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Old 12-02-2008, 09:08 PM
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Ford 9 Inch - Pinion Yoke Swap

Did a search and couldn't find an exact answer...

It's time to buy a drive shaft and I want to upgrade my 9 inch's pinion yoke to 1350 u-joints. I not too long ago had new gears set up with a solid spacer instead of a crush sleeve, and I've fully broken in the new gears and the rear end sits without any oil in it.

Question is: Can I just remove the old pinion yoke, install the new one, torque to spec and call it good? Do I have to worry about messing up preload on anything?

Thanks!
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Old 12-02-2008, 09:53 PM
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Why not just change the u'joint, instead of the pinion yoke?

There are u'joints available, to adapt almost any drive-shaft flange, to a 9" rear yoke. All you have to do, is measure the cup sizes, and overall trunnion lengths, and look in a catalog, or buyers guide for the correct sizes.

You also need to determine if you need inside, or outside clips in the drive-shaft.

This would eliminate any question of pinion load, or the need for shims.
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:20 PM
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With the spacer it's a remove and replace deal, there will be no difference in preload.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prostreet6t9
With the spacer it's a remove and replace deal, there will be no difference in preload.
This would depend on the length of the pinion yoke. If it is shorter, it will need to be shimmed back to the original depth, to achieve the proper pre-load.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
This would depend on the length of the pinion yoke. If it is shorter, it will need to be shimmed back to the original depth, to achieve the proper pre-load.
Wrong! Pinion preload is set BETWEEN the inner and outer pinion brgs only! And the pinion yoke obviously sets againt the outer pinion brg so the preload would not change.
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Old 12-02-2008, 11:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prostreet6t9
Wrong! Pinion preload is set BETWEEN the inner and outer pinion brgs only! And the pinion yoke obviously sets againt the outer pinion brg so the preload would not change.
Is it not the 'crush' of a sleeve, caused by tightening the pinion nut, that sets the preload? He has a solid sleeve, so if the pinion is shorter, it will not have the same torque pressure applied, as the differential was set up to have.

Am I wrong on this?

In this case .010 difference could cause failure.

Last edited by carsavvycook; 12-02-2008 at 11:48 PM. Reason: addition
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Old 12-03-2008, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
Is it not the 'crush' of a sleeve, caused by tightening the pinion nut, that sets the preload? He has a solid sleeve, so if the pinion is shorter, it will not have the same torque pressure applied, as the differential was set up to have.

Am I wrong on this?

In this case .010 difference could cause failure.
Yes you are wrong.think of it this way, You have 2 brg's with a solid spacer in between them, you can push all you want on the outside of the brg and it will not change anything between them if the preload was correct to begin with.

Once you have the pinion preload correctly set in the pinion support it will not change unless there is a brg Failure or the pinion nut comes loose. That is exactly why people want to use them.
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Old 12-03-2008, 01:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prostreet6t9
Yes you are wrong.think of it this way, You have 2 brg's with a solid spacer in between them, you can push all you want on the outside of the brg and it will not change anything between them if the preload was correct to begin with.

Once you have the pinion preload correctly set in the pinion support it will not change unless there is a brg Failure or the pinion nut comes loose. That is exactly why people want to use them.
Read my last post again. It does not refer to pre-load pressure, it refers to non adequate pre-load pressure.

I know where you are coming from, and agree to a point. I am a perfectionist, and do not take anything for granted. Sometimes people will dis-agree with me, but I do not live by "Murpheys Law". If there is a margin for error, I want no part of it.

Years ago I watched in vain, as a Rousch Racing rookie driver led 98 laps, of a 100 lap main event, and the rear end burnt up. The pinion seal was the fault, and the quick change rear end had a solid spacer.
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Old 12-03-2008, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carsavvycook
Read my last post again. It does not refer to pre-load pressure, it refers to non adequate pre-load pressure.

I know where you are coming from, and agree to a point. I am a perfectionist, and do not take anything for granted. Sometimes people will dis-agree with me, but I do not live by "Murpheys Law". If there is a margin for error, I want no part of it.

Years ago I watched in vain, as a Rousch Racing rookie driver led 98 laps, of a 100 lap main event, and the rear end burnt up. The pinion seal was the fault, and the quick change rear end had a solid spacer.
If the preload turned out to loose then the preload was not correct to begin with. All 9"yokes are 2.425 thru the hole with the exeption of the early yoke that went with the early Daytona pinion support, it is shorter thru the hole,{and those never came in 1350 series}BUT If someone tried to put one of those on,the pinion yoke would never preload because the pinion spline's will stick up to far thru the yoke,therefor the pinion nut will get tight but you will still be able to move the pinion yoke in and out.

This time of year is pretty busy for me for the 9" rear, I did 12 last month from mild to wild,and the pinion yoke's are swapped on a normal basis.
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Old 12-03-2008, 10:25 AM
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Prostreet is right. The sleeve spacer is between the bearings. Once the proper bearing preload is established for this set of bearing it will not change except for the normal wear in. With proper preload the bearings will exhibit less rotational torque with some miles on them but this is normal. There will still be a "0" clearance.

You can easily change the pinion without resetting the preload. Disassembly the rear end if you want, and it still will remain the same on reassembly.

There is no real trickery on rear ends. They are probably one of the better engineered items ever installed in the automotive business. For the number that are made there is very low failure rate. You can mess up the installation pretty bad and they still will function fine other than make a lot of noise.

Racing changes the picture and the capacity of the rear end or other items can be easily overloaded with subsequent failure.

Also if a pinion seal leaked the oil out and the rear end failed how can it be blamed on a bearing spacer??? Would a crush sleeve have saved the day??? don't think so.
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