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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 09:24 AM
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Oh! What does it show you? Does it not load the link at all or does it grey out the pictures like before? Let me know and I will try to do something different.

They sent me the 4000 clear because they said Illinois is not one of the states that requires VOC compliance.
So in this case would quality base coats be easy to get from local retailers?

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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 09:33 AM
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Most importantly...you can get good solvent based base coat...that's a relief...seriously...a great thing.

The pictures show up Gray, the site loads...gray squares where the pictures should be.

Ray
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 09:56 AM
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Great!

That is odd. I wonder why it is doing that.
Lets try something then. Here is the link again, click on it and see if you can view them now:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uiwiaeqwdyroqs1/vPsrVHwATA

If the link still does not work. Do the following:
In the right corner of my post it should say "aykhan90's Photo Album". If you clock on that it will take you to another page with photos on it and you should see the bumper pictures there.

Hopefully one of these options works, if not I will try to do it another way.
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 10:38 AM
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Got it my friend...and I will say, if you keep on doing things this way..well...I don't know how to say this but...I'm going to get you on full time...LOL....good job.

Tonight, we need to concentrate on making sure that all those hard to get at areas are scuffed...there is a product out there for plastic bumpers called adhesion promoter, I have used it on some covers, and I haven't used it. As long as all the mold release is gone and the plastic has been properly roughed up, Epoxy primer will adhere to that cover. Speaking of Epoxy primer, when you get home tonight, don't forget to turn it over, let it sit turned over until tomorrow, then turn it over again. As mentioned, this will save you time stirring the product before you mix it, give it the 1/2 hour of induction time and spray it.

You are now well on your way...later when you have time, we need to go over the list of things to do and what else you need to get and how to get these products at a reasonable price...I can see the light at the end of the tunnel my friend and with the fine job your doing, I know it's not a train...LOL

Excellent work...keep up the attitude and we will get that car being the envy of your piers...not only that but, when you continue visiting this site or others, you will have a greater understanding of what people are talking about.

Ray
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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 11:03 AM
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Hahaha great! So far things seem to be going good. I will say I am a little nervous about when it is time to spray the primer on! But gotta take it step at a time.

And though I am at best a novice, my knowledge regarding this subject has increased far more than I had imagined. Obviously thanks to your help!

Yes after work I have to scuff up the areas I missed and as you mentioned those hard to reach areas. If I am able to get all of those areas satisfactorily do you think I should still try to get the adhesion promoter or it won't be necessary?

So update on the paint stores. I called the stores that carried PPG, unfortunately none of them selll automotive paint. I called a few stores that carry Sikkens as well and same deal. One of the stores suggested calling body shops to ask about their paint suppliers.

The last store I called was SW. They do carry automotive paint and the person on the phone told me that they would sell them in pint quantity. I asked whether they can mix the reducer for me which they do not do. They say I would have to mix it myself. Then I asked what size the reducer comes in. To which she said the reducers at the store are in quart sizes.

Now do you think I should just go with SW or try to contact body shops and ask for there paint suppliers. Or would body shops be willing to sell me the paint themselves?
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  #111 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 12:29 PM
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I don't know if a body shop would sell you paint, that would be up to the individual shop. the problem with buying from a shop is that in order to get you the right color, they need to take the time to get their variant decks out, spend time with you to reach a decision on the color, mix it up and then figure out a price...that's not really their job and they might not look to kindly on that. You could try the shop that gave you the W & G remover? Again, if you don't ask...

Adhesion promoter, as I said, it is a good idea and I have and have not used it on bumpers...SPI sells it at $22.35 a quart. It sprays as is right out of the can, doesn't need any other additive (you can add a catalyst to it but not required). Now that you have the bumper sanded (or close to it) don't use W & G remover on it...soap, water and air dry before we top coat it.

Look in your local Yellow pages under "Auto Body Supply", often they have adds letting you know what brand they sell and you could take it from there. SW selling quarts of reducer compared to gallons is a good thing...I'd still see if a supply store wouldn't mix a pint of reducer in the base for you. Keep shopping and I'm sure we will get it solved. Your going to need a few other supplies that they sell such as a tack rag and maybe a few other things so a trip to the body shop supply store is inevitable.

Ray
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  #112 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 02:50 PM
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Okay so I followed the "if you don't ask..." strategy and called some auto body shops I found in the yellow pages online. Almost all the shops I found were mostly repair shops. The ones that actually sold paint were not willing to reduce it for me. However, I did strike some luck and found a repair shop that was willing to sell me the small amount of paint and reduce it for me. He asked me about the color to see how many variances there are. And I asked if I could bring my car in for him to determine the correct variance of the color. He was willing to do that for me. I asked him what brand of paint he uses and he said they use SW. He also said that he can sell the cheaper off brand one but that would not make for a good match.

The guy was also saying that in the case of painting panels I should really try to blend the color. Which I believe, correct me if I am wrong, means also painting parts of the panels which are already on the car to make the color look more even. However, I don't think I would do that because that would fall a little out of my budget and scope of work. But just wanted to let you know what he said to get your opinion on it.

I can take a trip to an auto store for the adhesion promoter and the other supplies I may need.
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  #113 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 03:11 PM
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It does sound as though you got a body shop that's willing to lend a hand...perfect. I'm glad that he mentioned the variances and that he is willing to check your car to the color chips...that's exactly what you need to do.

If this was my car...I would blend the color, however, this could mean bringing color out onto the adjacent doors and possibly the hood...that would mean sanding those panels for a blend and clearing the entire hood and both doors. I can walk you through as to how to do that if you like but, it would be much more time consuming, you would need to purchase finer sand paper and masking paper and masking tape and there is no guarantee that the blend would work...(silver is a tough color to blend at times even if you have a great deal of experience). With the body shop checking the color against variant chips, we should get close...with what I'm going to be asking you to do, we could get even closer.

We do need to make a trip to the supply store and make a list...first question, where are you painting these parts? How are you planning on hanging them? And, are you planning on painting all three at the same time?

Let me know and I'll get a list together.

Ray
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  #114 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 05:15 PM
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Okay glad you asked. Now you can get an idea of how ghetto/scrappy this project I decided to endeavor on really is lol.

So all the panels are essentially in my studio apartment, which has been converted into a mini body shop. All my sanding, scuffing and cleaning has been done in the apartment. The compressor I mentioned earlier in the thread is actually my boss's compressor (I just said mine for ease of explanation). He agreed to let me use his garage for spray painting. Originally I was just thinking of placing them on the ground for painting since I didn't really know much. You mentioned hanging them so I went into the garage to look for means to hang the panels. He has those ceiling bike hooks that I can use to hang the panels with, but as of now I do not have anything to hang them with.

As for painting them, first I want to paint just one panel to get an idea of how to do it. Then sleep over it and paint the other ones the day after or some other day. Also I do not want to overload the small compressor. As for the blending I would like to do it but at this point money is somewhat tight. I had gotten into an accident which basically messed up all of my front panels. I wanted to get it fixed before winter hits in order to avoid getting snow and salt into the engine. Before I had even decided to start this project I had purchased a painted hood from a junkyard because I got a good deal on it. The hood is actually grey, a little ghetto I know, but to be honest it has grown on me LOL

I would personally like to paint the hood and blend the colors in but I have to realistically repair the car while staying within my means. Gotta do what you gotta do I guess.

So now that the background on the project is done let me move on to a few questions

1. I got the clear coat and the primer. Am I flipping the activator also or just the primer?
2. Do you have any ideas on what I can use to hang the panels? Or is it possible to paint them while laying on the ground?
3. What would your suggestion be as to painting the panels at the same time or separately, keeping the compressor (5.5 cfm @ 40 psi, 11 gal) in mind ?
4. Should I go ahead and call the body shop to set up a day to get the base coat? I was thinking maybe this Saturday.

Any other comments or ideas you have based on my explanations, feel free to let me know. Thanks!
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  #115 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 05:37 PM
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Again, I will throw a few thoughts in the mix. For hanging parts you can use most any kind of wire, I personally like to use wire clothes hangers, they are a little tough to cut and bend, but they will usually hold the piece a little more steady, than say mechanics wire. Be sure to hang the parts like they will be mounted on the car so the color will lay out right (especially silver). If you are going to paint more than one piece at a time, be sure to leave plenty of working room around them when you hang them. I personally would paint everything at one time since it is silver. There would be a better chance of color match and consistency doing it all at one time, Same temperature, same humidity, same mix, same amount of stirring etc. But you and Ray may feel differently.

I would also like to say (in lieu of another post where several of us overlooked sharing this information) be sure when you mix the primer, to mix the primer and activator in the mixing cup, I usually stir it for at least a minute or two (back and forth, not round and round lol), then let it set for at least 30 minutes. DO NOT put the primer in the gun, then the activator in the gun, without mixing the two together and inducing first. It will not mix that way.

You will mix the base color and clear the same way, using the mixing cup to mix them with their respective ratios, and reducer or activators, then pour into the gun cup through a strainer. IF it goes in a gun it gets strained. be sure to drain the compressor tank of any water prior to starting to paint. Hope these help a little.

Kelly

Last edited by carolinacustoms; 09-26-2013 at 05:40 PM. Reason: spelling
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  #116 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 05:49 PM
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If he has a garage, he has rafter's if he has rafter's you need wire, if you don't have wire...put that on your list...LOL...does it have any ventilation...do you have a respirator?

If you have a hood that needs paint...and your painting the bumper and fender's, paint the hood as well...you have place...after you do this, you may nor have one again...it's going to smell and he may not want that smell in his garage, is it an attached garage or detached?

1) Just turn the primer, the activator is fine.
2) as discussed...get wire, hang them from the rafters.
3) Every compressor is different and we aren't sure what it can handle, just to see if the compressor can handle more...maybe hang both fenders...prime them, then at a later date, hang the bumper and paint the hood.
4) If they are open Saturday, that wood be great...it'll give you time to see if you want to paint the hood as well...that would mean there would need to be a bit more paint.

Do you have an air pressure regulator with a gauge for your paint gun...I'm making a list and that is something your will need if the gun didn't come with one.

Ray
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  #117 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 06:48 PM
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Thanks for the advice Kelly, it is always helpful! I will keep the things you cautioned against in mind.

So on the list I have the following so far:
-Respirator
-Hanging wire
-Pressure regulator (One gun comes with it and one without it, depending on the price of the regulator by itself I will choose the gun)

The garage is attached. There is no ventilation. How long does the smell last for? Can I just open the garage door or the spraying needs to be done in an enclosed environment?

As for the hood, if I were to paint it do I need to sand the panel and do something else first.
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Old 09-26-2013, 08:21 PM
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Thanks Kelly, all good advice again.

What's most important is that the regulator has an actual gauge so you know what pressure you are spraying at. Silver are very sensitive to pressure, paint volume, gun set up, humidity, distance of the gun from the panel and even temperature of reducer as to what color of silver you get. So that's why I asked you if the gun came with a regulator with an air gauge...that is one of the most important things for color control when dealing with metallic's, especially silvers.

As far as wire for hanging, again, my good friend Kelly is right, a sturdy coat hanger works well...another trick I use is to also wire parts like fenders from the the bottom and either weigh them down or hard wire them to a stationary object. The reason for that is when your painting, the air pressure from the paint gun can cause the parts to flop around, making them difficult to paint...if they are wired top and bottom, you minimize the flopping around and we want to make this as easy as possible. Any kind of wire will work for holding the bottom of the part in place...

Seeing that the garage is attached, you could leave about 1 foot of the garage door open, if he would have a man door at the rear of the garage, that could be propped open and hopefully you get a cross breeze to clear out the garage...if not, get one of those fans for $20.00...it's not much but it would get some air movement.

The hood would need to be sanded with 600 wet, we would necessarily need to paint the under neath or if we did, just to the insulation.

The smell, well, I've been painting for many years, I can't smell it anymore, however, most people can...it will hang around for a couple of days.

So, your shopping list

1 )Respirator
2) Wire (if you don't have coat hangers that you can take apart, or speaker wire for tying the bottom of the panel down so it doesn't flop...maybe mechanics wire...if you use mechanics wire on the top and tie down the bottom with the same mechanics wire, that would minimize the flopping just like coat hanger wire).
3) Regulator with air gauge
4) Tack Rag
5) Paint Strainers
6) Some form of mixing cup...get about 3 quart cups with lids
7) Gun wash (lacquer thinner)
8) Spray out cards...what we will do is document what pressure gets you closer to the original color on your car by spraying a little base coat on a spray out card and holding it up to the car...when we have a close match...that is the pressure and gun setting that we will use for all the panels. This will keep the color match as consistent as possible.
9) a disposable ruler for mixing, paint company's used to give them away, now they charge like $5 or $6 for one.
10) Possibly a fan for exhausting the over spray and fumes, if you don't have one or can't borrow one.

There will be more...not much but a little more. Would you like me to let you know where you can purchase these items?

Kelly has good advice, on a previous thread, it was assumed that the additives would be stirred before being put into the paint gun...what may appear as little details can cause major problems...that's why I welcome other opinions and advice.

Ray
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Old 09-26-2013, 08:47 PM
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Okay I got everything and will keep the necessary things in mind.

I know where to get some of the things but if it is not too much trouble for you to tell me then it would help guide me in a better direction when I go out to buy these things tomorrow.

So for painting the hood, I will wet sand the whole thing with 600 sanding paper, basically the same as I would an e-coated panel. And then it would be good to spray on the base coat or would it need some primer also? Also how much base coat would I need in total if I am to include the hood in the painting as well?
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  #120 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2013, 09:03 PM
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I will give you suggestions on where to buy these items...some you will need to get from the automotive paint store...other's, we will get the cheapest we can.

Harbor Freight...# 1,2,3
Paint supply store...#4, 5, 6, 7..#7 at the paint store because you don't want crap thinner that can contaminate your gun and ruin future paint jobs
Body Shop...#8...see if you can purchase 6 spray out cards, they get them free from the paint supplier so don't pay to much.
Home Depot or anywhere else...#9, 10

# 11, a gallon mixing can...get it from the paint store...they have lids and if your going to paint the hood, you will need a bit more than a pint, get 3/4 of a quart of base coat, reduced will give you a 1 1/2 quarts.

You mentioned that the hood was gray...dark gray or light gray?

Correct, the hood would be sanded in with 600 wet...but let me know first what shade of gray it is before you sand it.

Ray
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