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  #136 (permalink)  
Old 09-05-2009, 08:09 PM
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Reading this thread has been a gas, almost as funny as one on "health care reform"

Paint type...there are so many factors in the decision besides costs - like...

new car
old car
plastic car
fiberglass car
aluminum car
restoration
show car
daily driver
weekend warrior
trailer queen

Most lacquers were discontinued due to the VOC regulations and the fact the after the early 70.s lacquer was not used in production cars.

I believe in using what the car came with for spot repairs or restoration regardless of your personal preferences.

Old car, show car, trailer queen - PPG Acrylic lacquer hands down is the only thing I would use.

The mil thickness buildup of catalyzed primers and the newer urethanes blur the nice sharp lines on older cars - that's why I don't use it on older cars I do for myself.

I think the reason so many hate lacquer is they don't know how to do bodywork.

I'm old school - learned in the early 80.s - I finish my bodywork out to 220 before primer is ever applied. Spot putty was lacquer based then and used SPARINGLY, not like todays catalyzed primers and spot putty where its used like another layer of bondo.

This 1968 Chevelle was painted in 1980 using PPG Acrylic Lacquer, sat outside nearly it's whole life, was only waxed only 1x-2x a year max, and looked like this until it was sold in 94.

No checking, hazing or cracking, minimal rock chips or scratches = no more than any car I see on the roads today with newer paint systems.

Quote:
Bottom line - Spend whatever time and money you want on your paint job, It will only hold up and be as good as what is underneath. Cut time on prep and materials anything will fail.


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  #137 (permalink)  
Old 09-06-2009, 08:45 PM
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Rambo, the first real words of wisdom in this whole discussion.
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  #138 (permalink)  
Old 09-07-2009, 06:32 AM
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I think the point of the original subject of this thread has been lost.



As Rambo pointed out there are sometimes reasons why a person would want to use Lacquer but the subject was about Dupli-Color Lacquer being a good cost alternative to other systems that are available, which it clearly is not, and the claims by some that it is more durable than Lacquer from the past. Sure there are reasons for using Lacquer on some classics but if someone wants to use Dupli-Color expecting to save money and get a durable paint they are going to be sorely disappointed. The warnings in this thread are not aimed at the knowledgeable painter who wants to use Lacquer but it is to cut though the advertising hype and let the beginner know what he is really getting into with Dupli-Color so he can make a better informed choice. Using an example of painting true classics with a classic paint made by a top-of-the-line paint maker that is not pushing it as a cost effective means (especially when it obviously is not) is simply changing the subject!


Bug if you think this thread lacks wisdom then there is little wisdom to your thinking!

Last edited by oldred; 09-07-2009 at 09:49 AM.
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  #139 (permalink)  
Old 09-07-2009, 01:57 PM
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I think this web does have wisdom, but I think there is a lot a chest puffing going on. I never criticize a product or a business unless I have personal experience with it. I doubt any of the naysayers here have tried out the duplicolor product
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  #140 (permalink)  
Old 09-07-2009, 02:26 PM
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Well I said my piece about it and yes I have some experience with it (The Dupli-Color) not a lot just sprayed for someone else once, sprayed a Massey Ferguson Tractor (yep that's what the guy bought for it!) and a 1969 Honda motorcycle tank and side covers. The stuff is Lacquer, period! I learned to spray using Lacquer back in the early 70's and used it off and on until it became unavailable, or nearly so. It sprays like Lacquer and dries like Lacquer meaning it needs to be cut and buffed and as thin as the Dupli-Color crap is that means in order to get enough coverage to safely work with the painter is going to have to buy a heck of a lot of those "economical" pre-thinned qts. I don't believe anyone here is saying you can't make Lacquer look good, heck everyone who knows anything about paint knows that when properly done Lacquer can, and often is, show quality in appearance even if the durability is a bit questionable. What the debate here has been about is Dupli-Color being touted as an economical and durable alternative to modern finishes which it clearly is not. The advertising hype lures some who don't know better yet into thinking they can paint really cheap and then once into it they have to buy more and more material until by the time they finish they will have as much or more than they would had they used a better paint. All we have been pointing out is the stuff is not economical and when finished the car will be painted with a Lacquer paint that will take a heck of a lot of work to do right, will chip easily and is likely to fade rather quickly.
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  #141 (permalink)  
Old 09-07-2009, 05:09 PM
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I bought a qt of the Duplicolor as a test ( push lawn mower )... few coats of the stuff over some dupli primer.. and it didn't look good. $20 wasted.. probably could have cut and buffed like is really required but. it is a lawn mower . wanted it to look decent with little work... instead, I scuffed it, bought 2 pints of Ace hardeware rust stop ( rustoleum ) in Intl Red ( $4/ pint ) and brushed it on.. now the rustoleum shouldn't be used on cars but, it was designed for equipment,and it is a lawn mower... even now, the mower has been restored/repowered/ in service since late june, the paint is starting to haze and loose color... and I keep it in dry storage when not in use
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  #142 (permalink)  
Old 09-07-2009, 08:15 PM
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Matt, that tractor was painted red and as was recommended we shot Dupli-Color clear over the color. The guy thought the clear would bring out the gloss but of course it didn't-just as I warned him before we sprayed it. The clear left some areas looking kind of glossy and others were just plain dull but that is normal for Lacquer and with some sanding and buffing, also normally required, it probably would have looked nice. OK, this is a tractor and not a street driven car so we scuffed it with 600, shot a coat of Nason clear over it and it looks fantastic!


BTW, this tractor is a collector piece and will reside in a garage out of the weather except for when it is towed to farm shows and such. Hey even classic tractors need a little TLC!
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  #143 (permalink)  
Old 09-09-2009, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambo_The_Dog
Reading this thread has been a gas, almost as funny as one on "health care reform"

Paint type...there are so many factors in the decision besides costs - like...

new car
old car
plastic car
fiberglass car
aluminum car
restoration
show car
daily driver
weekend warrior
trailer queen

Most lacquers were discontinued due to the VOC regulations and the fact the after the early 70.s lacquer was not used in production cars.

I believe in using what the car came with for spot repairs or restoration regardless of your personal preferences.

Old car, show car, trailer queen - PPG Acrylic lacquer hands down is the only thing I would use.

The mil thickness buildup of catalyzed primers and the newer urethanes blur the nice sharp lines on older cars - that's why I don't use it on older cars I do for myself.

I think the reason so many hate lacquer is they don't know how to do bodywork.

I'm old school - learned in the early 80.s - I finish my bodywork out to 220 before primer is ever applied. Spot putty was lacquer based then and used SPARINGLY, not like todays catalyzed primers and spot putty where its used like another layer of bondo.

This 1968 Chevelle was painted in 1980 using PPG Acrylic Lacquer, sat outside nearly it's whole life, was only waxed only 1x-2x a year max, and looked like this until it was sold in 94.

No checking, hazing or cracking, minimal rock chips or scratches = no more than any car I see on the roads today with newer paint systems.
Very well said Nice!
I still think the newer Lacquer paints work fine. Dupli-color Well it is what I said it was good for LOL,
If you watch there dupli-color challenge show they had going, it was cool to see what other pro's thought of the paint, not all the comments where good. The paint jobs turned out good to. So what ever works for you!

Rambo I agree with you on the know diffrent than any car with the newer paint systems. They all have there problem and depending on how well it was done, is how well it will last.

Craig
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  #144 (permalink)  
Old 09-09-2009, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldred
Matt, that tractor was painted red and as was recommended we shot Dupli-Color clear over the color. The guy thought the clear would bring out the gloss but of course it didn't-just as I warned him before we sprayed it. The clear left some areas looking kind of glossy and others were just plain dull but that is normal for Lacquer and with some sanding and buffing, also normally required, it probably would have looked nice. OK, this is a tractor and not a street driven car so we scuffed it with 600, shot a coat of Nason clear over it and it looks fantastic!


BTW, this tractor is a collector piece and will reside in a garage out of the weather except for when it is towed to farm shows and such. Hey even classic tractors need a little TLC!
yea, most of the show/collector tractors around me ( it's kinda big with the Farmers ).. get painted with Rustoleum ( sprayed ).. they look great, but there also buffed, polished and ran only for shows or parades. but the owners treat them just like we do our classic cars... nothing sounds neater than a Johnny popper
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  #145 (permalink)  
Old 09-09-2009, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matt167
yea, most of the show/collector tractors around me ( it's kinda big with the Farmers ).. get painted with Rustoleum ( sprayed ).. they look great, but there also buffed, polished and ran only for shows or parades. but the owners treat them just like we do our classic cars... nothing sounds neater than a Johnny popper


Most of the ones here get painted with implement enamel from Tractor Supply and after using both paints I can say for a fact that the implement enamel is a much better paint than the Dupli-Color and is quite a bit cheaper.

I see Chevy is still watching those goofy info-mercials, that's where he heard what the "pros" had to say.
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  #146 (permalink)  
Old 11-18-2009, 12:41 AM
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a painting quickie

hey, im a newbie on this site; read the whole thing. WOOOOW!!! i was given a 95 voyager rallye by my bro just b-4 going to florida in march 09 on vaca. the factory hood,roof clear coat had completely peeled and the paint cracked. being 12 hours b-4 going to fl., i quickly sanded the major areas not worrying about appearance and went and bought this "paint shop" stuff. now the reason for me getting it was the repair shop i borrow, the owner ran into a situation where we cannot paint but the city would allow lacquer to be sprayed but not as a business. there was a 15k$ fine IF i was caught spraying any other. as of durability, on the way to florida we put a magnetic c.b. ant on top and the time of contact disrupted the clear coat. i oopsed that myself not giving enough time to set. since then ive been waiting to fix. i googled something about "lacquer vs enamel and a link came up about paint hardness. this link (dont remember which one) said that enamel can go on top of lacquer due to enamel is harder???? is this true. i will check further into the site for more info. tx

Last edited by ampfixer; 11-18-2009 at 01:06 AM.
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  #147 (permalink)  
Old 11-18-2009, 09:36 PM
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I guess I will throw my thoughts into this tread as well.I panted my wheeler about 8 months ago with the paint shop stuff and for the price to do a small project,that IS going to get beat up you really cant beat it "IMO" that being said he is a pic of it form not to long ago
I would by "real stuff" to do a full scale rig I caired anything about.
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  #148 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2009, 06:10 PM
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I was Surprises Dup Was pushing This product this hard with DupliColor TV and having pro's showing what they could do with the stuff. If any thing it was interesting to Watch. I have been play around with the paint because it does not stink up the neighbor hood like the newer paints do. So I found that you can take high build lacquer and add it in and double or triple the Dup! Any way fun to experiment.

Craig
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  #149 (permalink)  
Old 11-22-2009, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChevyTruckGuy
I was Surprises Dup Was pushing This product this hard with DupliColor TV and having pro's showing what they could do with the stuff. Craig

I guess it just don't take much to surprise you does it?

There is just no convincing you so I am just wasting my time if I try but to anyone else out there thinking about using this crap look at what he just said, "on tv having pro's showing what they can do with the stuff". These so called pro's are being PAID to say what the manufacturer wants them to say and they will say anything the manufacturer tells them to say, anything can be made to look good for a short time. Chevy get real, these guys are PAID ADVERTISERS selling a product and nothing more what do you expect them to say? Good grief man this is a stinking tv commercial hawking a product what kind of creditability is that?

Even more important what do people think about the creditability of a person that would point to a tv "infomercial" as a source of info for the quality of a product?


I guess if it is advertised on tv it must be good!
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  #150 (permalink)  
Old 11-22-2009, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldred
I guess it just don't take much to surprise you does it?

There is just no convincing you so I am just wasting my time if I try but to anyone else out there thinking about using this crap look at what he just said, "on tv having pro's showing what they can do with the stuff". These so called pro's are being PAID to say what the manufacturer wants them to say and they will say anything the manufacturer tells them to say, anything can be made to look good for a short time. Chevy get real, these guys are PAID ADVERTISERS selling a product and nothing more what do you expect them to say? Good grief man this is a stinking tv commercial hawking a product what kind of creditability is that?

Even more important what do people think about the creditability of a person that would point to a tv "infomercial" as a source of info for the quality of a product?


I guess if it is advertised on tv it must be good!
It not about what other product do or don't do! Its about the New product pros cons. It allway been that way I started it to explore what they where saying on T.V. a real world test. You just don't get It So! I not wasting my time debate apples to oranges. But continue to reply to anyone about the products pros and cons in a fair way.
The T.V. show is something else and just interesting to see what pros are saying and watching then use the products. It not all good comments BTW But you would not know that would you!
It about the lacquer Nothing else. Apparently you can't see that So yeah you are wasting you time in that regard as this post has show not everyone like the stuff. So Get over it all ready.

Craig
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