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  #121 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2008, 07:06 AM
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I can't believe guy's are getting swallowed up in this thread... The correct advice was offered (several times), if they want to waste thier time and money and use a revision of old technolgy, then let them... My father painted his first car with Vaccum when he was a teenager, while it worked in that era, there are more effective ways now......Same applies here!!!!! Some of These TV programs show car's being built in a week etc.. what they don't show is the rework needed down the road.....

No offence to anyone - Too each his own.. But, This system is the replacement for the rust oleum artists. I would use this on a lawnmower, dress up shop equip. (Jack stands, racks etc..) Not to paint a car!

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  #122 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2008, 08:58 AM
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I guess some of us may have been beating on that dead horse and maybe we should now let him RIP. However if something even as well known as lacquer paint is touted as a "new" product and only the good side (if there is one in this case ) is shown then someone who is new to the hobby could easily be convinced to make a mistake. In this case an old product is being pushed with claims of being better than in years past with no credible evidence to back up those claims. To the contrary, it is sold by a low end paint supplier by a chain auto parts that deals in body supplies only as a sideline and on E-Bay from little known sellers. Lacquer was phased out by the major paint makers years ago and it's short comings are well known so I guess the point has been made many times over here and it is time to let it rest, if anyone is not convinced by now they never will be.
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  #123 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2008, 06:18 PM
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You can get a really deep shine out of lacquer and it'll look nice, but not for long.... what a lot of people do not realise is that the lead that made lacquer decent, is banned by the EPA, so now we get a crap version of lacquer, and only where it is still available.... Lacquer has been lead free for a long time now...
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  #124 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2008, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rovert
Ol red you just can't help yourself can you! I neither brag nor scold. For those of you who would like to learn how to paint your car lacquer is a good choice if it is allowed in your area. 1. Millions of cars were painted using lacquer for decades by the manufacturers those paints lasted for many years,you will find little evidence that they cracked, faded or failed prematurely. those cars you see with flaking white deposits on the hood,top or trunk are not lacquer-they are BC?CC! 2. If someone starts his reply with " I have 30 yrs experience" move on, if someone says "just to start an arguement" " you're dumb enough" " total bonehead" "people like you are stupid" "only an idiot"move on, you will glean little useful info from them. 3. these"old pros" are the same guys who resisted HVLP guns, urethane paints and still resist waterborne paints, now the lacquer they had embraced is "junk". 4. In fact, for beginers, lacquer is easy to use, very forgiving and most of all SAFER for you to use. 5. The old pros simply ignore isocyanates, that is iresponsible! Look up "paint fumes" by MartinSR or go to www.chevelles.com/forums/show thread.php?f=10397 this should be required reading before you decide to paint your own car!

First you say that lacquer is a good choice to learn how to paint your car. Since lacquer sprays differently than the paints normally used, it would actually be of little use. Playing video games will help just as much to hone your hand-eye coordination.

Then you talk about all of the people to ignor their advise. Evidently that is to make people think that they should only believe you, but I see no evidence of why anyone should believe you.

Lastly, you mention how much safer lacquer is to use. Fact is that lacquer is not safe, as it can destroy brain cells. Anyone that has much experience using lacquer knows about the "Highs" you get from the fumes. They also are quite aware of the explosive fumes that spraying it produces.

As for the information that you think should be read before painting, you should consider posting "links", and not just descriptions. Then people could look at that information and see if they think it is reliable. Everyone doesn't believe everything that they read on the internet is gospel. In fact, there is a lot of information on the internet about the dangers of ISO's that is false.

Aaron
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  #125 (permalink)  
Old 11-19-2008, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rovert
Ol red you just can't help yourself can you! I neither brag nor scold. For those of you who would like to learn how to paint your car lacquer is a good choice if it is allowed in your area. 1. Millions of cars were painted using lacquer for decades by the manufacturers those paints lasted for many years,you will find little evidence that they cracked, faded or failed prematurely. those cars you see with flaking white deposits on the hood,top or trunk are not lacquer-they are BC?CC! 2. If someone starts his reply with " I have 30 yrs experience" move on, if someone says "just to start an arguement" " you're dumb enough" " total bonehead" "people like you are stupid" "only an idiot"move on, you will glean little useful info from them. 3. these"old pros" are the same guys who resisted HVLP guns, urethane paints and still resist waterborne paints, now the lacquer they had embraced is "junk". 4. In fact, for beginers, lacquer is easy to use, very forgiving and most of all SAFER for you to use. 5. The old pros simply ignore isocyanates, that is iresponsible! Look up "paint fumes" by MartinSR or go to www.chevelles.com/forums/show thread.php?f=10397 this should be required reading before you decide to paint your own car!


I don't remember calling anyone names?

I sprayed lacquer for years, started out with the stuff, so I am familiar with it. Not trying to be a S^!&@#ss but do you have much experience with lacquer? As far the old pros being the same guys who resisted HVLP guns (whatever that is supposed to mean) if you mean they are set in their ways and refuse to change then think about what you are saying. These guys have used lacquer, are quite familiar with it and know very well what is wrong with it that's why they won't use it now so what has that got to do with stubbornly refusing new technology? I said lacquer will work, just not for long and that is the point-there are better options out there for the money. Also if you think Dupli-Color is anything even close to the durability of what the factories used you are kidding yourself.
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  #126 (permalink)  
Old 11-20-2008, 07:22 AM
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Guys, I think this is a lot like the bondo cam thread, no one really gives a crap but the promoters like to keep bring it to the front every so often to see if they can find a sucker out there.

Yea this crap is great, how great? First I can assure you the factory stuff was way better then you can get now but I have a 454 vette bought from one owner with less then 30,000 miles and it has never been repainted or seen rain in its lifetime, exception was left quarter that was damaged back in early 70's from a parking lot mishap a three inch gash. I have way to many hours stripping the great paint off the car, jambs and all the little nooks and crannies just for a simple repaint.

If it had not been factory lacquer, a 180 sand job, two coats of epoxy and it would have been done.
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  #127 (permalink)  
Old 11-20-2008, 03:30 PM
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Lastly, you mention how much safer lacquer is to use. Fact is that lacquer is not safe, as it can destroy brain cells. Anyone that has much experience using lacquer knows about the "Highs" you get from the fumes. They also are quite aware of the explosive fumes that spraying it produces.
My old bosses dad had a small shop for many years, and sprayed a lot of cars, often right out on the shop floor and without a respirator. What kind of paint do you think he sprayed those cars with, lacquer. It finally caught up with him, and heard he was in the hospital in pretty rough shape with a messed up nervous system.
Never heard how that all turned out, since I found a different job. Another painter had died before I got a job. He was only 50 and had a heart attack. Can't specifically say it had to do with the fact he was a painter so many years, but wouldn't doubt if it contributed to it. Spent many years spraying industrial paints, the carc stuff they use for the military, and even though it is a 1k product,very toxic stuff. Epoxy has no iso's either, but that makes me feel sicker if I get a wiff of it then urethanes.
Don't be kidding yourself thinking just because lacquer or other product doesn't contain isos or lead, they are really much safer to breath or handle without protecting yourself and having ventilation. Look for information on solvents that are in many of this stuff as well, such as lacquer thinner and benzene. Many are classified as carcinogenic (linked to cancer), or could cause organ or nervous system damage with enough exposure. Needless to say I am more carefull workin with any of this stuff now (still slip up and forget sometimes), will have a fresh respirator and ventilation, and wear gloves. For many years I wasn't very safe. So sad that even going through schooling, they didn't really stress the dangers to your health if your careless of the stuff your learning to work with, and seems many employers out there also have little regard for worker saftey also.
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  #128 (permalink)  
Old 11-20-2008, 11:40 PM
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In all honesty, the painting profession is most cases is a sure-fire way to destroy your quality of life as age catches up with you. The amount of chemicals a bodyman/painter is exposed to is horrendous. The fact that spraying primer out on the shop floor is common (at least around here), is evening worse. How much money are your lungs, brain, a motorskills worth?
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  #129 (permalink)  
Old 11-21-2008, 05:18 AM
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this threads proves only one point............ you cant fix stupid .
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  #130 (permalink)  
Old 02-05-2009, 05:29 AM
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I think you must go for an online help Car Repair. I have also experienced the same problem and then one of my friends suggested me this website.
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  #131 (permalink)  
Old 09-04-2009, 08:27 PM
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I noticed on another forum every one on there was giving this system poor poor ratings. I wanted to try it but am now confused any one actually use it? if so can you let me know what you think about the product. (for a complete paint job not a touch up)
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  #132 (permalink)  
Old 09-04-2009, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by chevy6869
I noticed on another forum every one on there was giving this system poor poor ratings.
There's a darn good reason for that !




Quote:
Originally Posted by chevy6869
I wanted to try it but am now confused any one actually use it? if so can you let me know what you think about the product. (for a complete paint job not a touch up)

Apparently you didn't take the time to read this entire thread, it's long but I suggest you do so. I see you are new here so stick around a while and will find there are some guys here that have many years in custom auto body/paint and there is an absolute wealth of info to be found in the tech article WIKI, check it out and I think you will find your answer.
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  #133 (permalink)  
Old 09-04-2009, 09:18 PM
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ok... this thread in a nutshell... todays lacquers are crap.. dupli color is more expensive than a cheap economy line acrylic enamel which will be more durable... $20 a quart for the dupli which is sprayable lacquer ( pre thinned ).. need approx 2 gallons of mixed ( sprayable ) paint to paint a car so, 8 quarts. that's nearly $200 for lacquer.... you can get acrylic enamel as cheap as $50 per gallon.. add $20 for reducer and $20 for hardner, your at $90 and will end up with 2 gallons of mixed paint.
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  #134 (permalink)  
Old 09-05-2009, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by matt167
ok... this thread in a nutshell... todays lacquers are crap.. dupli color is more expensive than a cheap economy line acrylic enamel which will be more durable... $20 a quart for the dupli which is sprayable lacquer ( pre thinned ).. need approx 2 gallons of mixed ( sprayable ) paint to paint a car so, 8 quarts. that's nearly $200 for lacquer.... you can get acrylic enamel as cheap as $50 per gallon.. add $20 for reducer and $20 for hardner, your at $90 and will end up with 2 gallons of mixed paint.


Actually two gallons of that thinned stuff will not go as far as two gallons of RTS AE, by the time you sand and buff (REQUIRED!) the Lacquer you are going to have a very thin coat of paint left if 8 qts is all you spray.
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  #135 (permalink)  
Old 09-05-2009, 04:17 PM
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yea, I know. but even figuring the same coverage it's still more money..

I just painted the lower valance and the grille valance on my Ranger.. because it was an OEM red color, the reducer, hardner and paint ran $110 for the quart ( Restoration shop AE ) ... but by the gallon was $165... only slightly more expensive than the lacquer.. Autocolorlibrary/ TCP Global also has the 144 colors, where it's $144 for everything including paper filters and a mixing cup

didn't cut/ buff or anything and it was sprayed with my cheap campbell hausfeld gravity feed gun.. everything else is factory paint, almost can't tell it's not factory
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