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Old 02-17-2009, 06:21 PM
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Converting a siphon gun to a "remote pot" gun.

I have some very tight spots on the sedan/delivery project where I need to shoot nearly upside down. In addition I need to shoot the belly of the car, again upside down. My HVLP guns won't do the trick.

Using some of the comments and suggestions in this thread and a PM from Mikey poking me in the ribs to join his "Dare to be Deviant" brigade, I decided that instead of running out and buying a new pressure pot gun, I'd just try to convert one of my old siphon guns which I don't use any more.

Here is the result. This was originally a siphon type detail gun with a paddle trigger (it's so old I don't know the make or the nozzle size). Arrow "A" shows where the cup used to attach to the gun at Arrow "B". The hose is approximately 5' long and came from an old portable air pump which was deep sixed some years ago. But I KNEW this hose, which had threaded fittings on each end, would come in handy one day.



The second picture shows the changes made on the gun. I used a 1" long threaded black pipe fitting ("A") to attach the hose to the gun. The fitting on the gun had limited threads and a somewhat specialized end, so I inserted an O-ring to insure a tight fit where the black pipe fitting meets the gun. To conserve space and cut down the length of the gun, I used a street elbow ("B") for attaching the air hose.



No changes at all were needed on the cup end. The threaded fitting on the hose can be attached directly to the cup.



I immediately discovered that such a small pot, with very little weight, didn't want to stand up or stay in one place for very long. Any movement of the gun and hose would cause it to tip over. So I made this very high tech "Polyethylene Paint Cup Stabilizer"...otherwise known as a plastic coffee can filled with sand with a peanut butter jar stuffed into the center.



Just cut a hole in the lid, snap it back on the coffee can, and drop in the cup. Seems to work just fine.



I haven't shot paint with the unit yet but I did test it out with lacquer thinner and the gun seems to pull just fine. I set the cup on the floor and raised the gun a couple feet above it and the siphon had no trouble pulling the thinner. It might be a bit more difficult with actual paint, but worse case I just have to place the cup at the height I am working or perhaps a bit higher. Here's a shot showing the tight spot I was having difficulty shooting with my HVLP. The remote pot unit looks like it will fit in the space quite nicely. It will also be perfect for shooting the bottom of floor pan in the body. (Note: no small children or animals were harmed during the filming of this paint gun conversion.)


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Old 02-17-2009, 06:27 PM
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Too cool, Dewey! You never cease to amaze me, tis one is getting stored in the memory banks for the future.
Dan
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Old 02-17-2009, 07:02 PM
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its called old school, if you have trouble with it sputtering tip the cup upside downand put a little vent hole in the bottom wich is now the top,walla a gravity gun,oh yeah, better turn down the fluid,
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Old 02-17-2009, 08:04 PM
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That's a tool I'd be proud to hang on my wall.
If you put a 90* at the top of the paint cup, and put your coffee can cupholder above the gun in it's spraying position, once paint starts flowing in the tube, it will siphon, and your paint delivery should be consistant, as it will be gravity fed instead of being picked up by vacuum.

Mess around with the paint some before you start spraying, thinner pulls way easier than paint.


If you go to turn the paintcup upside down, as deadbodyman suggests, make sure you take the pickup tube out of the paint cup, with it upside down it will be a vent, not a pickup. Also plug the cap vent hole, or it will be dribbling... (Also, I'd be real suspect of the cup gasket, those things don't seal when new, and go downhill from there. )

You might be able to get even more gun clearance, and a better siphon with a full size gun hooked up as you did with your nonameuno panel gun.

When you go to clean the hose and gun, remove the cup from the top, hold the pickup tube over a can or dixie cup, raise the gun so the hose is vertical, then pull the trigger on the gun, all the paint in the hose will run down, and you will save a ton of time and thinner cleaning the hose and gun out.

I would not be surprised though, if the thinner eats the hose some, make sure it hasn't started to do that already, or else you'll have particles of hose in your paint. I've used air hose before as fluid hose, it usually lasts a few uses.

It's great to see a guy take the stuff he has laying around and make something useful out of it to solve a unique problem. I don't have any doubet that it will work ..it might take a little tweaking, but I'll bet it will do exactly what you want it to.


"Without deviation from the norm, progress is impossible"..F.Zappa

Later, mikey
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Old 02-17-2009, 08:22 PM
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good thinking

more good advice these guys are all old school,we built one with a full cup back before gravity guns came out to paint rockers and bottoms had to jack some cars up gun wouldnt fit seems we had some problems but it worked,lots of good input
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Old 02-17-2009, 10:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by powerrodsmike
...I would not be surprised though, if the thinner eats the hose some, make sure it hasn't started to do that already...
How would one check on hose eating?
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Old 02-17-2009, 10:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cboy
How would one check on hose eating?
You can take a q tip and wet it with some thinner, or reducer that you will use... swab it around the inside of the hose..if the q tip comes out black, after several wipes, you know the thinner can eat the hose.

Very unscientific, I know and I'm sure there are better tests, but that one can tell you lots. It won't tell you about long term use, but you don't need to care too much about that.

You can also cut a small piece of hose, and drop it in a little cup of thinner..if it swells up after a few hours, it is not compatable with your thinner.

later, mikey
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Old 02-18-2009, 06:16 AM
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dirty hoes

you can use fuel line or in my caseold air line,just replace after each job idont like wasting my time cleaning old nasty hoes ,time valuable hoes cheap,always lotsa old hoes around.oops my bad "HOSE"
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Old 03-10-2009, 04:54 PM
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Brief update:

I had my first opportunity to use the new "remote" gun today and a couple observations to pass along to anyone thinking of doing this.

A) The gun itself worked great. This thing was dug out of a back corner of my shop and I have no idea what size the nozzle is. But I cranked the air pressure at the gun handle to 45 lbs, opened the fan and material knobs a turn and a half each, and on the first test shot it seemed to be dialed in. So I just shot that way and it came out just about the same as my $200 HVLP gun. Really improved how the paint went on in the tight spots I have.

B) As Mikey predicted, the gun will not siphon well if the the cup is below gun level. Lots of spitting. So I had to put the cup up on a step ladder so that it was about a foot above the highest point I was shooting with the gun. Then it worked like a charm.

C) One stupid engineering flaw. If you note the street elbow in the picture below...then then look at the material supply knob...you'll probably guess the mistake. In this configuration I can't get the material nob totally out and thus can't pull the needle to clean it. If I tighten the elbow another quarter turn and then take the grinder to it, I might be able to find enough space to get the knob off. Otherwise, I'll have to actually think about a solution.

But all-in-all, I'm very happy with the results I saw today.

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