Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board

Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/)
-   Body - Exterior (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/body-exterior/)
-   -   Eastwood Extreme Chassis black (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/eastwood-extreme-chassis-black-231881.html)

Ed M. 04-15-2013 03:22 PM

Eastwood Extreme Chassis black
 
Has anyone possibly had this problem that I have. I had an rad support sandblasted, applied 2 coats of PPG epoxy primer, and then after about 2 hrs., applied the chassis black from Eastwood. Looked great. This was about 1 week ago. I started to get all my parts in order to start assembly, and I took the air hose and blew the dust off of the support, and off came the paint. The primer on the support was good, just the paint came off, big flakes. Bad adhesion between the two for some reason. Moisture was not a problem.I use a refrigerant drier and desiccant canister. This is probably the first time I've run into the problem, looking for answers..:confused:

69 widetrack 04-15-2013 03:39 PM

So, the paint came off the PPG Epoxy Primer, but the primer stayed on the Rad Support. That tells me that the Epoxy Primer wasn't flashed enough, 2 hours is a guideline. Flash times are dependent on temperature, air flow and volume (the amount of primer you put on). If it was cool, the solvents where still in the Primer, when you painted over top...the paint cured before the solvents where out of the epoxy...when they tried to release themselves, they took the paint with them. Lack of air movement will not allow the solvents to release, to much air movement will cause the primer to cure on top and not all the way through...causing the paint to come off when the solvents finally do release. Same with volume of paint. The more primer you put on, the longer your going to need to wait for it to flash and top coat.

Anyway you look at it, 90% of peeling paint is caused by trapped solvent, 9% is cause by poor mechanical adhesion (sanding), but the primer stayed on the rad support, so mechanical adhesion isn't the issue. The other 1%...it was your turn...sometimes it just happens but even then, it's probably something that happened in the painting process.

Ray

Ed M. 04-15-2013 04:15 PM

I guess I'll try it again, then go have a few beers while the epoxy dries longer, or bake it Thanks.

69 widetrack 04-15-2013 04:23 PM

No need to bake it, it's PPG's DP line correct, as crappy as that stuff is to sand, you could sand it with say 400 wet, let it sit over night and re paint it (let it sit to make sure that more solvents escape from opening up the Epoxy when you sanded it). If your going to apply more Epoxy, just let it sit longer before you topcoat it...If I'm right you have a 72 hour window before it needs to be scuffed, just make sure that it's flashed properly and hit it with your chassis Black.

Ray

Ed M. 04-15-2013 05:33 PM

I just applied another coat of epoxy primer after I sanded it with 320 and a red scuff pad. This time I also added 2 new inner fenderwells also that I primed.I think I'll use the advise a leave them sit overnite before painting again. This is the first time that I'm using this Eastwood paint, probably different properties that the PPG that I've use for the last 25 years. Always something to learn. Thanks for the input.. Ed

69 widetrack 04-15-2013 05:41 PM

Good idea Ed, you've got lots of window room for topcoating, get those solvents out and put the Eastwood Black over top. 25 years of experience, I know what you mean, I have over 30 and every once in a while I get the teeth marks in my backside.

I'm sure you'll be fine.

Good luck Ed.

Ray

killeratrod 04-15-2013 06:37 PM

i just look up this at eastwood

About Chassis Black Paint Satin Quart


Chassis Black Satin applies smoothly over bare metal, Eastwood Rust Encapsulator, or Eastwood Chassis Black Primer. (Not for use over self-etching primers.) Quart can has 40-sq.-ft. coverage. (Also available in 14-oz. aerosol to cover up to 8 sq. ft.; see 10025Z Chassis Black.) Withstands temperatures up to 300 degreesF. 30-day Eastwood warranty.

69 widetrack 04-15-2013 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by killeratrod (Post 1666920)
i just look up this at eastwood

About Chassis Black Paint Satin Quart


Chassis Black Satin applies smoothly over bare metal, Eastwood Rust Encapsulator, or Eastwood Chassis Black Primer. (Not for use over self-etching primers.) Quart can has 40-sq.-ft. coverage. (Also available in 14-oz. aerosol to cover up to 8 sq. ft.; see 10025Z Chassis Black.) Withstands temperatures up to 300 degreesF. 30-day Eastwood warranty.

Thanks "killeratrod"...there you go Ed, there's that 1% that I was talking about...it's to go over bare metal, not Epoxy Primer.

Maybe just paint the rad support black tomorrow and use the Eastwood product over bare metal.

Thanks again Killeratrod....makes sense now.

Ray

Ed M. 04-16-2013 04:28 AM

well since I already applied the epoxy primer last night, I'll take a chance and scuff the items good,spray a thin sealer coat of NCP 271 primer to cover the epoxy, then go with the chassis black. Maybe this will work.Don't know.

Just read in Eastwoods catalog that the "ultimate finish is easily achieved when you apply Eastwood's Epoxy Primer under the Ceramic Chassis Black", but there is no statement of any kind about the Extreme Chassis Black and epoxy primers. They reference Epoxy Primer for their 2K Chassis black, but nothing for their Original or Extreme black's. My error in not reading closer.

69 widetrack 04-16-2013 07:51 AM

Mine too, if i'm not familiar with a product I usually check it out before I offer advice, but, Anything should stick to Epoxy if it's flashed properly right...wrong...my bad as well for not following through. Why not just put a regular catalyzed black on, that way you know it's going to stick.

Ray

Ed M. 04-16-2013 08:42 AM

As they say, if all else fails, read the instructions. But as luck has it, a Eastwood rep just call me back and said that epoxy primer is acceptable base for their chassis black paints. Just have to leave enough dry time for the solvents to flask out of the primer, 2 or 3 days if possible , then scuff and primer. Well, I left about 10 hrs. from the time I applied the primer to the paint time. See what happens in a few days. Will update .
I wanted to use something that was more resistant to under the hood chemicals, fluids. Ed

69 widetrack 04-16-2013 08:46 AM

So, he's basically telling you exactly what I told you in one of my previous posts. Well, let it set up, I don't understand why you would need to scuff Epoxy but give it a try...and let us know what happens.

Best of Luck Ed

Ray

Lizer 04-16-2013 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 69 widetrack (Post 1666952)
Thanks "killeratrod"...there you go Ed, there's that 1% that I was talking about...it's to go over bare metal, not Epoxy Primer.

Maybe just paint the rad support black tomorrow and use the Eastwood product over bare metal.

Thanks again Killeratrod....makes sense now.

Ray

I don't see where it says no epoxy...only no self-etching primers. And Epoxy is not a self etching primer just because it can go on bare metal.

Ed M. 04-17-2013 05:29 AM

Sprayed the items yesterday. came out nice ,a little more shine than the 85 percent that I was expecting from what I wanted. In a couple of days I'll give it the air blow test, see what happens. Thanks for all the input that everyone had given me on this. There's something new learned everyday in painting.

sunsetdart 04-17-2013 06:43 AM

I have used the Eastwood Chassis Black Satin on the whole underneath my car. I also use to spray all the components on my chassis and other parts like brackets.
About etching primer............my understanding is that is to be used over bare metal only. That way it can "etch" the metal for a topcoat.
I have found that if you "etch" any bare metal with a good sanding and apply a coat of good primer you are good to go.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:57 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.