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Old 08-18-2010, 05:26 PM
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ebay rotating assembly?

PC 5.7 full floating bushed rods.5140 ALLOY, 580 GRAM WEIGHT WITH CAP SCREWS, BRONZE BUSHINGS IN THE SMALL END.
Probe low expansion fully forged -12cc dish top pistons, 30 over,
Hastings molly rings, King bearings,
ProStreet damper 8.00" with new mounting hardware,
SFI 168 tooth flexplate,
SCAT 9000 Series crankshaft 3.75 stroke
PISTON WT, 507G WRIST PIN WT, 117G,

comes balanced.

all for 795.00

gonna go ahead and get the RHS pro torker vortec heads. intake mani with 1500-6500 range. 750 carb. hooker 1 5/8 headers. comps XR276HR cam.
1900-5600 rpm range. 502 lift.

does this look like a good deal to you guys as well? with this package does anyone have some ball park hp/ torque numbers?

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Old 08-18-2010, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeAhrado
PC 5.7 full floating bushed rods.5140 ALLOY, 580 GRAM WEIGHT WITH CAP SCREWS, BRONZE BUSHINGS IN THE SMALL END.
Probe low expansion fully forged -12cc dish top pistons, 30 over,
Hastings molly rings, King bearings,
ProStreet damper 8.00" with new mounting hardware,
SFI 168 tooth flexplate,
SCAT 9000 Series crankshaft 3.75 stroke
PISTON WT, 507G WRIST PIN WT, 117G,

comes balanced.

all for 795.00

gonna go ahead and get the RHS pro torker vortec heads. intake mani with 1500-6500 range. 750 carb. hooker 1 5/8 headers. comps XR276HR cam.
1900-5600 rpm range. 502 lift.

does this look like a good deal to you guys as well? with this package does anyone have some ball park hp/ torque numbers?
I'd say the "GOOD" in deal hangs with the rods. 5140 is good material but it's the quality of the forging that makes the difference. This is a process that tends to encourage carbon that is in solution with the iron part of the steel to want to come out of solution and coagulate forming slag inclusions. These tend along the grain boundaries which forms a weak spot. The 2 important things here are: 1) temperature of the parent material and forging dies when the rod form is struck. Incorrect temps or large differences between material and tool encourage these slag formations. 2) The second is inspection processes. Big buck rods are carefully inspected and the problem children weeded out, Your no-name, probably made in China rods could be a screaming deal or a time bomb. Time will tell.

We're not even up to the rod bolt quality yet. And then a cast shaft all topped with high buck heads, intake and carb. Of everything in this engine the parts most likely to explode are the cheap ones. See a trend?

This is an easy low to mid 400 horse and torque motor, the root question is whether the screaming deal in the block can stay together. I just don't know! The quality of this stuff is all over the place, getting better as we move in time, but just crazy. Add to that, a lot of these shops selling at great prices are just disposing of parts of dubious or unknown quality and they know it.

Bogie
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Old 08-19-2010, 01:29 PM
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indeed, smashing parts on the street isent worth the 300 saved. ill look into more kits... im looking for a slight budget based rotating assembly for either a 383 or just a 350 depending on price. i want it to be reliable. i figure the trucks normal operating range will be 2000-6500 rpms.
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Old 08-19-2010, 01:31 PM
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does anyone else have any opinions about this package? ever heard of PC rods?
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Old 08-19-2010, 03:25 PM
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Most likely ProComp rods, many put PC for a disguise.
These sound like the Low buck Eagle SIR rods which even look crappy, both are China imports. http://www.cnc-motorsports.com/produ...179&CtgID=3180

Many have used the 4340 H-Beam ProComps without a problem.
http://www.cnc-motorsports.com/produ...087&CtgID=8077 look identical to these.

Last edited by SSedan64; 08-19-2010 at 03:26 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 08-19-2010, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeAhrado
does anyone else have any opinions about this package? ever heard of PC rods?
Sounds like a great deal. You know what they say though, you get what you pay for. How much power do you plan on producing?

Eagle and Scat has kits that are within the $800 range too and you know their stuff is good. The pistons wont be forged at that price though.
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Old 08-19-2010, 04:00 PM
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800$ stroker kit? im shooting for 450 at the crank. and as much torque as motorly possible. i want forged pistons for sure, i can probolly get away with a cast steel crank. im still debating stroker or not. i want something reliable, something i dont worry about when i get on it. but i dont want to get my doors blown by some rustang
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Old 08-19-2010, 04:30 PM
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Seller is Skip White, correct?? Whiteperformance1 on Ebay. I have dealt with him before, all parts were as he claimed them to be, no problems. White's Performance has been around for a long time in Tennessee, i asked a friend who was local to that area if there were any grumblings about them, he said no.

Of the kit he offers, only the PC rods are the unknown quantity, everything else is quality stuff. Crank is Scat, alot better than Eagle in my opinion, and it shows just looking at one, and they always measure out well, a fact that Eagle can't claim. Pistons are Probe, a very good piston. Hastings rings are good, and I prefer the King bearings to Clevite, nicer finish and better tolerances from what I have checked. I can't comment on the balancer, but it does appear to be a better than average piece.

On the rods, the ProComp stuff gets a lot of bashing just for the China connection, but most people don't realize that Scat, Eagle, and Callies Compstar are all Chinese too. Some are entirely chinese made(Eagle), some are finish machined here(Scat) on chinese forgings or castings, and I'm not sure where Callies Compstar line is finished but it is held in high regard so far.

I've got 2 sets of those ProComp rods in motors at the moment, one 383 and one 388 both turned to 7200rpm street/strip engines, 500-530hp. They have been together 6 or so months, so I can't say yet as to the long term durability, but I will say this, they were better finished and better looking than the Eagle SIR rods a lot of other people use, actually hard to tell them apart from the Scat rod just on looks.

I'm looking to do a 383 for my 4x4, and the White kit is right at the top of my list, if work would just pick up around here I would pull the trigger in the deal.
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Old 08-19-2010, 07:02 PM
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The 5140 alloy the PC rods are made of apparently isn't as strong as the 4340 alloy Scat rods are made of. Skip White has good prices on the Scat cranks and Probe pistons, I would just add some Scat rods and go from there. I was researching that same rotating assembly.
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Old 08-19-2010, 08:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinister
The 5140 alloy the PC rods are made of apparently isn't as strong as the 4340 alloy Scat rods are made of.
They wouldn't be, 4340 in the normalized state has a 185,000 lb/in. tensile strength compared with 115,000 lb/in. of 5140, plus 4340 has almost double the yield strength (125,000 VS. 68,500 lb/in.)

Still dont think I'd buy their stuff tho hahaha!
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Old 08-19-2010, 10:25 PM
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hm, im going to look into scat kits.. my next question is external balancing compared to internal. im noticing not all kits offer internal balancing. is there a big difference reliability wise?
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Old 08-19-2010, 10:30 PM
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yeah, skip white was it. i like the kit just doesent specify if arp bolts.. and the pc rods.. gotta pay for reliability though.
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Old 08-19-2010, 10:58 PM
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what does everyone know about cnc motorsports "budget performance" kits?
heres the one im looking at.

Kit Details (689.99) + 50$ shipping.

•New Eagle Cast Steel Crankshaft, 1 piece rear main seal (1987-99)
•New Eagle 5140 Steel I beam connecting rods , Rods are bushed
•Speed Pro hypereutectic pistons, 4.030 bore only
•Clevite 77 Performance rod and main bearing set
•Perfect circle moly face piston rings
•Rotating assembly is fully balanced Internal
Stroke rod Bore Size Dish/Dome CR w/64cc CR w/76cc
3.750 5.700 .030 -12cc Dish 9.9 8.8

Would this kit hold up? rhs pro torker vortecs 64cc, 750 carb, a comp roller cam with .502 lift (extreme energy). th 350 trans with 2000-2500 stall. intake mani with 1500-6500 operating range. not sure on gears yet. headers.
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Old 08-19-2010, 11:08 PM
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I'd much rather have the kit White sells, Eagle cast crank is poor, lots of reports with problems with them on all kinds of engine forums, a lot of respected builders won't even let Eagle parts in their building. Scat is head and shoulders above.

The Eagle rods are 5140 also, so no gain there, and hyper pistons...Uhhgg!

Unless you are looking to spend a lot of time(like circle track use) above 7000 rpm, internal or external balance is a non-issue, no need for the extra cost of internal balancing.

It will probably survive what you want it to do, but I greatly prefer forged pistons, get only a second of detonation with hypers and you have an oil pan full of junk.

the Eagle parts make this a loser to me, not worth the $100 savings. Internal balance means nothing at this performance level.
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Old 08-19-2010, 11:30 PM
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that is exactly the type of answer i needed. much appreciated for all the help, i can tear a motor down, replace cams, adjust carbs and all the other misc stuff. but as far as picking the right parts for the right things not so much. this is my first build and am all kinds of excited. Nice to have the help from people that have done this before!

so long as theres no bad rep. on whites shop (ive looked and found nothing, still havent checked the b b b). this looks like the kit to get, i dont plan on going over 500 hp, using forced induction, or nitrous. the motor will never see 7000 or even 6500. it will be drivin on the street daily. is 10.5:1 unacceptable for premium?
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