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Old 08-11-2007, 02:49 PM
Tyler
 
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E85 fuel 105 octane at the pump

Has anybody tried running E85 fuel in their hotrod. It's basically 85% moonshine and 15% gas. You would have to have a fuel pump, fuel lines, carburetor, etc. that is compatible with alcohol, however you could run fairly high compression. I havn't done the math, but I don't think it would be a problem to run 12 to1 compression with 105 octane. From what I've read you would have to have a carburetor set up for alcohol & you would have to play with the jetting to get the mixture right. The mixture would have to be a little less rich than pure alcohol, but much richer than if running pump gas. With racing fuel priced in my area at five to six dollars a gallon And E85 priced $2.24 at the pump right now, it looks like this could save drag racers a lot of money. jtyler

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Old 08-11-2007, 03:46 PM
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There are some E85 conversion jet kits out there, so conversion can be done reasonably easily, and should work well, as long as you're willing deal with a 25-30% loss in economy. With gasoline at $3, E85 at $2.25 doesn't pan out $$$ wise unless your after the higher octane.

HOWEVER........

E85 may or may not be exactly an 85/15 mix, it CAN BE up to 85% ethanol but it doesn't have to be. Because the current production "flexfuel" vehicles are capable of running on anything from straight 100% gasoline all the way to 85% ethanol/15% gasoline, the producers are free to vary the mixture as conditions dictate. If they are short on production they can do a 50-50 mix and nobody with a newer vehicle would be any the wiser, however someone with a carb will be in real trouble within a couple hundred feet after leaving the station.
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Old 08-11-2007, 07:34 PM
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Thank's for the info. Right now I don't even own a hotrod, just a couple of four wheel drive toy's. I had a 68 firebird from age 18 until about age 32. I built it to run on pump gas & it was fast. In my town, we have only 2 stations that sell E85 at the moment, but in the next 5 to 10 years I think there will be stations everywhere selling this stuff. Not only that, but the producers will be forced to produce more ethanol & the 105 octane rating will be more consistent. My car was very fast but it was built to run on 92 octane. If I could have built it to run on 105, I could have went from nine & one half compression to possibly as high as 13to 1 or better. Imagine the difference. My prediction is that this E85 will be a god-send for hotrodders within the next ten years. By the way. The only reason I don't have the car now is that I was laid off from my job & I have 4 kids. Life sucks at times, but I have to feed the family. I love going fast. As soon as the kids are a little older, I want another 68 firebird. I know the newer cars handle better, but I used to race that car top end for as much as 5 miles straight. I never got beat at a top end race. I have held that car sideways at 120,130,140, and once at 160 in curves and it was just an amazing car. Times have changed & theres more traffic on the roads than back then, even at 3:00 in the morning. It isn't safe to race like that any more. So guy's build fast cars & race them at the track. jtyler
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Old 08-11-2007, 07:55 PM
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E85 has an energy density that is about 30-40% less than that of gasoline. Which means reduced power output and increased fuel consumption. Sure it could probably tolerate more compression but you're gonna need it make up for the loss in power after the switch.
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Old 08-11-2007, 08:41 PM
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I've studied it extensively! There is more fuel comsumption, yes. The power loss is very minor & can be made up by increased timing. With alcohol it takes 30 up to 40% more fluid volume compared to gasoline to create almost the same ammount of power, but it burns cooler which means your can increase the timing. Take a look at some of the alcohol drag cars. pure alcohol runs about 116 octane & 116 gasoline probably produces a small percentage more power, however pump gas is 92 octane & probably overrated. E85 is 105 octane & I can guarantee you even if watered down with a little more than 15% gasoline will withstand high compression ratios & higher hp figures. If you are serious about it & want to know the facts email me at ho68butler@charter.net & I will give you the web sites & books where I did my research. It may take me a few day's to get back to you because I work a lot of hours. If I build another serious hotrod it will be either high compression or twin turbo with serious boost & ran on E85. So what if the same octane rating with gasoline yields a slight advantage, if I can get E85 at the local gas station for $3.00 less a gallon and make up for the difference in more timing and a cooler running engine my vote is to run E85. jtyler
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Old 08-11-2007, 09:29 PM
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Maybe in 20 years, E85 will be a win/win deal, but for now, it's a loosing deal money wise. As long is E85 is made from corn, as it is here in the U.S., the cost ratio of petro used per gallon of E85 produced is a loosing deal. It takes 1 gallon of gasoline to produce .87 gallons of E85. Not good business. There are other options in the works that will boost the return up to, so far as they have gone anyways, an 8 to 1 return using plain old Texas Saw Grass. But for now, everyone is following the misguided "green" leaders and selling all their corn to the E85 producers, which is, in turn, killing the food, dairy and beef market. I suppose when a hamburger is 5 bucks at MickyD's and a steak at Sizzler is 35 dollars, people might think twice about using corn based E85. While the intentions are good and need to be explored and developed, the current use of corn is going to be a real noose around the neck of the end users.

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Old 08-11-2007, 10:23 PM
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high octane and looks good on paper vs pure gasoline from an ecofreaks standpoint.
Shane
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