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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 01:17 PM
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MrWood, it's too bad that there's a rat living in your neighborhood. I could see if you were painting all the time but what's the big deal? When I first moved into my house I stripped and polyurethaned all my hard wood floors. I wonder what Fire Marshal Bill would have said about those fumes? I sprayed my car at night to keep the any nosey neighbors in check and also put a wet filter on the exhaust of my fan. I feel bad for you in your situation. I'd probably register and insure tho most awful looking s***box complet with a gaudy roll on paint job and constantly park it in front of his house.That may seem a bit extreme to some, but we work hard to own our little piece of the planet and I hate when someone screws with it.

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 01:22 PM
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I think we "hobbyist" have or will run into similar problems sooner or later.

I have been doing this since I was a kid, though I am lucky enough to live in a commercial zone (that just happens to be mostly residenciual homes)

I mostly keep it a hobby. I only do around 3 or 4 cars a year, with some small parts in between. In 10 years I have never had a problem with any of the neighbors or the city, tell last year........

I painted a car for a friend that wanted flames........he had asked the local body shop to do it, but they were going to just bc/cc and throw flame decals over it all . I actually painted the car and flames (no stickers)

2 weeks later the body shop turned me in for operating an illegal body shop.

I've been hassled by the city ever since.......but when all the dust settled, there was nothing they could do........there have been no air complaints (I try to keep fumes to a minimum).......all my waste solvents do get recycled........and it just happens to be that all the cars I painted belonged to members of my "carclub"......there for private, and not a public business.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 06:54 PM
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I'm torn with my feelings on this subject. I own a Auto repair shop (mechanical not body) and I have all the licenses and insurances to go along with it. These are not cheap to keep but very necessary to have. I fallow all the rules set forth by my city and state. But the guy down the street runs a 1 man shop out of his house, and I will get some customers that have gotten a price from him, and then ask me for my price, I cannot compete with him out of his house. He has no overhead costs, no insurance, none of the things that a business owner has. In this case I know he is a hack!!! I have had to fix some of his repairs. But this is what I'm getting at. I need to support my family from the earning of my shop I charge $80.00+ an hour and he charges $25.00 or less an hour I cannot compete with that. Thank God I am good at what I do (and he's not) or I wouldn't stand a chance. At time I feel like I should turn him in for running an un registered repair shop. But I don't. If you were to ask him,(I have) he says he also is a hobbyist and only does it for friends, but I know better because I have talked to some of his customer. So its hard to sit back and watch him take food from my family's mouth. I do not like the city or state, or fire marshal in this case interfering with TRUE hobbyist working on their own cars but most (not all) do more than there own cars. And everybody suffers from this.

Steve
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Old 06-17-2005, 07:08 PM
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1931 Steve, If the guy is definatly running a bussines out of his house you 've got a right to complain, if you are a neighbor and it's not zoned for bussines. If he's a hobbyist banging out a car or two per year I would leave him alone.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J Cal
1931 Steve, If the guy is definatly running a bussines out of his house you 've got a right to complain, if you are a neighbor and it's not zoned for bussines. If he's a hobbyist banging out a car or two per year I would leave him alone.

Not only that, but like you said.....He's not good at it, if anything he may even bring you more customers (for repairs)

Most people that go to a "work at home" mechanic or painter, or poaple that are after the cheep price...........In other words it's eather they get the job done cheep or they keep the car the way it is.........I know, I get allot of poeple like that.........but I only do the jobs I like to do, and turn away allot of poeple.........most of those are still rolling with dents or peeling paint jobs they wanted me to fix.......So I say even If I had done those jobs.....How can you say I took a customer away from the lagit shop?

In all honestly about 90% of the cars I do.......realy do belong to friends or family, not only that, but I mostly do custom stuff, the kind of stuff the local body shop doesn't seem to do (decals, instead of painted flames? ).....and I realy don't make much of a profit (sometimes I end up loosing money) ........so, Yes I say I, and people like me, are "Hobbyist"
Enless it's your only sorce of income, how can it be anything els.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 08:21 PM
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I do work at home to. I haven't been making very much for my time either. I am considering not doing any more and trying to think of other things to do. Most customers are cheap and a lot of what I do a bodyshop would probably not even take because it would not be profitable for them. They don't know what kind of work you are capable of doing, when you don't have a couple hundred thousand booth, and other equiptment. I also tried working in shops. Its hard to stay in one when you have been doing the work for 15 years and they won't even pay $10 an hour and you have to use and buy your own tools, so I don't feel too bad if I take a job or two away from a shop. One of the last jobs I had at a shop I was making a whopping $9 an hour sanding down semis and tankers. And I knew I had a lot more skill then the position I had. I've been better off getting a job at a larger company that would use my painting/body experience. I do plan to get a shop with proper zoning and insurance and all the other fun stuff, but right now I don't have the money saved up to stay in business. If the work didn't keep flowing in, I would be done in a hurry, so at this point doing work at home is all I can do.
And their are shops that are a true business that are hacks too. I don't know who worked on a mustang I painted before, a shop or backyarder, but their was a lot of hack work. Big holes stuffed with plastic filler, and replacement quarter panel section put right over old rusty panel, and idea of a color change is shooting some undercoating under the trunk and hood. And when my ex girlfriends car broke down, she brought it to one shop. It was there for months and they put in a new fuel pump and couldn't find out what was wrong and blew out three ccrm (relay box). So then they tow the car to the ford dealership. The dealership wants 400 to change entire wiring harness and couldn't guarentee it would fix the problem. I told her well I'll take a look at it. Payed $90 to dealership for telling its not getting power to fuel pump ( could have figured that out with my test light) and 40 bucks to rent a tow dolley. Electrical isn't my favorite thing at all, but found broken wire to fuel pump and threw a new relay box in it (35 bucks used). Figured out the problem and had it running under a week part time after work. Cost more to tow it an pay the dealer then it did to fix. She was pretty happy she didn't pay that dealer $400.

Last edited by kenseth17; 06-17-2005 at 08:41 PM.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 10:16 PM
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I think you guys are missing my point a hobbyist does the work or repair because he/she loves it and wants to do it. If a hobbyist is charging for that repair than that is a source of income weather it be for a friend, family member or car club member. I have not and more than likely never will turn this guy in to the state. Thats not how I am, nor is he a threat to my business.

Kenseth17 you stated this= Its hard to stay in one when you have been doing the work for 15 years and they won't even pay $10 an hour and you have to use and buy your own tools, so I don't feel too bad if I take a job or two away from a shop.

How can you say this when you are complaining of only making $10.00 per hour, if the shop had the job or two that you did at home they may be able to pay you more. Just look at the economy, the USA out sources a lot of work over seas, why? They can do it much cheaper and more efficiently than we can here. (not that this is the only reason the economy is in bad shape) but if that was YOUR job that was eliminated due to out sourcing you would not like it.

Steve
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 10:49 PM
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My job was eliminated. Was making 14 hr at a yacht builder, much more then any bodyshop payed me, and a bodyshop requires more abilities, paint, bodywork, buff, taking stuff apart, putting it back together, every car different ect. Also putting together stuff other people took apart, with no organization and didn't see how it came apart. I didn't use my own tools at the yacht builder. I was laid off in 2002 from the yacht place after bieng there 3 1/2 years when the economy was going bad. When I worked in most of the shops they had enough work and the economy was good at the time. I haven't been able to find a good job since being laid off, and only worked in the place that did semi's because I needed a job. When I was working in shops, I also didn't do side jobs while at them. Only on rare occasion. Plus it is a hassle bringing tools back and forth. I don't see why it is so hard for a shop to pay a decent wage. $15/hr is the medium wage for painters bodyman. I don't think I am in the lower part of the lower 10% which is what I was being payed. I gave up working in them fairly early, and only took the last one cause I needed a job. I am not working right now, which is why I have been doing more work on my own. If I don't get some people who aren't looking for everything so cheap, I won't be doing that either. Should have got in a trade with a union. I don't think I've been doing anything a shop would want anyways, except maybe if I do a small collision repair. They like the jobs that are gravy and can make a quick buck on, not dealing with rust and complete paint.

Last edited by kenseth17; 06-17-2005 at 10:55 PM.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 10:54 PM
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this is a touchy situation
1st and most important if its your property( the 1 you rent from uncle sam) then you have the right to use it for your self (HOBBYIST).
i agree i woul not do alot of painting especially if some one else would be negatively affected.
if i had to fix on my vehile all night to make it roll by morning for my employment responsibilities then so be it.

my neighbors have tried everything that there puny minds could come up with and i dont have anything going on.
to the point that the authorities are getting fed up with them !
in my county vehicles have to be;
"serviceable" :
1 has to start move & stop on its own .
not put a battery in it or inflate a tire.
ive had the fire dept called for using a torch,
ive had the police called for listing to the radio,
and good old code enforcement ...

meanwhile the guy across the street 7am an Sunday(and just about every day).
RAPS HIS HARLEY for 5 minuets and then throws metal around while torchering a grinder till about noon
two week ago late @ night someone was shinning a lazer pointer in mine and my mother in laws house ,thru the windows (shes in the mid 70'sand live 75' away) she rolled off the couch and called me thinking someone had a gun on her... guess where the lazer was coming from.people need to mind there own business and the ones that dont should be penalized
cops cant do a thing cause they dident see it happen

guys like steve 31 pay the penalties for the fly by night hack who create the bad publicity for good auto mechanics
it seems sometimes that the criminal's have more rights than the good guys
there for makes it even harder for the good guy to do the right thing
the best thing i could do for my self would be a steel building so that no one can see whats going on it none of there business any way @ this point i cant do anything without a audience so i wait.

try to stay under the radar cause once they have targeted you they will never go away the only reason we stay is for my mother outlaw ..oh i mean inlaw shes cool and healthy as a horse and dosent want to move good 4 her sucks 4 me
1st chance i get ,boing... im gone, outta hea!! to da woods
im not even gonna try to put a garage here

kenseth i hear you ,they dont want to pay but they want you to have the tools right .......a boss chewed into me because i didnt have tamper proof torx bits after about 5 min of that i stood my ground and said" do you have a set" his reply was no ,so i told to shut up and go away i was looking for a job when i found this one ,he backed off i quit few months later its not like you can count on too many biger companyies to give a damn about their employees because an afew years they'll "let you go" and hire someone else back @ the minimum wage they want to pay.
you have the right to do what ever you want as long as it dont hurt someone else and their stuff !

EAT THE RICH!

SR66
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 10:59 PM
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I cant speak for body shops only MY repair shop,I will take any job that a customer is willing to pay to have fixed. Not at a cheap rate,but a fair rate for that job. I am a so called car whore. if you pay me I will fix it. At the end of the day if you take the money that you earned and put it on the table and mix it all up, you really don't know what money went to what job. So if you tell your self that you only take jobs that other legit shops would not, your just trying to make yourself feel better. And also if your charging customers you are not a hobbyist.

P.S this is not the way I wanted to take this post, I was just commenting on the guy own the street from me.

Steve
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2005, 11:02 PM
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Quote:
biger companyies to give a damn about their employees because an afew years they'll "let you go" and hire someone else back @ the minimum wage they want to pay.
Exactly this is what has happened to me before, if you do start to make a little bit. There is no loyaty from employers any more. They expect you to be perfect and they are far from it. And if you want additional training, you have to get that on your own to, they won't help with that. Getting away from the topic of this thread, but had to give my side of it. And I hear you on those damn harleys. I worked second shift and lived across from a tavern. At about 7am a bunch of harleys would stop there for breakfast and wake me up after 4 hrs of sleep. And the place I am at now, it kind of makes you wonder how they figure zoning. There is a business right down the road that does painting and mechanical repairs, but it is a residential neighborhood. The other side of the highway is all business. I know other residents in the area paint cars too, one guy right down the road I know for sure. When I lived at home yet in the country at I painted stuff once in a while, there were 3 neighbors that painted in the residential area also. One built hotrods, one was a paint rep that now owns a bodyshop, and one fixed up a muscle car for each of his kids and one for himself, so I don't think it will ever stop. And mechanical, that hardly should be a problem, as long as a bunch of noise isn't being made. Not like too many things are harmfull doing that, Maybe washing parts or when working with gas or something.

Last edited by kenseth17; 06-17-2005 at 11:29 PM.
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Old 06-18-2005, 02:45 AM
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Don't worry Steve.....At I do understand were your coming from, after all, I may be in your shoes some day.

But for now it really is just a hobby.
I only do other people's cars for 3 reasons.

1.....No joke......I love this stuff
2.....My friends keep expecting "hookups"
3.....Keep my hobby alive

Though I do charge some (gata cover materials, tools and such)...Profit definitely isn't one of the reasons I do it.

Like I said, I mainly like doing full refinished custom jobs. The only reason I accept small dent repair jobs, is to get more bodywork experience (my weakness)

Now I guess I could spend hundreds of $'s, purposely denting up my car and fixing it over and over, to gain experience...........but I find it more practical to fix someone else's car the needs it, and get a couple bucks in return.

When you look at the cost of materials and tools.......custom painting and bodywork is a very expensive hobby, but it's also one that can pay for itself.

Unless you just happen to have lots of $$ to begin with, It only makes since to do a couple side jobs (if for anything) to keep your hobby alive.

This is one of my future pet projects........



Right now it's just a Photoshop prototype (Visual motivation). My goal is to have it done with in the next 5 years. I'm going to need to get a base model, maybe a parts car too, at least a new and better welder, a plasma cutter would really help not to mention more experience in bodywork and metal fabrication. Side jobs provide the only real practical means for all that.
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Old 06-18-2005, 07:09 AM
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That Impala idea looks really good! the modification to a two door will be some work. Chrome bumpers would also add but would take some serious modification and rechroming. Even if you used the original plastic bumpers as a surround and had a chrome bumper slightly protruding through an opening cut into the plastic bumper might work? I like chrome

Kenseth17, if you need a job in the Green Bay area shoot me an email, A good friend of mine runs a very large Bodyshop there and may be able to hook you up. Bob
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 06-18-2005, 07:49 AM
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Brian and Bob you are right.. I have asked my neighbors if it bothers them when I paint, on one side is a single mom who I do lots of work for... she does not care at all, in fact I am fixing her car that was hit last week as soon as I get my currrent project out of the garage. On the other side is a Grumpy Old Man.. lol.... I asked him if he minded that I was doing work, and he said no... I ask him again 4 weeks later and he said "NOT YET"... Since that conversation that day I either spray at night... like midnight when everyone is asleep, or very first thing in the morning like 5 am.... He and his wife like to skinny dip in there pool or hot tub late at night, so that hampers me painting then too...

I am using filters on both sides of my 'Booth", but one neighbor said you can smell it for a minute then it will be gone and so on and so on... If my grumpy neighbor comes and says it is a problem then I will have to close shop here and look for another place to conduct business....

I too agree that it is one thing to do your own stuff, it is another when you have different vehicles in your garage every week or two, that is allot of chemicals and the dust alone is out of this world... I blow my garage out and I know it has to land on my neighbors houses to some degree, I dont like that but have no other way of getting the dust out...

Dang boys, this thread kinda makes me feel bad about working out of my garage at home... My grumpy neighbor is retired after all, I know when I retire I dont want a bodyshop 30 feet from my house..... Things that make you go hmmmmm
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 06-18-2005, 08:24 AM
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Thanks Badbob. Right now I've have something I have to get done first, but will be looking more in about a month, I may just shoot ya a Pm then. I haven't had luck in bodyshops so I usually don't look there. Bodyshops seem like they are a little slow around here right now. I don't know for sure though. Actually very early morning is one of the better times to paint at home anyways. Bugs are still napping and don't fly to the lights like night time. Geez two old foggies skinny dipping, thats gotta be worse then dumping a barrel of reducer in someones front yard. Impala idea badbob. A you thinking your in another thread or am I missing something.
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