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Old 02-04-2010, 07:10 PM
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engine is hard to tune over by hand

ok i took my 350 out of my truck, took it to a machine shop had it cleaned up and the cylenders are bored .060 over. i bought a rotating assembly from eagle. its a stroker kit, new crank, pistons, rods, rings, barings etc. i did properly gap my rings. i used plenty on assembly lube, in the cylenders and on all barings. why is it so hard to turn my engine over? all the rod bolts and main caps are torqued to spec. but i cant turn it over by myself. i need a buddy to hold the stand while i use a 3 ft. pipe! i have never experianced this before please help!
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Old 02-04-2010, 07:40 PM
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First, when you put the crank in it and set the thrust/end play and torqued down the bolts, did the crank turn freely- before putting the pistons and rods on the crank?

Then, as you assembled each rod and piston to the crank, were you still checking to see that the crank would turn w/o binding?

This should be done w/each rod assembly to see that everything stays free.

I'm guessing the valve train hasn't been installed yet, so the cause of being too hard to turn over could be (very roughly in order of likelihood): oil ring(s) that have the expander ends overlapped, a coarse hone, swapped rod caps, swapped main caps, insufficient rod side play, wrong size or application bearings (rod or main), bent rod, out of spec rod big end- to name a few.
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Old 02-04-2010, 07:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobalt327
First, when you put the crank in it and set the thrust/end play and torqued down the bolts, did the crank turn freely- before putting the pistons and rods on the crank?

Then, as you assembled each rod and piston to the crank, were you still checking to see that the crank would turn w/o binding?

This should be done w/each rod assembly to see that everything stays free.

I'm guessing the valve train hasn't been installed yet, so the cause of being too hard to turn over could be (very roughly in order of likelihood): oil ring(s) that have the expander ends overlapped, a coarse hone, swapped rod caps, swapped main caps, insufficient rod side play, wrong size or application bearings (rod or main), bent rod, out of spec rod big end- to name a few.
Good practice to do and can save a headache.
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Old 02-05-2010, 07:34 AM
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the crank moves freely untill i torque the main bolts down. but still moves, once i torque the rod bolts down its stuck. i can move it but its way to rough. the crank, rods, rings, pistons, everything, are brand new, so i like to rule out bent rods or crank etc. i used the barings that came with the crank so they cant be oversized? i didnt check the baring clearance because everything is new and came in a kit, could this be my problem or is there a more logical explination. i'm pretty sure i kept the main caps in order, but if i diddnt, they have an arrow that points to the front so i know they are all facing the right way? everything went together nice, it moves fine until i torque the bolts down. i thought it was just a course hone, but it seems like is should move a little better than it does. once i do get it rotating its not as bad, until i stop and try again, then it so hard again.
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Old 02-05-2010, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfe
the crank moves freely untill i torque the main bolts down. but still moves, once i torque the rod bolts down its stuck. i can move it but its way to rough. the crank, rods, rings, pistons, everything, are brand new, so i like to rule out bent rods or crank etc. i used the barings that came with the crank so they cant be oversized? i didnt check the baring clearance because everything is new and came in a kit, could this be my problem or is there a more logical explination. i'm pretty sure i kept the main caps in order, but if i diddnt, they have an arrow that points to the front so i know they are all facing the right way? everything went together nice, it moves fine until i torque the bolts down. i thought it was just a course hone, but it seems like is should move a little better than it does. once i do get it rotating its not as bad, until i stop and try again, then it so hard again.
It's tricky to tell what is "too hard" and what is "normally hard", if you follow me.

First, check your cylinders for any grooves that look abnormal that could be caused by the oil expander being overlapped. The lines will be parallel to each other, could be several lines or just one, closely spaced together and will be more pronounced than the over all 'scuffing' that new rings on a freshly honed cylinder make.

If that looks good, start with getting some plastigage and see what the oil clearances are.

Start w/the crank. Take one cap off, wipe the bearing and crank surfaces down until oil free, then use the plastigage on that cap.

When you're done w/each cap, clean the plastigage off (acetone or lacquer thinner on lint free toweling works well) and relube the crank and bearing and retorque the cap. Then do the next one, etc. Don't forget to set and check the thrust bearing clearance.

When you get to the rods- before you remove any caps, check the side clearance w/a feeler gage between the rod caps and again at the rod beam.

If that is in spec, start plastigaging the rod caps- use the same procedure as the crank.

This needs to be done regardless of the parts being new- it's cheap insurance.
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Old 02-05-2010, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
i didnt check the baring clearance because everything is new and came in a kit, could this be my problem or is there a more logical explination.
Ayuh,... The fact that you checked,+ meassured Nothing is as logical explanation as there is....
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Old 02-05-2010, 08:03 PM
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problem solved. i checked the main caps and they were marked from a previous build, and i had two of them mixed up, i switched them and torqued them down and every things moves so much better. i never thought that would make a differance, they are all the same caps right? i guess over time they each wear and form to the block. who would of thunk it.
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Old 02-05-2010, 08:32 PM
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The caps don't wear they are align bored to the block and are not interchangeable with one another, they will only work on the journal they were align bored on. When a crank is installed and caps torqued you should be able to spin it by hand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfe
problem solved. i checked the main caps and they were marked from a previous build, and i had two of them mixed up, i switched them and torqued them down and every things moves so much better. i never thought that would make a differance, they are all the same caps right? i guess over time they each wear and form to the block. who would of thunk it.
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Old 02-06-2010, 08:12 AM
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that makes sence. thanks for the help guys. this has been very helpful.
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Old 02-06-2010, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfe
problem solved. i checked the main caps and they were marked from a previous build, and i had two of them mixed up, i switched them and torqued them down and every things moves so much better. i never thought that would make a differance, they are all the same caps right? i guess over time they each wear and form to the block. who would of thunk it.
I hope you didn't mix up the rod caps also!!! Are you sure you aren't in over your head? Not mixing rod and main caps is basic beginner information. Also, confirming clearances in the bearings is critical.
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Old 02-10-2010, 03:50 PM
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no the rod bolts are numbered so i know i have them right. and i checked all my clearances they are good to. but your right. i am way over my head. how dare i tackle a project as in-depth as this. i should know everything way before i take a job like this. then i wouldn't need to ask questions on a forum. what would i do without you to tell me i don't know what i'm doing?

as for the rest of you thank you so much for the help and advice. the engine is in and running. i had no other major issues.
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Old 02-10-2010, 05:10 PM
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You still talk like you lack the basic knowledge that someone should have before attempting such a task. You got it running, good for you and I hope it is for the long term. As you progress through the expensive school of hard knocks you will learn to:
1. Properly mark and reinstall rod and main caps.
2. Check clearances on reassembly.
There are various publications available that walk you through the rebuilding/assembly process that will provide valuable assistance on your future projects. I guarantee that you will save lots of money also because you won't be tearing the engine down again right away to fix a mistake.
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Old 02-10-2010, 05:10 PM
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Something to keep in mind when assembling a stroker engine, some cranks have a generous curve (chamfered) shoulder on outside, requiring chamfered or narrow "H" bearings. Some simply scrape an angle on the bearing edges. Otherwise they can bind when torqued.
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Old 02-11-2010, 11:42 AM
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this is all good informaition. i've learned a lot. thanks for all the advice. i took the fact that every thing was new for granted, and i didn't check my clearances. thats a mistake i wont make again.
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Old 02-11-2010, 06:02 PM
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Engine is hard to turn over by hand

Don't let em get you down.

Last edited by 32Essex; 02-11-2010 at 06:04 PM. Reason: wrong place
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