Degree that cam - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Engine
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2005, 12:18 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Long Beach
Posts: 1
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Degree that cam

I bought a cam with a 486 lift and a 231 duration.I installed it by lineing up the camshaft dot and the crankshaft dot, and the car spits fire out of the carburetor and wont start. The cam chart says set at 10 degrees retarded I dont know if they ment the distributor or the cam? Help me!

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2005, 01:36 AM
Siggy_Freud's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Portland, Oregon
Age: 29
Posts: 2,371
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Im pretty sure they meant the cam. Distributor timing is usually more open to what works best, but if they have an odd grind on that cam that requires it to be 10 degrees retarded, no amount of tinkering with the distributor is going to fix it. That said, in my limited cam experience I havent come across a cam that recommended that. What brand is it?
__________________
Bringing history and technology together.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2005, 08:04 AM
Max Keith's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Fort Madison,Iowa
Age: 66
Posts: 2,391
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Timely question

That means cam timing. You need a degree wheel and the speck sheet from the cam to degree it in.
That does sound like a lot of retard on the cam, as most I have ever seen was the recommendation to either advance or retard the cam at the most, about 6 degrees.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2005, 12:46 PM
E.T. divided by $ spent= Speed
 
Last photo:
Join Date: May 2002
Location: NYS america's unwiped butt
Age: 35
Posts: 1,858
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
That does sound like allot to retard a cam.Most cams should work setting them dot to dot.
If its blowing fire balls out the carb.
Are you sure your distributor isnt off a tooth or 180 out??Or perhaps firing order off.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 04-30-2005, 04:19 PM
camaroman7d's Avatar
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Vacaville, California
Age: 47
Posts: 2,245
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 3
Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
I agree, 10* of retard is a LOT. I also agree your problem is more than likely the distributor is 180* out that's why it is backfiring through the carb. I highly doubt it's due to the cam.

Some gear sets line up dot to dot and puts #6 on the firing stroke other line up and put #1 on the firing stroke. Unless you paid close attention (or degreed the cam) it is very easy to get mixed up.

Pull the distributor turn it 180* (half a turn) and pop it back in. I bet the car will run then.


Royce
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 05-01-2005, 07:50 AM
Member
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Indiana
Age: 60
Posts: 393
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
It sounds like you already have the motor together if your trying to start it. I would try other things first before I would rip it apart to degree the cam. I agree with camaroman7d on the timing being off. You can check if the dist. is 180 out by turning the motor over by hand. With the plug out you can put a rod in the cylinder feel the piston come up. See where the dist is pointing. Is it toward #1? If you have a valve open by loooking at the rockers its 180 out. If both valves are closed its not.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 05-01-2005, 01:34 PM
Siggy_Freud's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Portland, Oregon
Age: 29
Posts: 2,371
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Or as a quick check just swap each plug wire directly across from each other to offset the problem. If it is 180 off, then I'd pull the distributor and set it in the right way so as not to confuse you later on, or the next person who has to work on the vehicle.
__________________
Bringing history and technology together.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 05-01-2005, 03:11 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: WA.
Age: 57
Posts: 507
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I am guessin that you're wishin that you woulda degreed that cam and you really shouldn't overlook that on any motor you care about even if you are rebuilding with the same cam. I've never heard of setting one up 10 degrees retarded though and dont know how you could get there for sure without degreeing it. I would check with the grinder and clarify the 10 and if its crank degrees or cam degrees.

After you're sure that it aint just out 180 (and I certainly hope it is), I'd pull it and degree it to be sure. You could have misindexed by a tooth and if you did there is a real possibility of bending valves and push rods depending on your combination. If its barking back through the carb, that sounds like the cam is retarded though.

If you consider the tolerance stack ups between parts and manufacturers its easy to see that lining up the dots is rarely (never) gonna be perfect. If the crank manufacturer has a tolerence of plus or minus 3/4 of a degree in the location of a keyway and the guy making sprockets has the same tolerance and then the cam guy has the same, you could be 5 degrees out while the dots line up.

Also, the cam grinder could've screwed up. Degreeing the cam is the only way to know for sure that what he gave you matches his intent for that particular motor.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2005, 05:07 AM
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 

Last journal entry: PICTURE TEST
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: york pa
Age: 52
Posts: 2,795
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
timing

You never want to 10 degree retard anything!!!!! Ignition timing or valve events......

What cam chart are you talking about????

Are you talking about the cam card???? If so post us the numbers and we will get you going in the right direction....

Keith
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2005, 06:15 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Cincinnati,ohio
Posts: 67
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
It could be many things, staryting with what they said about checking for 180 out etc, or off a tooth.
1. at TDC make sure both #1 valves are closed, if not then the cam is definately installed wrong, generally meaning you have lined the gear a tooth off or so, I know you say you lined up the dots, but I've seen many experienced builders do it before.
2. At tdc, pull everything apart that has to do with the ignition. and make sure you engine is a true TDC with a cam that calls for any amount of advance or retarding it must be at true TDC, make sure your timing indicator is correct and that your balancer is marked right. I have seen the mark on the balancer not be true TDC.
Basically start over with TDC, firing order, distributer positioning. If this doesn't work then take the cover off and degree the cam. It's probably a matter of either the car not being at true TDC or your firing order or distributer is positioned wrong.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 05-02-2005, 06:26 PM
Lonestar's Avatar
"May the Schwartz be with you"
 
Last wiki edit: How to rebuild an engine
Last journal entry: Finally getting going...
Last photo:
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: United States
Age: 43
Posts: 1,054
Wiki Edits: 1

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Did you check to be sure that #1 was at TDC before setting sprockets dot to dot?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Engine posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Variance in Cam Degeeing DTL504 Engine 3 05-22-2004 04:53 PM
I think we made a cam mistake! Jmark Engine 11 12-30-2003 10:32 AM
Cam Help black66 Engine 3 05-12-2003 06:15 PM
289 cam change franklin289 Engine 0 04-22-2003 02:38 PM
Installing a cam 70 nova Engine 10 03-30-2003 03:13 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:02 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.