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Old 03-14-2006, 06:19 PM
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epoxy sealer over these spots?

after sanding the turbo primer should i seal the few spots where i burnt through to the base color? i am using Barry's (spi) products, with a dark blue bc and the factory color was red. if i have to use a sealer can i do reduced epoxy and not have to wet sand before the actual base coat? (i am afraid i will get a lot of orange peal)

also how much clear do you think i will need for a 91 Toyota celica. i have 2 quarts of universal clear w/ 2 quarts reducer/activator which equals one sprayable gallon, is this enough? not really sure if i'm going to wet sand and buff yet, so i guess i will pretend i'm going to so include that as well




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Old 03-14-2006, 06:46 PM
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I haven't gotten the opportunity to use spi products, but I'll give my two cents based on other brands I've used. Most epoxys are okay to reduce and use as a sealer just before paint without sanding. As long as your featheredge is good where you broke through you should be fine, but have seen cases where even after sealing, there will be a ring where the featheredge is. Just by the look of some of the featheredges some of them worry me. Of course I can't feel, but you can sort of tell by looking at what the feathered area looks like too. The ones I am talking are middle of door, and the hood. That amount of clear may be cutting it close, but It may be enough if you aren't wasting a lot in overspray. I did the outside of an old mustang and was using just a bit over a quart a coat doing the outside, but always feel safer having more then enough material then risk running out, and have plenty of clear on for wetsanding and buffing. I normally by a gallon for a normal outside of a car, and use about 3 quarts of it, but thats with 4:1 clear and a conventional gun. You really don't want to run out of clear where you want you coats to be going on without a real long time in between coats or to run out in the middle of spraying when you are trying to get all the clear blended in with one another, without any dry edges. I'd wait to hear from barry himself.

Last edited by kenseth17; 03-14-2006 at 06:52 PM.
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Old 03-14-2006, 07:59 PM
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Mix the epoxy and add in 20% reducer... let it set for 30 minutes.. now come back and stir it again to make sure it is all mixed and spray... it will lay down like glass and you can use this as your sealer coat... you can reduce it up to 35 percent I believe without looking at the tech sheet. I would seal up the whole shooting match... wont take much epoxy and since I am a huge fan of the product.....

As for the clear... you should be able to spray a cellica with a sprayable gallon... but that and a dollar will buy you a cup of coffe as Barry says... Better to be safe having extra clear than running out, especially if you are new at spraying.. ie gun adjustments and waste etc....anyways you should be able to do that car with a sprayable gallon for sure... just depends on you really and your comfort zone... if you set up your gun as Barry suggest at his site you wont be wasting nearly as much as someone just cranking it all the way open and going at it...Hope this helps


You may not see Barry for a few days.. he had a major problem with his laptop and is out of town right now, so I dont think he can get online at the moment
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Old 03-14-2006, 08:10 PM
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ok, i think i will order another quart of clear and activator so i will have 1.5 sprayable gallons, i still have a little work to do on that headlight/hood , still needs some more block sanding. the one on the door is very smooth, just dosnt look like it.

BK, thanks i used reduced epoxy to seal up my hood two days ago and it didn't lay as flat as i wanted, i am going mix and wait like you said and see how it comes out. Thanks
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Old 03-14-2006, 10:25 PM
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one more thing i've noticed in the past when sealing a car I thought I would mention, since I see you have your jambs painted up nicely. If you tape back a ways in the jambs, the sealer seams to go further into the jambs then the paint does. I haven't sealed a car lately as I pretty much only 2k primer, but its something that I've had happen. You may want to tape sort of close to the edge and roll the edge of the tape back some so you don't get a real sharp line and maybe roll it back a little further when you spray base, or tape up the jambs and when you have the sealer and base on, look and make sure that all of the sealer got covered with base so you don't have sealer showing in the jambs which can really stand out. Either way would mean opening the doors, so you could tape the door window and quarter window seperate and then run a piece of tape on the gap between the two that can easily be removed to open the door up. And If you are installing the fenders to paint too, you can run a piece of tape on the backside of the front of the door to close up that gap too if you are picky and don't want sealer getting in the area in front of the hinges.
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Old 03-15-2006, 03:51 AM
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I like using the epoxy as a sealer for 2 reasons. First it gives you a uniform color to cover. The other thing is that it is a little insurance against a bad reaction from the under coats. It takes very little to put on one coat to seal it. If you get a little orange peel in it, you can sand it smooth just before painting over it.

Aaron
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Old 03-15-2006, 07:55 AM
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You will not want to reduce your clear 100%. You can reduce it up to 20%, but no more than that.
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Old 03-15-2006, 06:25 PM
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I think you should reprime the areas where you've sanded all the way down to through the factory paint and primer. That's indicative of waviness, IMO. Sealing a car when the jambs are done can get... messy.
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Old 03-15-2006, 06:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Countilaw
You will not want to reduce your clear 100%. You can reduce it up to 20%, but no more than that.

If it is SPI Universal Clear, it mixes 1 part clear to 1 part activator, per the tech sheet. I have sprayed a couple of gallons of it, mixed that way, with no problems. That ratio must be for another product.

Aaron
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Old 03-15-2006, 07:11 PM
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Just looking at those spots where you have sanded through, it looks as if they are really low. Unless you fill those shallow spots with primer or glazing filler they will stick out like sore thumbs when you apply base and clear.

Vince
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Old 03-16-2006, 02:53 AM
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Looking at the photos, it is really hard to accurately evaluate the high and low spots on a panel that has white primer on it. That being said, I would take a close look at the left door. I noticed 2 areas on the lower part that it appears that there are dents, indicated by the bare metal "eye brows". I personally think that the car needs a good blocking to verify everything is straight, then seal the whole thing in epoxy before painting.

Everyone will have their own opinion, but I like to use a dark primer whenever I can. It will show high and low spots better. If you use a lighter color, then you definately should use acontrasting guide coat. I know alot of body techs that just check a panel with their hands to see if they are straight. The problem is that it won't matter what it feels like once it is painted. It WILL matter what it looks like. Use a long block for blocking it out, to avoid getting low spots, and for making the panels straight. It looks like you may have used a DA. If that is the case, find someone to loan it to until the project is done. They will cause alot of low spots when used by someone that is not highly experienced when sanding primers.

Aaron
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Old 03-16-2006, 12:52 PM
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Pictures are tough to gage.

If it were mine I would spray two wet coats of primer and than sand smooth to paint just to be safe.
That dark color will show everything!.

At that point you can seal with epoxy but it would not be necessary, since your having a rough time making the epoxy slick.
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Old 03-16-2006, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarryK
since your having a rough time making the epoxy slick.
after following bk's advice leting the mix sit then spray its flat as glass
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Old 03-16-2006, 09:44 PM
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Now you know the trick staircase.... keep it to yourself though... We dont want people to learn our tricks Just kidding.. glad it came out much better for you... learned that induction and reduction gig from the one and only BWK... aka clumsy
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