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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2012, 01:38 PM
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Great video and true any one that grew up in unions from the 40s till now have seen them change from the early inception, started by good men with ideals . and through the years gradually change to become power hungry. They changed along with our government, corporations, churches, law enforcement, News papers and news shows (the days of Walter Winchel are gone and news now is not unbiased or fair news its made to fit the views of the people in charge etc etc.) with corruptness, power, influance Etc!

The days of any kid growing up to be president are long gone. And money is the deciding factor along with twisting the truth. You have to sell your soul to climb the ladder today every one on this thread has good points if you keep an open mind! but ounce you close it and fall into the trap of believing only one side and swallowing the hog wash being dealt out
by the right or the left or the tea baggers or any other group that tries to influence you your being led around by the ring in your nose If you seek the truth its somewhere in the middle (I hope)! Or maybe its been pushed so far out of sight we wont be able to recover it!!!! !! I know engineers that left the U.S.A. to work overseas because it was either that or work at Mc. Donalds that was survival and I dont blame them but corporations that left or imported goods that were still making good profits here but left for a little more profit I blame!!!

Young people dont want to start at the bottom any more and work ethics are out the window. some of My own children are in that group and it pains me to say so.I know many hard working people who lost jobs and need help to just eat one meal a day and sought government help and are ashamed and trying to get to work! and I know people who have grown up on that help and don't even try to get off (and have cable & new cars). But the big mistake we make is rolling them in the same bag and labeling it the same !!!

Compassion is dying for the deserving because of the few that know the holes in the system and abuse it! Im not a bleeding heart! But if the government people drawing pay checks did their jobs policing well fair fraud I think most of the abusers would be found real quick If your on well fair and can pay a cable bill kick em off !!!

There are a lot of bad unions now more then I can count and its the workers fault for voting in these crooks when there were good unions around that actually did something good for the workers and the company's they were in. Years back In my own business I brought the union in and hired men out of the union hall because I knew the journeyman I hired were well trained and didn't just pay money to get their cards, My shop wasn't big and I only had around 10 men and I had an apprenticeship program through the union and the government. I took pride in that. But through the years when factory's closed corporations moved and this foreign crap flooded the markets I had to downsize and when I was burned in a gas fire finally had to close and when I recuperated moved to a new area and opened a small shop with me the only worker and I drew a check with my wife as boss LOL and I joined the union LOL

Chris

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Old 06-12-2012, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by V8Square
How true,how true. By the way, WELCOME HOME VET!!!

Tom
Vietnam Vet from TET
U.S. Air Force 1965-1969

Tom:
65 ! May of bumped elbows! This jar head says thanks!

Chris
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  #63 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2012, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by gow589
Do you remember the "MADE IN USA" campaign Walmart used to have? Do you remember what stopped it? When Hillary Clinton came on to the board of directors at Walmart she put a stop to the "Made In America" campaign.
Clinton served on the board of WalMart from 86 to 92. WalMart started their Made in USA campaign while she was on the board. Actually, Bill Clinton talked to Sam Walton about the possibility of WalMart buying shirts from an Arkansas plant that was about to shut down and cost 200 jobs. Sam did buy shirts from them and kept them going, and he said that's what got him to thinking about how he could help Americans by selling more US made products in his stores.

After Sam died and his relatives, most of whom had never done an honest day's work in their lives, inherited the company, selling US made goods became less important because, as is typical of the idle rich, the most important thing was how much money they could make while continuing to do nothing. If Sam Walton came back from the grave tomorrow, the first thing he'd likely do is disinherit his useless relatives.

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The people Hillary and Walmart did business with in China were large donors to Hillary's campaign. What was the first thing Hillary did as Secretary of State? She went to China and said (there are U-tube videos of this) "We are resetting relations...we are no longer interested in your human rights violations; we are just interested in securing loans for our bail outs!"
The United States has never EVER approached China for the purpose of securing a loan. The Chinese government buys US Treasury securities at the same prices anyone else pays for them. They buy them of their own free will, and have been doing so since long before Hillary became Secretary of State. They buy them because they, along with the rest of the world, consider the US and its debt the safest place in the world to put their money. We may have too much national debt, but we sure don't have any trouble selling T-notes without asking any particular country or organization to help us out by buying them.

Quote:
I don't agree with corporate greed being the problem. Getting product made elsewhere is the only way because the government has regulated and taxed our product out of profitability.
Corporate and personal tax rates are lower in the US right now than they've been at any time in the last 60 years, so the claim of high income tax making business uncompetitive is simply untrue. What's important in taxes isn't the published rate but rather the actual rates paid. Those actual rates are right in the middle among what we consider civilized countries. People built industries and people got rich in the 50's and 60's when tax rates were far higher than they are now.

Companies from all over the world come here to build plants because we are known for having the world's most productive workforce, generally favorable business regulations as compared to most other 1st world countries, and the safest place on earth to invest their money. Makes one wonder, if all those foreign companies choose to come here and invest in plants, are they just smarter than the ones who run American businesses and can't seem to make any money unless they outsource jobs to dollar a day labor, or are the US business executives just more greedy and not satisfied with the same rates of return that satisfy the owners of foreign companies? Dumber, or more greedy.... take your choice.

Quote:
What have we done over the last couple years? We doubled the size of government while industry has shriveled up like crops with no water.
Government has grown slower over the last 3 years than at any time in the last 50 years. The numbers are readily available. Look 'em up. The budget was balanced in 2000. The tax cuts of 01 and 03, combined with the collapse of the housing bubble and the Wall St casino in 07 and 08 resulted in almost $500 billion less federal tax revenue in 2010 as compared to 2000. During the same period, defense spending went from about $400 billion/yr to about $1.1 trillion once all the defense expenditures that are hidden in other departments are added in.

Then we can add in another $50 billion/yr for the Medicare part D drug coverage which was passed around 04 or 05 with no method for funding, and we've got a total of $1.25 trillion in increased spending and decreased revenues, all of which goes straight to the deficit. The deficit for 2010 was 1.3 trillion. The fact that we had a large deficit and an increase in the national debt was not a result of government growing in 2010. I used 2010 because that's the latest year for which comprehensive spending and revenue statistics are available.

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There is a long list of things making corporations non competitive i the United States. Number one on the list is corporate taxes. Until we drop the corporate tax rate it is simply cheaper to buy product made elsewhere.
This statement makes no sense whatsoever. Lowering the corporate tax rate does not make it cheaper to produce a product in the US. Materials like steel, plastics, aluminum, and textile products are commodities, and their price shifts according to world demand, and not according to tax rates. Labor costs are what they are for any particular company, and tax rates neither raise nor lower those labor costs.

General Motors is the perfect example to show its incompetent management and not tax rates that determine the competitive status of a business. GM had close to 30 years of incompetent management, and they let costs get way out of line, vehicles take way too long to go from inception to production, too many layers of management, and so forth. For the last 10 or so years of their existence, they paid no tax because they lost money every year. If you're losing money, it doesn't matter what the tax rates are. The restructuring got rid of the incompetents at the top, and got the labor and benefit costs back in line, and whaddaya know... GM is profitable again and is once again the world's largest carmaker. They'll likely have to pay some income tax for 2012, but that only means they're doing good and making money.

And, before you start some rant about how it was the unions that broke the carmakers, just remember that no union ever got one cent more in wages or benefits than management was willing to give them. Its human nature to try to get as much as you can, but its management's job to say no when you want too much. When management gave out more than the company could afford over the long term, that's just further proof of how incompetent the management really was.

Ford could've been in the same boat as GM and Chrysler since they had the same union contracts, wages, and work rules, but Bill Ford was man enough to admit he didn't have what it took to run one of the world's largest manufacturing companies, so he hired Alan Mulally as CEO. No disgrace in admitting your own limitations IMO, and Ford likely saved the company by that admission. Mulally will prove over the long term to be one of the sharpest guys ever to run a car company, and he proved already that he's in a different league from the knuckleheads who used to be behind the big desks at GM and Chrysler.

Last edited by TubeTek; 06-12-2012 at 08:54 PM.
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old 06-12-2012, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by TubeTek
Clinton served on the board of WalMart from 86 to 92. WalMart started their Made in USA campaign while she was on the board. Actually, Bill Clinton talked to Sam Walton about the possibility of WalMart buying shirts from an Arkansas plant that was about to shut down and cost 200 jobs. Sam did buy shirts from them and kept them going, and he said that's what got him to thinking about how he could help Americans by selling more US made products in his stores.

After Sam died and his relatives, most of whom had never done an honest day's work in their lives, inherited the company, selling US made goods became less important because, as is typical of the idle rich, the most important thing was how much money they could make while continuing to do nothing. If Sam Walton came back from the grave tomorrow, the first thing he'd likely do is disinherit his useless relatives.

The United States has never EVER approached China for the purpose of securing a loan. The Chinese government buys US Treasury securities at the same prices anyone else pays for them. They buy them of their own free will, and have been doing so since long before Hillary became Secretary of State. They buy them because they, along with the rest of the world, consider the US and its debt the safest place in the world to put their money. We may have too much national debt, but we sure don't have any trouble selling T-notes without asking any particular country or organization to help us out by buying them.


Corporate and personal tax rates are lower in the US right now than they've been at any time in the last 60 years, so the claim of high income tax making business uncompetitive is simply untrue. What's important in taxes isn't the published rate but rather the actual rates paid. Those actual rates are right in the middle among what we consider civilized countries. People built industries and people got rich in the 50's and 60's when tax rates were far higher than they are now.

Companies from all over the world come here to build plants because we are known for having the world's most productive workforce, generally favorable business regulations as compared to most other 1st world countries, and the safest place on earth to invest their money. Makes one wonder, if all those foreign companies choose to come here and invest in plants, are they just smarter than the ones who run American businesses and can't seem to make any money unless they outsource jobs to dollar a day labor, or are the US business executives just more greedy and not satisfied with the same rates of return that satisfy the owners of foreign companies? Dumber, or more greedy.... take your choice.


Government has grown slower over the last 3 years than at any time in the last 50 years. The numbers are readily available. Look 'em up. The budget was balanced in 2000. The tax cuts of 01 and 03, combined with the collapse of the housing bubble and the Wall St casino in 07 and 08 resulted in almost $500 billion less federal tax revenue in 2010 as compared to 2000. During the same period, defense spending went from about $400 billion/yr to about $1.1 trillion once all the defense expenditures that are hidden in other departments are added in.

Then we can add in another $50 billion/yr for the Medicare part D drug coverage which was passed around 04 or 05 with no method for funding, and we've got a total of $1.25 trillion in increased spending and decreased revenues, all of which goes straight to the deficit. The deficit for 2010 was 1.3 trillion. The fact that we had a large deficit and an increase in the national debt was not a result of government growing in 2010. I used 2010 because that's the latest year for which comprehensive spending and revenue statistics are available.


This statement makes no sense whatsoever. Lowering the corporate tax rate does not make it cheaper to produce a product in the US. Materials like steel, plastics, aluminum, and textile products are commodities, and their price shifts according to world demand, and not according to tax rates. Labor costs are what they are for any particular company, and tax rates neither raise nor lower those labor costs.

General Motors is the perfect example to show its incompetent management and not tax rates that determine the competitive status of a business. GM had close to 30 years of incompetent management, and they let costs get way out of line, vehicles take way too long to go from inception to production, too many layers of management, and so forth. For the last 10 or so years of their existence, they paid no tax because they lost money every year. If you're losing money, it doesn't matter what the tax rates are. The restructuring got rid of the incompetents at the top, and got the labor and benefit costs back in line, and whaddaya know... GM is profitable again and is once again the world's largest carmaker. They'll likely have to pay some income tax for 2012, but that only means they're doing good and making money.

And, before you start some rant about how it was the unions that broke the carmakers, just remember that no union ever got one cent more in wages or benefits than management was willing to give them. Its human nature to try to get as much as you can, but its management's job to say no when you want too much. When management gave out more than the company could afford over the long term, that's just further proof of how incompetent the management really was.

Ford could've been in the same boat as GM and Chrysler since they had the same union contracts, wages, and work rules, but Bill Ford was man enough to admit he didn't have what it took to run one of the world's largest manufacturing companies, so he hired Alan Mulally as CEO. No disgrace in admitting your own limitations IMO, and Ford likely saved the company by that admission. Mulally will prove over the long term to be one of the sharpest guys ever to run a car company, and he proved already that he's in a different league from the knuckleheads who used to be behind the big desks at GM and Chrysler.
^^^^
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Old 06-13-2012, 05:53 AM
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View this and see what you think


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lvl5G...ature=youtu.be
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old 06-13-2012, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by TubeTek
Clinton served on the board of WalMart from 86 to 92. WalMart started their Made in USA campaign while she was on the board. Actually, Bill Clinton talked to Sam Walton about the possibility of WalMart buying shirts from an Arkansas plant that was about to shut down and cost 200 jobs. Sam did buy shirts from them and kept them going, and he said that's what got him to thinking about how he could help Americans by selling more US made products in his stores.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TubeTek
The United States has never EVER approached China for the purpose of securing a loan. The Chinese government buys US Treasury securities at the same prices anyone else pays for them. They buy them of their own free will, and have been doing so since long before Hillary became Secretary of State. They buy them because they, along with the rest of the world, consider the US and its debt the safest place in the world to put their money. We may have too much national debt, but we sure don't have any trouble selling T-notes without asking any particular country or organization to help us out by buying them.
What on earth makes you think that?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-survival.html


"Our pressing on those issues can't interfere on the global economic crisis, the global climate change crisis and the security crisis."

She actually said that several times in her visit meaning; we need more money we'll turn the other way on human rights issues. It was quite clear and well reported.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/top-...ave-jumped-452

"At the end of January 2009, China owned $739.6 billion in U.S. government debt and Japan owned $634.8 billion.

By the end of March 2012, China’s holdings of U.S. debt had grown to $1.1699 trillion and Japan’s holdings had grown to $1.083 trillion."

We either make our own money or get it from countries like China. China has even secured properties on some of these loans in our national parks. China is not happy with how much money we have printed on our own in the last couple years as it undermines these loans by devaluing the dollar.

http://www.nohrden.net/Nohrden/Clinton-China.html

"In 1985, Wal-Mart embarked upon its “Buy American” campaign. Wal-Mart advertising and in-store signs touted the mostly American made products that it sold. It felt good to shop at Wal-Mart because you could save a few dollars and help our economy by keeping factory workers employed in America. That campaign lasted about a year.
In 1986, Hillary Clinton joined the Wal-Mart board of directors, and soon thereafter, the ubiquitous “Made in the USA” label disappeared, replaced by the now all-too-familiar “Made in China” label. During her reign on the Wal-Mart board of directors, which officially ended in 1992 when Bill Clinton was elected President, Wal-Mart dramatically reduced its reliance on American manufacturers and increased its reliance on Chinese suppliers."

There are also articles on Bill himself involved in Walmarts movement of buyers to China but I doubt you are interested in hearing it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TubeTek
Corporate and personal tax rates are lower in the US right now than they've been at any time in the last 60 years, so the claim of high income tax making business uncompetitive is simply untrue. What's important in taxes isn't the published rate but rather the actual rates paid. Those actual rates are right in the middle among what we consider civilized countries. People built industries and people got rich in the 50's and 60's when tax rates were far higher than they are now.

Corporate tax rates are some of the highest rates in the WORLD and that is fact. INCOME from taxes are the lowest they have been in years due to the economic down turn from the democratic housing crises which crushed this economy, liberal laws and regulations and yes because of lost profitability due to unions.

I could go on and on about why every point you made is more a religion then fact and much of the cause of the downfall in this country but I don't have time and I don't think you care about any point I would make anyway.
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Old 06-13-2012, 01:40 PM
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Hey Gow...............

RIGHT ON TARGET ! ! ! ! It all adds up.. there are a dozen reasons we are where we are.. And the Dem's and their policies/relationships/motives are NOT the least of the reasons.
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Old 06-13-2012, 02:18 PM
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Some interesting news broke today on this subject.. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...6pLid%3D169383

Brian
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Old 06-13-2012, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by gow589
INCOME from taxes are the lowest they have been in years due to the economic down turn from the democratic housing crises which crushed this economy, liberal laws and regulations and yes because of lost profitability due to unions.

Lost all credibility with that one statement with me. Please do explain to us how the housing crisis, which actually began in '07, was a "democratic housing crisis"?

Last edited by Steel; 06-13-2012 at 02:34 PM.
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Old 06-13-2012, 02:47 PM
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Lost all credibility with that one statement with me. Please do explain to us how the it was a "democratic housing crisis"?
1977 Community Re-investment act. The short version is that Carter implemented the act which forced banks to make housing loans to people who could not afford them. This was further tightened by Clinton to include fines if the banks did not report a specific percentage of loans to low income people.

This was protected by Pelosy, Reed, Dodd, and obama. obama mostly voted "present" so he could not be pinned down on issues except for the housing legislation and late term abortions.

Bush and McCain tried 13 times to stop it. It was brought to a vote 2x under Bush and was slapped down by Pelosi and others in a vile vain public manner.

obama's financial adviser Franklin Rains was appointed to Fannie Maie in an effort to bury the bad loans all while taking more then $91+ million from the company. The bail out of these companies were an attempt to forgive the loans in a wealth redistribution to those who could not pay for it.

Everyone knew it was coming and no one could stop it. This was a video being circulated warning long before the collapse:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzJmTCYmo9g

Ironically, to get loans o those who made no money banks had to drop their loan criteria so low even millionaires were securing loans they could not afford.

Heading into the 2008 elections everyone knew what was coming. The markets were beginning to go stale right before the elections with obama being the obvious victor. When McCain pulled out the Republicans felt a boost for that week and durring that week the markets rallied. As McCain hopes fell flat and obama was elected those with money took their money form the market and ran as the deomocratic housing crises collapsed.

The housing market and our economy has been held hostage by bail outs and liberla policies ever since. Between obamacare and that which is gone on for the last 3 years our economy does not have a chance and the debt added it is going to keep it down for some time.

But the details of the whole democratic housing crises are even worse and take volumes to lay out. Bush had some liberal policies which did not help and certainly was not powerful enough in a Democratic house and Democratic Senate to stop it.

http://tjhancock.wordpress.com/housi...ve-assessment/

http://sbvor.blogspot.com/2008/09/19...ct-carter.html

Bush basically handed obama the keys to the money vault and set us up on his way out. Had it not been for the democratic housing crises and obama, we would have never had this devastating recessions.

You can spend days reading volumes about the democratic corruption which set all this up.
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Old 06-13-2012, 03:15 PM
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Hey, Gow589

You missed this one. The liberal press NEVER mentions this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPSDnGMzIdo
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Old 06-13-2012, 03:22 PM
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Oh I missed a couple

These are PRIME ! (and NOT sub-prime)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iW5qK...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTbIb...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxMIn...eature=related

And most importantly... LOTS of info here...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzWrn...eature=related
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Old 06-13-2012, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by gow589
What on earth makes you think that?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-survival.html


"Our pressing on those issues can't interfere on the global economic crisis, the global climate change crisis and the security crisis."

She actually said that several times in her visit meaning; we need more money we'll turn the other way on human rights issues. It was quite clear and well reported.
So before you put a statement in quotes and attributed it to Clinton where she supposedly said "We are resetting relations...we are no longer interested in your human rights violations; we are just interested in securing loans for our bail outs!", but now you're giving your own interpretation of Clinton's remarks, which fit with your lunatic fringe ranting, but not with a legitimate interpretation of what she said. Just so you know, when you dream up some statement, put it in quotes, and attribute it to some other person, you are a liar by all definitions of the word.

Quote:
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/top-...ave-jumped-452

"At the end of January 2009, China owned $739.6 billion in U.S. government debt and Japan owned $634.8 billion.

By the end of March 2012, China’s holdings of U.S. debt had grown to $1.1699 trillion and Japan’s holdings had grown to $1.083 trillion."
That may well be true, but it doesn't do anything to prove your claim that the US runs around the world begging the Chinese or anyone else to buy our debt. Countries, businesses, and individuals buy US debt of their own free will.

Furthermore, the US didn't need to borrow anything to do the bailouts. They were loans, not spending. A couple buttons get pushed on a computer, and Wall St suddenly had a trillion bucks they didn't have yesterday, along with a promissory note to the US Treasury to pay it all back with interest. The only part that hasn't been paid back is part of the loan to AIG. The rest paid the loans back, with interest, and the gov't made a profit on the loans.

If some part of the loan to AIG is written off at some point in the future, then that amount will go into the spending column. But, at the bottom line, we haven't had to borrow anything from anyone so far to cover the bailouts.

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We either make our own money or get it from countries like China. China has even secured properties on some of these loans in our national parks. China is not happy with how much money we have printed on our own in the last couple years as it undermines these loans by devaluing the dollar.
The part in bold above is the most outlandishly ignorant statement you've made so far, and proof that you'll believe anything any mentally defective lunatic posts on the web, so long as it fits with your version of the truth.

Treasury debt is backed by one thing, and one thing only. That's "The full faith and credit of the United States of America". Neither the Congress nor the President have the authority to promise US land, public or private, as collateral for debt. Of course, minor inconveniences like the Constitution don't prevent conspiracy theory lunatics from posting such idiocy on their blogs, nor does it prevent the fringe from repeating it as the truth.

Quote:
http://www.nohrden.net/Nohrden/Clinton-China.html

"In 1985, Wal-Mart embarked upon its “Buy American” campaign. Wal-Mart advertising and in-store signs touted the mostly American made products that it sold. It felt good to shop at Wal-Mart because you could save a few dollars and help our economy by keeping factory workers employed in America. That campaign lasted about a year.
In 1986, Hillary Clinton joined the Wal-Mart board of directors, and soon thereafter, the ubiquitous “Made in the USA” label disappeared, replaced by the now all-too-familiar “Made in China” label. During her reign on the Wal-Mart board of directors, which officially ended in 1992 when Bill Clinton was elected President, Wal-Mart dramatically reduced its reliance on American manufacturers and increased its reliance on Chinese suppliers."
The only problem is that the above is a provable lie. Walmart's Made in USA campaign was still running in the stores in the spring of 1993, well after Walton had died and Clinton had left the board. The proof of this is in the fact that NBC's Dateline TV show claimed some imported merchandise was being sold under Made in USA banners in the stores. David Glass, the head of WalMart at that time, appeared on TV and admitted it was true but that the merchandise had been placed in the Made in USA areas by mistake. If the program had ended in 87 (a year after Clinton went on the board), the CEO wouldn't have been on national TV apologizing for anything 6 yrs later. FWIW, it took about 2 minutes of googling to find the proof that Nohrden is a liar, and anyone who's interested in facts rather than the rants of lunatics can find it just as easily as I did.

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Corporate tax rates are some of the highest rates in the WORLD and that is fact. INCOME from taxes are the lowest they have been in years due to the economic down turn from the democratic housing crises which crushed this economy, liberal laws and regulations and yes because of lost profitability due to unions.
Do you ever attempt to use any actual facts, or do you only regurgitate whatever you hear on Fox News or read on the looney fringe web? Just this week, the tax receipt figures came out from the federal gov't for 2011, and the average rate paid by corporations was about 12.5%. As I said before, its the rate that's paid that matters, and not the published rate. 12.5% doesn't even bring us up to the middle level, much less the top.

Your babbling about the Community Reinvestment Act and its role in the Wall St collapse shows your utter ignorance of that entire situation. The collapse was caused by derivatives formed from collateralized debt instruments and unbacked insurance on those instruments in the form of credit default swaps.

Over 70% of the home loans made during the real estate bubble were made by entities not subject to the CRA. Of the ones made by banks subject to CRA regs, only a small portion of those were actually made as a part of CRA compliance. There is no language in the CRA that required any bank to make a loan of even one cent to anyone who wasn't creditworthy. I've read the act from start to finish, and the language in it is very plain that no such requirement exists. Among the banks subject to CRA rules, their own reports showed that the default rate on CRA loans was no higher than the default rate for non-CRA loans.

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I could go on and on about why every point you made is more a religion then fact and much of the cause of the downfall in this country but I don't have time and I don't think you care about any point I would make anyway.
People like you never make legitimate points, because you're incapable of recognizing the difference between facts and lunatic internet rantings that agree with your own bigoted view of the world.

Note to moderators and/or site owner.... I'm a moderator on a site with about 75,000 members that deals with manufacturing issues. My unsolicited advice, based on my experiences there, is that you delete this entire thread. I've been in business for 27 yrs, and I doubt there's anyone here who's more concerned with keeping jobs here at home, but the Made in China type threads never accomplish anything and almost always turn into political rants and demonstrations of abject ignorance.

The type poster who bases his posts on looney-tune websites with no regard for the truth simply won't give up. They'll always be looking for some excuse to turn any sort of discussion into a political rant. For some reason, once a few such threads exist, they seem to draw more of the fringe nuts like flies to a fresh cowpile, and most of the ones who join to add their rants have neither interest nor knowledge of the core subject of the site.

I used to waste several hours a week on nothing but proving them to be liars, but eventually found it works better to just do the delete thing, followed by banning the ones who refuse to get the message. This type problem is far worse on our site than it currently is here on yours, but if you give the ones who're determined to post political rants an inch, you'll be amazed at how fast it'll grow into a real headache for you. Been there, done that, and still dealing with it on a too regular basis.

Thanks for maintaining an informative site.
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Old 06-13-2012, 09:31 PM
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Minute you start calling me a liar is the last word from you I'll ever read. You don't have many friends do you!
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