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Chevyman87 12-10-2012 08:08 AM

EGR question
 
I'm reading a thread on another site and someone asks if it's ok to take off the EGR valve and solenoid. He gets mixed answers some people tell him to go ahead and do it and others tell him not to. I want to know,what do y'all think? if I'm running headers, and eliminated the A.I.R.pump, is it worth even having the EGR system?

joe_padavano 12-10-2012 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chevyman87 (Post 1621195)
I'm reading a thread on another site and someone asks if it's ok to take off the EGR valve and solenoid. He gets mixed answers some people tell him to go ahead and do it and others tell him not to. I want to know,what do y'all think? if I'm running headers, and eliminated the A.I.R.pump, is it worth even having the EGR system?

The answer is, it depends. You didn't indicate year or manufacturer of the engine, but for GMs the EGR draws from the exhaust crossover under the carb or throttle body, so headers won't affect operation one way or the other. If this is an ECM-driven engine, and you have all the original sensors in place, then the EGR only operates at part throttle, so you won't feel any difference in performance. What you MIGHT notice is that there is pinging at part throttle with the EGR inoperative. The stock carb or TBI fuel map is designed to take advantage of the EGR flow at part throttle, so the mixture is on the lean side and timing is advanced. Disabling the EGR without richening part-throttle fuel flow and/or altering part throttle timing to match may cause pinging.

malc 12-10-2012 10:26 AM

Donīt the laws where you live dictate if you can disable emission controls in part or total ?

123pugsy 12-10-2012 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malc (Post 1621238)
Donīt the laws where you live dictate if you can disable emission controls in part or total ?

Some States don't have the laws.....yet.

If they do this is still always a choice by the driver if he wants to risk the fines or not.

Here, its 360 bucks a pop for removing emissions equipment. There are no yearly inspections but the environmental guys patrol on the streets.

I run the EGR on my 76 pickup and its no problem. If it helps the engine from detonating, I'm all for it. Of coarse running a TPI hides it nicely.

So that brings up something else. Is it an eye sore for your hot rod? I will be remote mounting one on my 41 Chrysler. Our law dictates that any emissions equipment that came with a donor motor must still be attached (or an equal substitute) to it.

timothale 12-10-2012 11:14 AM

egr
 
I have heard of some GM engines having burned valves when the egr was removed.

gearheadslife 12-10-2012 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malc (Post 1621238)
Donīt the laws where you live dictate if you can disable emission controls in part or total ?

yes all 50 states it's fed crime.. 2500.oo fine + jail time per item removed
and with the country broke.. this that they never really enforced on older cars, they will.. even if the state doesn't require emmission testing.. they can fine you for removing or disabling the emmission control parts..
and it'll be fine/tow and storage fees.. and revoke of tags.. as removal makes the car illegal on public roads..
between the country/states being broke/the epa/ and the greenies/ and obama wanting "clunkers" crushed.. this is coming ..
people think because they don't test anymore that ,they are home free.. they're in for a shock..

oldbogie 12-10-2012 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chevyman87 (Post 1621195)
I'm reading a thread on another site and someone asks if it's ok to take off the EGR valve and solenoid. He gets mixed answers some people tell him to go ahead and do it and others tell him not to. I want to know,what do y'all think? if I'm running headers, and eliminated the A.I.R.pump, is it worth even having the EGR system?

Eliminating the AIR and EGR are more feel good activities than anything related to power gains.

All the AIR does is pump fresh air into the exhaust manifold/headers where it supplies enough air to finish the burn of fuel that didn't combust in the engine and supplies oxygen to complete the burn of carbon monoxide (a poison) to carbon dioxide. All this happens using the high temps of the exhaust to complete these reactions. Aside from some miniscule power loss running the pump from a belt and what ever aero dynamic interference the plumbing makes with the exhaust flow it does nothing to detract from engine power.

EGR is a little more complicated and its removal can burn valves and detonate but you can compensate for this when you understand what it's doing. The EGR does not operate at idle nor at high power settings. It having an effect on idle and/or WOT would only be through a failure to operate properly. It does operate at part throttle (i.e. cruise) by adding burnt exhaust back into the intake which occupies space otherwise filled with air/fuel mixture. So, yes, it would reduce power at cruise for a given throttle and timing setting by lowering the combustion temperature in the cylinder. When it is removed there is space inside the manifold of a carbureted or injected engine for more air to reach the cylinders. More air requires richening the mixture which for an emissions compliant engine whether carb or injected will not happen without an intervention to richen the mixture be that jet size increase for a carb or reprogramming the fuel map on EFI systems. If this isn't done; the mixture will be lean at cruise and burnt valves along with detonation issues are possible outcomes from this condition.

It should go without saying by this point that removal of emissions equipment is a violation of national law nearly everyplace on the planet. In the U.S. enforcement is given to the states which varies widely state to state and locale to locale within some states. Think ahead in-case your job moves you, I have a friend that moved from Texas to Maryland becuase of a job transfer, restoring his highly modified Mustang to as built emissions compliant in equipment and output proved to be a big time expensive.

Bogie

lakeroadster 12-10-2012 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gearheadslife (Post 1621250)
yes all 50 states it's fed crime..

Not true....:mwink: There's always an exception:

New 2012 Emission Inspection Law

As of March 1, 2012 emission inspections (I/M) are no longer required in Alaska. This applies to both Anchorage and Fairbanks North Star Borough, the two areas in the state that previously required emission inspections for vehicle registration.

Alaska Smog Checks - Emissions Regulations, AK Smog Testing Stations at DMV.org: The DMV Made Simple

Chevyman87 12-11-2012 12:56 AM

Thanks to all
 
So many great answers.. 350 SBC is what I'm running the laws here in GA don't require vehicles over 25 years old to pass emissions. I've got an '88 c1500.

I conferred with a friend on the deleting of the EGR valve and have decided not to do that. Only reason I wanted to do that was because I installed a TH350 transmission and I had to tap into a vacuum source for the modulator valve. The way I have it ran now i took a "y" and splice the line going from the back of the TBI to the EGR solenoid I was looking to delete that Y and just run the line from there to the transmission therefore bypassing the EGR solenoid.


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