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Old 01-14-2004, 12:46 PM
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Filling Block/ Hard Block???

Ok this is an off-shoot of my other thread. Trying to figure out how much HP a stock block will handle.

Filling the block increases the strength, supports the mains and cylinders.

The draw back is, possible higher oil temps and less water in the cooling system.

Has any of you ran an engine on the street with a filled block?

Was it a short fill or a tall fill?

Were there any negative effects? (overheating, hot oil, etc..)

The reason I am asking is because my engine is .060 over and will see some pretty serious HP. I have never ren a filled block so I don't know it it is a good idea or not.

I do already have an oil cooler, high flow water pump, aluminum radiator. My car does not overheat at all right now (even in temp above 100*). I would like to keep it that way.


Royce

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Old 01-14-2004, 12:54 PM
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Royce,
Problem is you have to fill a block then let it cure. You can't fill the block if you have a finished bore due to distortion.

Short fill only on the street. Need maximum cooling system.

Chris
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Old 01-14-2004, 02:30 PM
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Chris,
I understand that it is recommended to fill the block before machine work. Like I said I have never played with filler before.

My block is already done and ready to assemble (just waiting for UPS to drop off my bearings).

What I was thinking is if I bolted on a set of heads (poor mans torque plate) and filled the block through the water pump ports?

Are you saying that the hard blok will distort the block as it dries? If that is the case, it's too late for me cause all machine work, cleaning, etc.. is done.

I will just have to take my chances or buy an aftermarket block.

The short fill will do me no good, since my main concern is the cylinder walls.

Royce
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Old 01-14-2004, 02:37 PM
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Yes it will distort the walls. I would not recommend. The mixture should be poored in the water holes on the deck to achieve equal flow to all the cylinders. The way I was taught we would fill 1 side while in the mill. Let it sit for 24 hours, fill the other side, then let block cure for 4 weeks. this yielded the best results.
Hope this helps.

Chris
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Old 01-14-2004, 02:43 PM
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Chris,
Thanks a lot. Yes, that helps I will leave it alone. Makes sense that it would distort the block I didn't consider that. It would do more harm than good at this point. I'll run it till it gives out and then I will build one with an aftermarket block.

Thanks for the advice/heads up,
Royce
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Old 01-14-2004, 07:07 PM
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This would be a great addition to the knowledge base!! I've wondered about fill myself and this really cleared up a lot of my questions!

Dave
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Old 01-14-2004, 08:11 PM
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I am having a hard time with the distortion thing, but I guess it is certainly possible. I am not sure what order mine was done in since it was done at the machine shop. If you want to know, I can call my machinist. I know the cylinders are all straight on mine with the heads torqued(measured from the bottom before assembly).

Later,

Chris
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Old 01-15-2004, 01:32 AM
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Turbo,
You can call and see what he says. Most things that start as a liquid, putty or paste tend to shrink (or expand) when they harden. With that said it makes sense that the block would get moved around a bit. I am sure we are talking thousandths of an inch, but this is the reason we use torque plates etc... to get things perfect.
Then again you would think it would just move to an open area in the block. There is always two ways (at least) to look at something.
I have always hear that you wanted to fill before machine work, but I have never used the stuff.

Please post what he tells you, it would be interesting to hear.

Royce
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Old 01-15-2004, 07:30 AM
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Cylinder distortion. We had a fixture, now mind you I worked in the shop in the 80's, that we hooked up to our race blocks that would circulate water through the block at 190 degrees. Doing so we simulated the heat state of the block. Now did it help...can't tell you...did we have good ring leak numbers...always. Some of the cup teams practice this today.

Seasoned blocks. It is a good idea to bake a new block. Common practice to put it through some good heat cycles. This allows the block to shift and move and for cylinders to find their "homes". This again is common Cup practice.

Back to filler. Both Moroso and Hardblok offer tall fills and short fills to get the necessary amount. Also for those of you with strokers that clearance and may break throught while grinding, you can putty the hole and fill with Hardblok about an 1". This will seal your grind mark and make the block usable.

Chris
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