[sbchevfreak]

Oh, they are all crap! It doesn't matter what badge they have, they are all sh1t. If you own a 2003-2007 ford superduty diesel, be prepared to look at: turbo, egr cooler, oil cooler, cylinder heads and gaskets, egr valve, FICM's, injectors, high pressure oil pumps, and various HP oil leaks internally. That is just the common issues on the 6.0L diesel. The 6.4 has a whole new set of f/ups. You have a taurus or taurus X? Look for ptu seals, PITA tune ups. AWD edge or fusions? Driveline vibrations right off the lot, driveshaft issues. GM is no better, and Chrysler has their own issues. Toyota has the aforementioned problems, and so do all the other manufacturers. You pick the manufacturer that has the colours you like the best. After that, they all have problems.

[doctorjohnny]

Let's just say that they are all "sh1t". What would be better, buying American of foreign?

AND, my wife owns an Edge with about 18k on it now bought new. Never seen the dealership since. AND believe it or not, I'm a GM kinda guy. I've got a 2002 Sierra with 110k miles and I've never even had to change the brakes. Just a battery and Maintenance. AND we (at least myself) are mainly speaking of cars. We all know the jam-up's with the Ford Diesel's. They are trying to fit the federal regulations on fuel economy. They're trying really hard to cram 10 lbs. of stuff in a 5 lb. bag. We all know that the Duramax isn't awesome either. The Cummins seems to be the great one, in my opinion, in the worst of the 3 truck lines.

With all in mind, American or foreign?

[T-bucket23]

Overall the Japanees cars are the highest quality, longest lasting cars made. You point out a hand full of specific examples of issues with Toyota's. The American have the same type issues but many more. The diference is the Japanese car companies in a lot of cases wlll extend the warrantee on a troublesome issue, the big three just pray you make it past the original warrantee period and then you are on your own. The garage I work at part time sees mostly 3 to 15 year old cars. You can not compare the issues between American and Japanese cars.
Until the Big 3 get their act together and actuall produce something the public wants to buy, they will continue to suffer.
Dont feel bad for the auto workers, they have been taking advantage of the system for way to long.
If their is a bail out one of the conditions should be to get rid of the UAW. 40 to 50 bucks an hour for unskilled labor, give me a break.

[BarryK]

Never mind=deleted

[xxllmm4]

The title should read... Ford dealer tries to save business by guilting the american people into buying GARBAGE.

Did they ever think to actually sell cars that people wanted? If my business fails in the end I have no one else to blame but myself. When the big 3 go out of business its everyone elses fault!

Jordon

[doctorjohnny]

TBUCKET, XXLLMM, WHERE ARE YOUR DETAILS? How do you expect me or anyone else to just believe this stuff without something to stand on? Sounds like passionate fans instead of objective judges of reason.

In that I case, I love all nfc teams and hate all afc teams no matter who they trade and how they play.

All I'm saying is that you should un-anchor your foreign beliefs and check out the latest facts a little.

As far as the UAW, I hear ya'! Wow, some of those guys are some of the most overpaid, undeserving scoundrels that the U.S. has ever seen. They aren't helping at all. They are really the guys sending the jobs overseas. Can you blame the automakers? The American worker should be as passionate as these forums no matter where he/she works.

[anthonyc1]

I want a new Challenger I wouldn't mind a new Mustang or Camaro either.
As far as a family type car I could be happy eith a Buick Lucerne or Caddy DTS or CTS hell any of the above mentioned (maybe not the Buick but its a nice car) would get me to buy before any thing the Japanese or Koreans produced ever as far as styling goes.

[redlightning]

This was either 2001 or 2002.I worked for a brief time at a ford dealership.It was small dealership,so they only got the one Harley Davidson edition truck.
A lady drove down from Nashville to pick it up(about 60-70 miles).She wanted her old trailer hitch and a few other accessories put on her new truck from her old one(another Harley truck,one year older).
When I got under her new Harley Davidson edition,the guys in shop ask me what I was laughing at............


What better represents the good ole USA than Ford and Harley Davidson..........well under the spring in yellow stencil is painted "MADE IN MEXICO".

[xxllmm4]

doctorjohnny If you want details just look at consumer reports for the last 10 Years. Look at American car resale values. Common scene says people don't want what their selling or they wouldn't be in this mess.

redlightning also hit the nail on the head, can you even call these companies American anymore?

I would love to buy an American car but I don't want to buy anything they sell. The last new car I bought was a 03 Subaru WRX, AWD 230HP wagon for 23,500 They didnt have anything to compete with it!

So I am supposed to buy a car that is 51% American from a giant corporation that extorts money out of hundreds of websites, businesses and fan clubs out of a scene of loyalty. All i'm saying is don't blame me. They did it to themselves.

Jordon

[bonuts]

[QUOTE]Did they ever think to actually sell cars that people wanted? If my business fails in the end I have no one else to blame but myself. When the big 3 go out of business its everyone elses fault!
QUOTE]

One problem with this statement xxllmm! How many people does "your" business employ? The issue isn't whose fault this is, it's how many people are going to be unemployed because of this. You think the economy is bad now, just wait until who knows how many people have no job, can't pay bills, etc.

Its one thing if the mom and pop operations closes doors and 10 people are out of work, it's a whole new ball game when 1-2-3 million people have no income.

So is it not better, (if its possible) for your government to try and help? I am no expert and this whole bail out may just prolong there demise but I really don't know.


As far as the new car thing goes, every manufacturer has put out there lemon, but from what I see the north american builders are definately improving and catching up with the reliability of the imports.

I don't like many of the new cars out there, they're all pretty ugly really. Minus of course the Camaro, Challenger, Mustang, Vette, and a few other sports cars.


bonuts

[xxllmm4]

bonuts, my comments are directed mostly to the original video posted.
"MY" business employs 2 people. But its the same principal, I believe in a Capitalist society in the truest seance.

I have very mixed feelings about the bail out plans. They give 700 billion with no strings attached for the housing market but cant fork over a lousy 15 billion for the auto makers? I really don't know if the government should loan them the money but at this point I don't think GM will be able to recoup any time soon. Not many people will be willing to buy a car from a manufacture they think is going out of business. If they do go out of business hopefully it will be an American buyer. I'm done posting on this


Jordon

[doctorjohnny]

I'm going to be a bit more clear with my point of view. Do you remember the older model Mercedes Benz's up until aroung 1990? They were and are indestructible. Now, do you remenber around the time that Mercedes was just getting in deep with Chrysler? The line up of M.B. started having problems they never had. They had a great thing going and then trended out of it. People didn't see it at first, but now, 10 yrs. later, everybody's got the picture.

Well not up until recently, Toyota had an all Japanese board of directors. Who do they have on the board now (and I think that he's head of the board)? AN AMERICAN!

I'm stating what I see, with factual evidence, as the latest trend. Now if everybody wants to say, "oh that can't be possible, there's no way", well yes way. They are trending backwards. That's a fact, like it or not.

And if you don't think that our economy sucks, you are a bit dillusional (did I spell that riht?).

So, with a bit of facts from a guy who does this every day, what will it be?

The only thing that should sway you now, is which company does more for our economy. The hardest part to figure out, with a bit of literal pun indended, is where do the damn hardest and most expensive parts come from for these cars.

And as far as the bailout (there are already a couple of blogs on that, by the way), I don't know if I agree with that either. I have my own personal feelings of disgust with all 3 big 3. I designed and patented a 4-stroke motor with no valve train, and did they think that this could help....take a shot at the answer. The only one that didn't completely blow me off, up until this point, is Ford. They said to come back after testing. But the close-mindedness up there in Detroit is outstanding (for lack of a better word).

[bates_k]

Originally Posted by T-bucket23

Overall the Japanees cars are the highest quality, longest lasting cars made.

Are they, really?? Find me a '75 Civic. Or any mid seventies Japanese import.
I used to own a '67 Datsun 1600. I sold it when the parts became too hard
to come by. Now I own a couple "captive imports". They're not Japanese,
they're '70s German and I can still buy parts for them at my FLAPS.

K

[Ausrodder]

We have Ford and GM (Holden) here as well as the Japanese and European cars.
All these cars are good to own under warranty (if you live near a dealer... can be 600 miles here in Oz.) BUT...... when they are out of warranty you DO NOT want a Japanese and especially European car. They WILL break you with repair costs for "normal" parts.
Manufacturers perhaps need to get back to less complicated, "less to go wrong" vehicles.
Just my 2 cents worth.

By the way... yes your economy is in the toilet but you are so damn big the whole worlds economy is now in the toilet also (including the centre of the universe...Australia... where OUR home loans are guaranteed by our banks and legislation!)

Still like older cars though lol
Cheers
Ausrodder

[SDLuck]

Ford has more than 50% of its parts made out of this country.Canada and Mexcio make most of Fords parts,bet G.M. is the same.