compression ratios and pump gas??? - Page 4 - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Engine
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #46 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 01:57 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: PA
Age: 72
Posts: 367
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ap72
No, I'm a civil, everyone swears I should have been a mechanical when they see me around cars, but I'm into bigger things, literally. mostly landfills right now, but it was water delivery in the past, and may be other piping in the future.
Civil Engineer?

This is from your profile:

Biography:
mechanic, attending SEMo for Construction Management, own a S10, a Blazer, a Cutlass, and a POS wish it would die Escort
Location:
St. Louis, MO
Interests:
cheerleading lifting
Occupation:
mechanic, part time laborer

23 years old - most good BS Engineering degrees require 5 years. Where did you get your BS and in what discipline? You claim Civil.

I am a retired Civil, registered land surveyor. BS University of Pittsburgh.

Do you really have a BS degree in any Engineering discipline?? How can you call yourself an engineer without a BS?

I asked you this question before, and received no answer.

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #47 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 02:08 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 58
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ap72
I did no write the book, I could write a book, but books are only good once so I stay away from it. As far as 383 and aftermarket parts. We could talk about running some of the trick heads out there, equally trick valve train, with a rerouted cooling system and top of the line fuel and ignition control to allow for compression that can go past 12:1 on pump gas.

Or you can run 11:1 on well massaged Vortec's with a carb and HEI...

We're talking about what is possible, not what is common.
Exactly why I posted that link.

It is knowledge only verified with hands on experience. This takes years to acquire. This is not found on a computer program, or on the 'net'.

By the way, 12:1 will not run on pump gas.

I know from trial, and error. Trial + Error= Experience.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #48 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 02:29 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Age: 29
Posts: 9,476
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 20
Thanked 386 Times in 362 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by glen242
Civil Engineer?

This is from your profile:

Biography:
mechanic, attending SEMo for Construction Management, own a S10, a Blazer, a Cutlass, and a POS wish it would die Escort
Location:
St. Louis, MO
Interests:
cheerleading lifting
Occupation:
mechanic, part time laborer

23 years old - most good BS Engineering degrees require 5 years. Where did you get your BS and in what discipline? You claim Civil.

I am a retired Civil, registered land surveyor. BS University of Pittsburgh.

Do you really have a BS degree in any Engineering discipline?? How can you call yourself an engineer without a BS?

I asked you this question before, and received no answer.
Yea, I have my BS, University of Missouri- Rolla, now called Missouri University of Science and Technology. Its really well known in the Midwest, but not really a big school, around 6,000 students, 80% of them engineering related. And yes, I got my MBA in Environmental and Industrial Management from SEMO (I taught Construction Management), and I will be starting my MS in Civil Engineering at SIUE this January. Hopefully eventually I'll make it back to Rolla for my doctorate, or maybe just settle at Wash U since its in town. I sit for my PE after Dec 2009.

That profile hasn't been updated in a LONG time. I guess I didn't think people actaully read it. And yes I'm 23, that part is current. I no longer cheerlead, may try to get on as an assistant coach though. And I'm curently a project engineer in the St. Louis area.

I'm also a Leo and I enjoy holding hands and long walks along the river.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #49 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 02:41 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Age: 29
Posts: 9,476
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 20
Thanked 386 Times in 362 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
Exactly why I posted that link.

It is knowledge only verified with hands on experience. This takes years to acquire. This is not found on a computer program, or on the 'net'.

By the way, 12:1 will not run on pump gas.

I know from trial, and error. Trial + Error= Experience.

I wish I could find the article, but I swore I saw a dyno challenge with ratios runnig a little over 13:1 on 93 octane. Of course these things were tuned perfectly, were dyno queens, and had exceptional cooling along with coatings.

To prove it can run in an engine look at motorcycles, a lot of them are running on pump gas at that ratio or higher- again its a different engine but it shows that it is possible to do with that octane.

I'm not saying I can build an engine to run 12:1, or rather would even try to (too cost prohibitive), but some people can get 10:1 to run on pump gas- doesn't mean someone else can't either.

For a long time man couldn't see beyond the stars in the night sky, then we sent up the Hubble, only to realize there's more that we can't see.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #50 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 03:15 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 58
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ap72

For a long time man couldn't see beyond the stars in the night sky, then we sent up the Hubble, only to realize there's more that we can't see.
Once again, you post a somewhat questionable remark aimed at a poster.

This reads to me(you quoted me) THAT I NEED TO LOOK OUTSIDE OF THE BOX(not yelling). Just trying to prove a point.

I have been blessed with mechanical abilities, by our all mighty God. I only have a high school diploma, and have been able to succeed in the automotive, and performance industry. The school of hard knocks is the best learning experience you can have.

Check my previous posts, and try to be less abrasive, and more open to the knowledge base available on this site.

If you want a summary of what I have accomplished, PM me.

Stephen
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #51 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 03:25 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Age: 29
Posts: 9,476
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 20
Thanked 386 Times in 362 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
Once again, you post a somewhat questionable remark aimed at a poster.

This reads to me(you quoted me) THAT I NEED TO LOOK OUTSIDE OF THE BOX(not yelling). Just trying to prove a point.

I have been blessed with mechanical abilities, by our all mighty God. I only have a high school diploma, and have been able to succeed in the automotive, and performance industry. The school of hard knocks is the best learning experience you can have.

Check my previous posts, and try to be less abrasive, and more open to the knowledge base available on this site.

If you want a summary of what I have accomplished, PM me.

Stephen
Its not directed so much at you as it is all of us.

There was a time, back in the day of flat head fords, that if you said 9:1 you were out of your mind. Yet that's below factory now-a-days. And not to discredit expierence, because it is the reason we are where we are today, but expierence in itself is nothing if you do not analyze it properly and find the best way to apply it (I know a lot of well expierenced people who don't have much of anything to show for it).

I'm grateful for the learning of the men who walked this earth before me, but I'm also grateful for the people who challenged it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #52 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 05:02 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 58
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ap72
Its not directed so much at you as it is all of us.

There was a time, back in the day of flat head fords, that if you said 9:1 you were out of your mind. Yet that's below factory now-a-days. And not to discredit expierence, because it is the reason we are where we are today, but expierence in itself is nothing if you do not analyze it properly and find the best way to apply it (I know a lot of well expierenced people who don't have much of anything to show for it).

I'm grateful for the learning of the men who walked this earth before me, but I'm also grateful for the people who challenged it.
I don't care who you know, or what they have to show for it. This is a 'no-namer' in our present economy. My $250K investment could go under any day now, but my knowledge cannot be taken away from me, except by my life's 'leader'.

Once again you post a twisted post. "but expierence in itself is nothing if you do not analyze it properly and find the best way to apply it"

What in the h**l do you think everyone in your lifetime is expected to do? Match your success? Everyone has a mind of their own, and winds up happy in their 'nitch' of their life. Not everyone is perfect.

This is what life is all about.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #53 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 05:14 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 58
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by boatanchors
on a chevy small block - 383 what is the limit on compression when i have to stop using pump gas and go with the high dollar juice? i know some people might have different opinions im just looking for a rough number so i know my limit on this build.
boatanchors; Did you get the information you were looking for? Before this thread gets moved by the 'Mods'.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #54 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 06:14 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Age: 29
Posts: 9,476
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 20
Thanked 386 Times in 362 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
I don't care who you know, or what they have to show for it. This is a 'no-namer' in our present economy. My $250K investment could go under any day now, but my knowledge cannot be taken away from me, except by my life's 'leader'.

Once again you post a twisted post. "but expierence in itself is nothing if you do not analyze it properly and find the best way to apply it"

What in the h**l do you think everyone in your lifetime is expected to do? Match your success? Everyone has a mind of their own, and winds up happy in their 'nitch' of their life. Not everyone is perfect.

This is what life is all about.
I'm sorry I ticked you off, but I really have made no personal attack in my posts. And I never claimed to be perfect, nor do I expect anyone else to be.

I'm only saying that expierence is in itself meaningless, If I put my hand in a fire and get burned I have expierenced burning and pain. If I do not analyze what has happened and deduce that fire will hurt me if not treated properly then I have learned nothing. Likewise if I assume that all fire is bad and painful then I have "learned" something, but I will never realize the bennifits of its heat and light because I have learned to not go near it at all. No one can argue that point. Many people who have done things before us have shown us some of the possibilities, but no one has yet discovered all of the limitations, and even when these "limits" are set it is only a matter of time before someone else finds a way to push through them. Just like when Columbus rediscovered America.

I am not trying to say that I am going to rediscover America either. Merely that none of these so called constants should not be taken for granted, all of them have changed in the past and will change in the future.

And to F'bird, I know the gas back in the day was crap, refining has made some improvements since then. Likewise even when there was leaded gasoline I would not run those engines run on today's gas unless I wanted the valves to chew up the heads. I would also not run todays engines on that leaded gas because the fuel and exhaust system can't take it.

Not only has the technology in engine design and manufacturing changed, but so have the parameters. Nothing is constant, nothing is set in stone.

Lastly cook, I'm not trying to discount what you say or what you know, but knowledge does expire. What you know is worth the most when you learn it, and as time goes by and the world changes so does the value of your knowledge.

There was a time when simple potassium nitrate was the best chemical to have in warfare, and then came trinitrotoluene, then the A-bomb, then the H-bomb, and now... well only God knows all of what they have. Each invention served its purpose in shaping the world, each inventor was just as crucial, and each one's importance began diminishing as soon as their product came into use.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #55 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 06:49 PM
cr55's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: delaware
Posts: 38
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Cold Knock hit the nail on the head. Aluminum heads allow an 11 to 1 compression without a lot of trouble, but no higher. The cam duration and overlap are critical to engine life when the number goes up. Watch out!...CR
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #56 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 07:00 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 58
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
[QUOTE=ap72]


Lastly cook, I'm not trying to discount what you say or what you know, but knowledge does expire. What you know is worth the most when you learn it, and as time goes by and the world changes so does the value of your knowledge.

QUOTE] That is a false, and very shallow statement. Once again, here you do it again. Everyone retains, and grows more knowledge every day of their life. That knowledge is retained by everybody in their own personal life, or field of work. I agree the knowledge level needs to advance with the times, but the old is not forgotten.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #57 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 07:27 PM
Cyberats's Avatar
Hydrogen Burning Engine, YES !
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: California, USA
Age: 46
Posts: 48
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
for those who do not yet know

This thread is named "compression ratios and pump gas" and not "how to build my 383 racer" but anything that has to do with it is accepted.

However.... I see those of you claiming "higher compression higher octane" as the people who INTERPRET Einstein, interpret technical books to suit their beliefs. There's a Hole in your Mechanical training that you completely covered up and try to excuse it with bad physics. Not one of you were able to explain in details as to why the opposite is true. I asked a simple question about stock cars and daily drivers, not a fuzzy logic built racer. Besides they run aircraft fuel at 12-13:1 to be able to get better performance, acceleration, speed out of them than you would with normal octane, NOT that they would not run on 87.
Back 20 years ago, pump gas was rated as 96/92/86, went down to 93/91-90/87 and then 91/89/87 as new stock vehicles' compression went up from 8:1 to 9:1 to 10+:1. How do you explain that ? Without getting into physics it makes sense higher compression burns lower octane gas at the same mpgs & performance as lower compression burns higher octane gas.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #58 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 08:00 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Age: 29
Posts: 9,476
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 20
Thanked 386 Times in 362 Posts
"I agree the knowledge level needs to advance with the times"

That's exactly what I'm saying, knowledge and theories evolve.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #59 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 09:17 PM
the hack shack's Avatar
nuts
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Superior,WI
Age: 40
Posts: 5
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
compression ratio

I built a 388 with 5.7 rods, aluminum pro topline heads 10.7 compression I run 36deg timing ,544 lift cam turn 6500 rpm in my 72 nova I run pump gas 91 or 93 runs great no problems on the street(no detonation) but mix 50/50 when Im not nice to it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #60 (permalink)  
Old 11-12-2008, 09:40 PM
How fast is fast enough?
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Age: 29
Posts: 9,476
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 20
Thanked 386 Times in 362 Posts
hey hack, you mind giving us the rest of your setup, I think it would be a great affordable example for some guys. Namely, intake, exhaust, trans, stall (if auto), gears, duration on cam, and anything else you may think is critical. Oh, and the temp of T-stat you're running.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Engine posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Octane Booster Info SLR_65 Engine 46 09-30-2007 10:01 AM
Need help on my engine. evil.350@hotmail.com Hotrodders' Lounge 4 08-18-2007 08:06 PM
Compression question for the Pro engine builders.. Axelrod Engine 14 01-16-2007 11:29 AM
cams, heads, and compression ratios Litdave Engine 3 05-22-2004 08:47 AM
Compression 4x4vandale Engine 5 10-09-2003 12:59 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:10 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.