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Old 07-03-2008, 01:32 PM
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EGR valve removel

Just picked up an exceptionally clean 1987 Mustang GT with only 47000+ original miles on it. The car is completely unmodified except that the smog pump has been removed along with the associated plumbing and the air ports in the back of the heads have been plugged, but everything else is stock. When I checked it out I find the EGR valve is stuck solid and in pretty bad shape and since it is partially open I have to deal with it immediately. I am thinking of buying one of those EGR eliminators off E-bay, just using it to trick the computer and then removing/blocking off the EGR. What can I expect if I do this? I have heard both good and bad about removing the EGR but I always just repaired them when they were bad and so I really have little or no experience with completely removing them. what do you guys think remove it or repair it?

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Old 07-03-2008, 03:38 PM
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Well....the hot gases as I understand are supposed to burn some of the carbon build up out of the cylinders.

I think the worst thing that might happen is that it gets a small ping from carbon buildup and you need to run some water thru it to clean it out.

Older motors never had them.......so why are they there now?

The chevette had a stock EGR on it.....when I removed most of the smog stuff and replaced the computer controlled carb, I simply unhooked the vac line from the EGR. I have yet to have any trouble with it. (had no trouble even with the computer controlled carb)


So I say go for it....whats it going to run ya? 20 bucks? why not?

EDIT: Just a thought that might help.....I'v cleaned EGRs with 2-3 good licks to the bottom with a hammer.

Got em moving again anyhow (closed)
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Old 07-03-2008, 09:50 PM
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Just pull the EGR spacer completely off and install bolts to hold the throttle body to the manifold. Look carefully, the stock throttle body is about 1/16 inch larger all around than the hole in the manifold so it needs a little trimming to get smooth airflow. A quick little die grinder work with a shop vac running, and you are all set.

With the wires disconnected, the computer will show a non operative EGR and throw a code. In operation all it does is remove some timing at the times that the EGR is suppose to be operating. When the EGR operates in cruising mode, the computer adds timing to increase gas mileage and burn the gasses. Just splice the water hoses together, or block them off at the heater tube. Whichever is convenient. No noticable difference in operation.

All you will notice is NOTHING, or maybe a loss of 1/2 mpg on the highway.
Most everybody I know has blocked them off. My 90 in the rod is completely removed as I explained, for 15 years now.

Note, if your EGR is operational, do NOT disconnect the water tubes to it. They are there to cool the hot EGR plate. I have seen lots of guys who disconnected the coolant hoses because they thought that the water makes the plate hotter. It does, but it also cools the plate when the hot exhaust goes in the EGR.

Been messin with fuelie 5.0s for ...... 20 years now. Put several in resto-mod cars and street rods.

Last edited by ScoTFrenzel; 07-03-2008 at 09:56 PM.
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Old 07-03-2008, 10:19 PM
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The eliminator is not necessary then? I was under the impression, but then I don't know so that is why I am asking, that the eliminator was needed to keep the computer controlling the timing properly to prevent spark knock.
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Old 07-04-2008, 08:52 AM
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It may throw a CEL but the motor shouldn't go into a open loop mode.

I'm no Ford guy and I don't have an intimate knowledge of the 5.0 but I would add a fabed block off plate then remount the EGR (off the manifold) and plug it back up.

This should trick the computer to think that the EGR is still operable. And should take care of any spark knock that may occur.

Just an idea.....might not be the best one but I tend to use whats on hand to fix what I can
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Old 07-04-2008, 01:30 PM
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The only thing that I can say is that I have been around the 5.0 world for 20 years and lots of guys have the EGR eliminated, as I explained.
The big 5.0 club in the city taught me quite a few things. Those 150 cars have done it all.
Like Holder350 says, I have seen some, who have an operable EGR valve still plugged in to trick the computer light, but the valve does nothing as far as passing exhaust. My understanding is that set up can cause ping. Spark advance with no EGR flow into the intake to reduce combustion temperature.

My understanding is that eliminating the EGR completely (throws a code) prevents the added spark advance during EGR open cruise mode which only reduces gas mileage minimally. Ford says the combination of EGR and additional spark adds gas mileage during cruise. Nobody really notices any mileage change.

Several of us have the throttle body bolted to the manifold and have never had any knock on 87 octane. Of course the stock GT 5.0 HO is only an actual 8.8 compression and we usually run 16* idle timing instead of 10*. My car is 90 mass air but the speed density boys have the same set up.

I'm not sure, but you might be able to take your existing EGR plate and plug the passage inside to stop the exhaust flow, and then reinstall the thing. OR plug the exhaust source at the other end.

*************
added
I think 10+ yr ago Ford Motorsports had a full SR chassis touring the big shows which used to sell a harness set up for street rods getting the 5.0 fuelie, and I think they explained the EGR thing, since SRs don't run smog stuff, EGR was an option.
I did my first fuelie hot rod in 92, I think, and everybody said it was "impossible". It is still running every week, 53,000 miles later.

Last edited by ScoTFrenzel; 07-04-2008 at 01:41 PM.
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Old 07-05-2008, 11:38 AM
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EGR valve

I know this is a dissenting opinion, but I would fix it, not remove it.

Contrary to popular belief, having an operating EGR makes the engine run cooler, not hotter, and allows more ignition advance. You will get better millage, more power at part throttle, and produce lower emissions with an operating EGR.

The only time the EGR has no effect is wide open throttle, other than that it is a good thing to have.
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Old 07-07-2008, 01:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBill
I know this is a dissenting opinion, but I would fix it, not remove it.

Contrary to popular belief, having an operating EGR makes the engine run cooler, not hotter, and allows more ignition advance. You will get better millage, more power at part throttle, and produce lower emissions with an operating EGR.

The only time the EGR has no effect is wide open throttle, other than that it is a good thing to have.

I'll second that opinion!

But if you want to block it off just run a pipe tap into the hole leading to the exhaust manifold port and put a pipe plug in. Run the engine with the valve removed to blow out the shavings from the port or coat the pipe tap with grease to trap them.

If you want to prevent the CEL from coming on put the EGR valve back on so it operates correctly but just doesn't pass exhaust gases because of the blocked port. Seeing as yours is shot this means a new EGR valve anyway.

Yes it will ping, and it will get slightly worse gas mileage...

Personally I like a CEL that stays in the off position.
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Old 07-08-2008, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4 Jaw Chuck
I'll second that opinion!

But if you want to block it off just run a pipe tap into the hole leading to the exhaust manifold port and put a pipe plug in. Run the engine with the valve removed to blow out the shavings from the port or coat the pipe tap with grease to trap them.

If you want to prevent the CEL from coming on put the EGR valve back on so it operates correctly but just doesn't pass exhaust gases because of the blocked port. Seeing as yours is shot this means a new EGR valve anyway.

Yes it will ping, and it will get slightly worse gas mileage...

Personally I like a CEL that stays in the off position.
Trust me, you don't want that extra 20* of timing without the EGR actually injecting exhaust gas into the chambers...... unless you don't mind ruined pistons from detonation.

Either make it operate as the factory intended,
or eliminate it completely and prevent the computer from adding the EGR timing. You won't even notice the gas mileage difference in the real world.
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