn't matter that the manufacturer claims they're OK to use. All he's interested in is selling his product. He doesn't give a damn if you kill yourself or someone else. Bottom line is they're ILLEGAL period, end of story.

You say you came here for advice. Some VERY experienced people have given you excellent advice but you choose to ignore it. I have a suggestion for you. Why don't you ask your question on one of the rat rod sites. They love using unsafe equipment on their rides and my guess is you would fit right in there.

I'll say it again.

ONLY AN IDIOT WOULD USE COMPRESSION FITTINGS ON AN AUTOMOTIVE BRAKING SYSTEM..

Now, if the shoe fits...slip it on.

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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 08:36 PM
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OK, some of you like to preach and feel superior and call people idiots who don't agree with them. Typical of such people is their ability to ignore particular facts and experiences which don't support their views. I posted a factual basis supporting the use of a particular type of fitting. There is even a pdf chart showing psi ratings. But preach and rant you must. Never mind considering that a reasoned decision to use the Eaton fittings has a factual basis. If you want to use fittings that go up to 10,000,000 psi because it makes you feel safe more power to you. I'm not going to call you an idiot for your choice. I'm not going to use words like idiot which are insulting and unnecessary. I came to get advice and not only did I get incorrect information about fittings that are obsolete, but I get called an idiot by someone who lacks the maturity and respect to keep the dialog objective and productive. I think there should be age, or maturity restrictions to this forum. Well I've got what I needed and said what I had to, so you barking pit bulls can get back to whatever it is you do best. I'm done with this forum
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 09:30 PM
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Don't let the door hit you in the butt on your way out.

You asked for advice, you got excellent advice, you ignored it because you had your mind made up before you ever asked the question. This forum did just fine before you showed up and it will get along even better now.

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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2011, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outerrealm
.... I'm done with this forum
Thank you! You joined this forum and right off the bat resurrected a seven year old post simply to start trouble, that's what we call a troll around here.
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