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Old 10-06-2008, 08:00 PM
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Flexible LS engine

Hi
I have a two part Question, I am mocking up an engine install on a 1936 ford truck seen in the upper left photo on this post.
What I have now is a mock up 350 engine, Headers and Trans that I had but was thinking of using a LS12 engines.
Question: The 350 fits with room to spare inside the frame but would an LS? I will probably sell the 350 setup and get a LS if I decide to go that way.
Question: This truck is not exactly a Hot Rod so horse Power is not as important as cool looking. So what year or model of the LS engines would give me around 300 ++ HP but be flexible using aftermarket computer programming systems?

Iceman

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Old 10-06-2008, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iceman36
Hi
I have a two part Question, I am mocking up an engine install on a 1936 ford truck.
What I have now is a mock up 350 engine, Headers and Trans that I had but was thinking of using a LS12 engines.
Question: The 350 fits with room to spare inside the frame but would an LS? I will probably sell the 350 setup and get a LS if I decide to go that way.
Question: This truck is not exactly a Hot Rod so horse Power is not as important as cool looking. So what year or model of the LS engines would give me around 300 ++ HP but be flexible using aftermarket computer programming systems?

Iceman
Iceman,

I can give you some help. I dont know how much frame width you have inside the frame rails, but I bet my 36 Chevy is real similar. I believe the 350 small block will be shorter. I believe you'll want the 98-02 F-body LS unless your lucky enough to find a Vette LS for the same price. The reason....the way the assesories mount. I've got just enough room to clear the A/C pump (but am still going to relieve that area of the frame with a concave dip). Then I ran into trouble with the length of the LS. I believe it is longer. I had to recess mine 3" into the firewall to give clearance for a Mark IV electric fan. Everything fits.....just fits. Another thought....if going with factory style mounts...you might opt for the Corvette aluminum mounts with liquid filled donuts (if you buy an F-body LS). They look real nice. There a link to my build next to my Login.

Dave G
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Old 10-06-2008, 08:14 PM
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Something more that I didnt answer. You might take a looksie at LS1 forum. They'll have lots of information reguarding HP levels. My LS came out of a 01 WS6 TransAm and was suppose to put out (I believe) 345 HP to the wheels. If you dont want to spend the money on the aftermarket software there is a gazillion people out there that do it as a hobby. Just find someone that has had good comments made about them and go for it.

Dave G
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:12 PM
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Flexible LS engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stovebolter
Something more that I didnt answer. You might take a looksie at LS1 forum. They'll have lots of information reguarding HP levels. My LS came out of a 01 WS6 TransAm and was suppose to put out (I believe) 345 HP to the wheels. If you dont want to spend the money on the aftermarket software there is a gazillion people out there that do it as a hobby. Just find someone that has had good comments made about them and go for it.

Dave G
Nice truck Stovebolter wish I was that far along.

Doing a little looking around the stock LS1 LS6 is around 28.75 water pump to flywheel and 24.75 wide, does that sound correct?
Im trying to budget for the March Performance LS1 Narrow serpentine Kit which will give me about 23.5 width up front.
My frame inside is about 23 to 28 at Firewall and from radiator to Firewall about 30 does that sound like I have more or less room than you?
What kind of distance are you allowing from engine to radiator?
Thanks for your time
Iceman
(http://www.icemanproject.com )
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:40 PM
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Sorry I can't help with any dimensions.

I just have to say, I don't recall ever seeing such a cool looking panel truck.

No pun intended, iceman36

If you don't mind me asking, where did you find it?

I, like you, would not 'hotrod' it, it's so cool looking, it doesn't need it.
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iceman36
Nice truck Stovebolter wish I was that far along.

Doing a little looking around the stock LS1 LS6 is around 28.75 water pump to flywheel and 24.75 wide, does that sound correct?
Im trying to budget for the March Performance LS1 Narrow serpentine Kit which will give me about 23.5 width up front.
My frame inside is about 23 to 28 at Firewall and from radiator to Firewall about 30 does that sound like I have more or less room than you?
What kind of distance are you allowing from engine to radiator?
Thanks for your time
Iceman
(http://www.icemanproject.com )
I'm at work right now...but I'll take some measurement for ya when I get home. It does sound very similar but I'll get some set measurements. Again, there are a few years of F-bodies that have the narrower span for assessories. Also believe that the Vettes are a little shorter because of a shorter water pump but you'll have to do some digging for that information. I just cant remember the specifics. StuCool on here might be able to help in that department. If your using a SPAL style fan instead of a factory style shroud/fan assmebly you wont need as much space in front of the motor for clearance. But....I wanted the Mark VIII style fan because of the extra CFM it pulls for cooling. I didnt want any problems in the 'overheating' department. I'll get those measurements for ya.

Dave G
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Old 10-07-2008, 04:44 PM
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You have pretty close to what I did with my 1935 Ford Tudor. The LS1 is the way to go, over 20 mpg and enough power to blow the doors off most "street rods".

I used a Direct Sheet Metal replacement firewall......the "big block" design that is recessed 5"....and it needs every bit of it. The Corvette LS2 water pump gives you additional room at the front and except for having to move the pulley forward 3/8" for belt alignment....it's a bolt-on.

I used the Corvette aluminum mount brackets and oil-filled mounts, they are excellent. I also used the 1997 Corvette "sheet metal" exhaust manifolds.

I'd me happy to answer any questions you may have as I have just over 16,000 miles on this beast and I haven't had to touch it since the day I finished it.
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Old 10-07-2008, 07:41 PM
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Iceman,

I had a school function to attend with my son. I just got those measurements....but even better yet is what Retrowill provided.

My rough measurements (should be real close):

27.5" from nipple on water pump to bell housing
23.5" from outside of A/C pump to outside of alternator
27.5" from inside to inside frame rail right at the firewall
23.5" from inside to inside frame rail at front of motor (hence the close
clearance of frame to A/C pump....but my motor is set real low in the
frame)
31" from face of firewall to face of radiator (excluding fan/shroud)

Recessed firewall 3.5" to give plenty of clearance.

I'm with Retrowill.....allow plenty of room. You guys are luck in that there are lots of stuff available for your projects.

By the way....that will make a real nice rod! I still have a 36 Ford P/U (without bed....was used to power a saw mill back in the day), a 36 Panel without the front clip (School bus), and found what I think is a 36 bed. Just have to get them. I'll probably stay with the flat head thats in the truck. I decided on the Chevrolet at the time because I wanted to build the Ford for my father...or my son. Truth is....I may want a break for a while. LOL's. My son doesnt know about the Ford. My plan is....if he gets into/and does well in college....I'll build it as a surprise gift. Let me know if I can help more. I wish you the best in your build.

Dave G
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Old 10-17-2008, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetroWill
You have pretty close to what I did with my 1935 Ford Tudor. The LS1 is the way to go, over 20 mpg and enough power to blow the doors off most "street rods".

I used a Direct Sheet Metal replacement firewall......the "big block" design that is recessed 5"....and it needs every bit of it. The Corvette LS2 water pump gives you additional room at the front and except for having to move the pulley forward 3/8" for belt alignment....it's a bolt-on.

I used the Corvette aluminum mount brackets and oil-filled mounts, they are excellent. I also used the 1997 Corvette "sheet metal" exhaust manifolds.

I'd me happy to answer any questions you may have as I have just over 16,000 miles on this beast and I haven't had to touch it since the day I finished it.
Thanks for posting your pics. My plans have changed for the powerplant in my '36 Chevy 2dr sedan. I was given a pair of LSx motors (a 5.3 iron block truck motor and a 5.7 aluminum block Camaro motor) so the Turbo Buick was sold (for now anyway ).

My question is this...did you use stock GM accessories and mounts in your '35? If so, what car did they come from?

Great looking car, btw!
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Old 10-17-2008, 11:57 AM
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Everything on my LS engine is from a 1998 F-body (Camaro/Firebird). The intake is the Z06 part (externally the same as a stock Camaro), I used the 1997 Corvette "sheet metal" exhaust manifolds and the motor mount assemblies are also Corvette. The oil pan is also a stock 1998 Camaro part.I tried to use as many "off the shelf" parts as possible, it's easier to fix and maintain that way.

Thanks!! Glad you like the old beast.....it's a real kick-in-the-pants to drive.

Oscar (RetroWill)
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Old 10-17-2008, 12:03 PM
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Thanks for the info, Oscar. After I posted, I went over to Street and Performance's website ( www.hotrodlane.cc ) and found this link for LS1/4L60e measurements

http://www.hotrodlane.cc/PDFFILES/ls...mentIndex.html

That got me close enough to go out and measure my chassis and it looks like I'll need about 5" of firewall recess as well. Even with that, it's tight with about 3/4" of clearance on both sides at the front of the motor. Looks like I've got some sheetmetal surgery to do!

Do you have any pictures of the firewall either with or without the motor in? did the recessed firewall have much impact on interior room?
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Old 10-17-2008, 12:08 PM
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If possible, use a modified LS2 water pump, the pulley will need to be moved slightly but it allows an additional 1.5" or so more room than an F-body or truck pump.
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Old 10-18-2008, 07:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetroWill
If possible, use a modified LS2 water pump, the pulley will need to be moved slightly but it allows an additional 1.5" or so more room than an F-body or truck pump.
You've got my attention now. Here's some help to get you started. GM part number 89017457. Looks to be 05-06 Corvette....cant remember year but also SSR. It took me a while to find but found the real number at LS1tech. Direct from GM at this time 10/18 the price is $263.

Got a question. What do you mean Retrowill by slightly modified water pump? Are you talking about simply changing the position of the pulley? I'd really like to have that additional 1 1/2" to tilt my radiator shell back for a raked look.

Dave G
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Old 10-18-2008, 07:50 AM
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Straight water outlet

This might help some of you guys too. You can cut the outlet off, turn it, tig weld and fill....but in my case I know I'm most likely going to make a mess out of it. Street and Performance has a straight water/thermostat outlet availble. I cant post a copy of the link itself because it internal to thier server but here's the link to thier site. http://www.hotrodlane.cc/ The water necks are on the left side about half way down.
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stovebolter
You've got my attention now. Here's some help to get you started. GM part number 89017457. Looks to be 05-06 Corvette....cant remember year but also SSR. It took me a while to find but found the real number at LS1tech. Direct from GM at this time 10/18 the price is $263.

Got a question. What do you mean Retrowill by slightly modified water pump? Are you talking about simply changing the position of the pulley? I'd really like to have that additional 1 1/2" to tilt my radiator shell back for a raked look.

Dave G
In order to use the LS2 water pump with the F-body accessories the LS2 pulley will need to be moved forward about 3/8" to keep belt alignment correct. The LS2 engine accessories and pump are REALLY close to the front of the engine. Even by moving the pulley you will gain considerable room. If you look closely at my earlier post you can see how it all fits. After moving the pulley I tacked it to the shaft with a small weld with my MIG.....just to be safe. I have over 16,000 miles on this combination now and it has worked perfectly.

Interior room was not really compromised by the 5" recessed firewall, it was just a little harder to install the A/C, that's all. I'll look through my pictures, I have some from the interior view.
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