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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 07-10-2009, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 302 Z28
Fluorescent lighting would be OK as it is much cooler than an incandescent bulb.

Vince
302 thank you, that is what everyone needs the "truth".. if you noticed in my very first post on this thread I said how there are so many mixed messages given... and you caught the one with the box fan motors and interjected thank you ... that is what all of us learning and wanting to paint our own cars need ... the truth ... thank you for doing that!

simon

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 07-10-2009, 07:19 AM
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One other thing that is possibly worth mentioning on the fans (or most any electrical device), is that when there's a failure- like a short circuit because of old or faulty wiring, for instance- that sparks (thus an ignition source) can be created. So while an induction motor is a safe motor, spark-wise, it can still be an ignition point.

The best bet here, IMO, will be to use a new fan (or any electrical component- extension cords, switches, lights, whatever) that has an hour or two of run time on it, previous to be used in the "booth". This might be seen as overly cautious, I don't know. But I wouldn't trust brand new (as in, the first use of a component in the explosive atmosphere) OR too old, either one.

Static can be lessened by painting on a day that isn't cool and dry, and wear cotton clothing/overalls. Probably best to avoid plastic sheeting, for instance.
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Old 07-10-2009, 08:30 AM
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You could also place the fans outside of the paint booth blowing air into the booth through filters and exiting filters at the other end.

Vince
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Old 07-10-2009, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 302 Z28
The box fans as mentioned are probably OK, as long as you start them before you start to spray and turn them off after all suspended paint has been removed. It is the starting and stopping of the fans that creates the spark. The motors are induction and as such do not have brushes to create sparks. The on-off switch is a different animal that most definitely creates a spark when operated. As mentioned the incandescent bulbs are the most worrysome. With incandescent bulbs their surface temperature more than likely exceeds the ignition temperature of suspended paint, so they are of concern. In industry when incandescent bulbs are used in an explosive classified area they are enclosed usually in a clear plastic bowl to prevent explosive gases or substances coming into contact with the high temperature bulb surface.

Vince
I painted a truck in a booth with incadesent bulbs....when in the bed I stood up hit one with my big head and cut myself,then it glowed real bright and arced out ....at the very least I could have electrocuted myself....they made it very hot too.....bad idea...
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Old 07-10-2009, 09:37 AM
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As stated in a couple posts above, the chance of creating an explosive atmosphere in your setup is extremely remote. Takes a threshold air/fuel ratio to get there and it would be hard to do w/o vent fan, let alone with one. I would worry more about being hit by a falling airplane, swallowed by the earth opening up in an earth quake, etc.

My (hobby) stick framed and drywalled booth has seen many, many paint jobs going thru and not a whimper. I use the squirrel cage blower from an old 5000cfm swamp cooler blowing out w/ 1/2hp induction motor directly in the air flow. This setup changes the air in the room every minute or so. I never even come close to generating a cloud. Of course I use a spray mask but I'd bet if you didn't stand between the fan and my spray gun, you would probably be challenged to smell the paint!

I did a search on Yahoo for "Paint Booth Explosion" and found zero incidents, and that's a pretty good endorsement since gory web pictures are a staple when they exist. I did take some precautions such as embedding 14 4' fluorescent fixtures in the walls and ceiling and covering each with a clear poly sheet but that is more to protect the lights form me running into them and breaking them and from me spray painting them. Another reason for going florescence is the light color. The whiter the light the truer the color you see in your booth. Lighting is rated according to its Correlated Color Temperature (CCT) is a measure of the "shade" (electromagnetic wave length)of whiteness of a light source. It is listed in the units of degrees Kelvin or the equivalent light wave length given off by by a 'blackbody' (hypothetical perfect radiation emitter) glowing at that temperature. Incandescent lighting is rated at 2700K which is yellowish-white and isn't the best in an environment like a paint booth where you are trying to carefully adjust the color that will be seen in a daylight setting. Halogen lighting is 3000K which is an improvement. Fluorescent lamps are manufactured to a chosen CCT by altering the mixture of phosphors inside the tube. Warm-white fluorescents have CCT of 2700K and are popular for residential lighting. Neutral-white fluorescents have a CCT of 3000K or 3500K. Cool-white fluorescents have a CCT of 4100K and are popular for office lighting. The latter two are better for a paint booth compared to incandescent lighting. Daylight fluorescents have a CCT of 5000K to 6500K, which is bluish-white and are the best possible lighting for a paint booth. They really suck for lighting a home though. That's why the make the 2700K warm light versions. Plain vanilla 4100K cool-white bulbs are great but I sprung for the 5000K Daylight ones in my booth. Don't know if I can really tell a difference but what the hey!! Either are tons better than regular incandescent light bulbs were.

IF your setup ever did pop, you would launch that tarp cover to the stratosphere and be running in circles saying 'Where's my mama?' for a few moments but shouldn't suffer any real bodily harm.

To make a short story long, yes there is a potential for an explosive mixture of paint fumes and air, no doubt about it. However the simplest precautions completely avoid that possibility and your setup far exceeds that requirement. "Paint on Garth!!"

Last edited by willys36@aol.com; 07-10-2009 at 09:46 AM.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 07-10-2009, 10:24 AM
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good points Willy,the tarps could never hold enough pressure to create an explosion
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Old 07-10-2009, 04:37 PM
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I appriciate everyones input... and I am glad we were able to somewhat debunk some of these myths... and now I think my fiance will be a little more at ease about me painting this car... I myself was not as worried since I have worked in the automotive industry for years and even been stupid enough to pull gas tanks with a cig in my mouth.. and thanks to Mike for making me do all this home work LOL thanks master

simon
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 03:22 AM
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One day we heard a really big boom .

The workers at a local Macco Auto Paint shop 8 blocks up the street were cleaning the paint booth fan blades and flue with lacquer thinner for some odd reason.. One of the workers lite up a cigarette.

It was his last smoke.

There was a little bit of fire to go with it..

It killed him instantly dead as a mackerel ...

The shop closed and never reopened..

Safety first, safety is no accident...

Had a fan been blowing it probably wouldn't have happened..

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&r...+death&spell=1

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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 07:39 AM
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smoking WILL kill you one way or another.
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Old 07-15-2009, 09:00 AM
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Never said it is impossible to create a bomb! Happens all the time in the grain industry - grain dust, mixed w/ the right amount of air + a piece of bailing wire rattling and sparking down pneumatic duct = BOOM!! Lacquer thinner, gasoline, rattle can paints, finger nail polish remover, wood sanding dust, etc., etc. etc., in the right mixture with air and a spark will blow every time. Point is, with a ventilated booth, solvent concentrations will be several orders of magnitude too low to be an explosion risk. Analogy in the woodworking industry is central dust collection systems (I have one of those too in my shop!). Wood dust in air is every bit as explosive as paint solvent. However the woodworking industry uses dust collection systems all the time because again, the system is moving so much air that the dust concentration is rarely (won't say never cause it DOES happen) high enough to cause a hazard.

By all means if you are not confident in what you are doing, go with the explosion proof components. However the risk (NEVER zero in anything we do in life) is way less than being struck by lightening, hit by a falling jet liner, going thru a year w/o a tax increase from some branch of government.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 12:31 PM
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I used a car cover with clear visqueen on the sides to allow natural light in. This avoided the issue of lighting.
I also used box fans outside the enclosure blowing air inside the booth through filters. Air compressors were outside and away from the booth.
I also grounded the car inside the booth with a chain.

Pictures here if interested:
http://chris66dad.tripod.com/id24.html
Ron

Last edited by 66 Restomod; 07-15-2009 at 01:39 PM.
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Old 07-15-2009, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 66 Restomod
I used a car cover with clear visqueen on the sides to allow natural light in. This avoided the issue of lighting.
I also used box fans outside the enclosure blowing air inside the booth through filters. Air compressors were outside and away from the booth.
I also grounded the car inside the booth with a chain.

Pictures here if interested:
http://chris66dad.tripod.com/id24.html
Ron
Great job!!
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 02:50 PM
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I second that!!!!!
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 03:16 PM
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Thanks.
Not a totally original idea.
I did think it would help others with lessons learned, safety and some pictures so I added it to our father/son 66 Mustang restoration website.

Lots of ways to skin a cat and this is just one that worked for us.

Good Luck and BE Safe
Ron
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 66 Restomod
Thanks.
Not a totally original idea.
I did think it would help others with lessons learned, safety and some pictures so I added it to our father/son 66 Mustang restoration website.

Lots of ways to skin a cat and this is just one that worked for us.

Good Luck and BE Safe
Ron
HEY !!!! No car pics? come on 66....if the car looks half as good as the booth we want to see them....Right,guys?
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