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Old 06-01-2013, 10:20 AM
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help with 455 engine timing

Hi my name is gtoken and I have a 69 gto judge with a 1973 455 engine in it. I am trying to figure out what is the best timing to set the initial at and the advance at 3,000 rpm to help the engine run cooler in car cruise type traffic. Car runs a perfect water temp of 180 to 190 degrees while traveling. when I set in traffic for about 15 to 20 minutes the coolant temp will go up to around 220 to 230 and I got to let it cool down. The engine has 10:1 compression and I am also trying to get way from running 6 gallons of racing fuel to a full tank of premium. Any help or ideals will be greatly appreciated.
P.S. I have a MSD billet distributor with no vacuum advance

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Old 06-01-2013, 01:10 PM
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I would try to help if you put your questions in the proper forum, but this is the introductory forum.

Bill

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Old 06-01-2013, 05:26 PM
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I bet you dont have a fan shroud on it...Either that or its a rad problem.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:41 PM
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Ken, It's like poncho said, if there is no shroud, get one. If you have a shroud, your radiator is probably mostly plugged. There is something you can check in the water pump to make it more efficiant, but that is not your problem. We'll tackle that later.

Bill
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Old 06-02-2013, 02:51 PM
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hello Bill

My car has a brand new four core HD Radiator and factory original fan shroud and I have tried several different Fan combinations to include an electric fan. I have been dealing with this problem ever since I installed the engine back in 1991. I use to drag race the car out at the track until a few years ago. When I had a 421 in the car out of a 1965 Bonneville. That engine could sit all day at idle and would not go past 160 degrees. This 455 is a total different story. I used to run the timing at 11 btdc and total 36 degrees. Now I started playing with the timing to see if it would help. the engine is bored 30 over but I wouldn't think that is to much of a bore from stock. I would love to see this car run at a cool temp when it sits in traffic like a car cruise. When I am moving the car will run at 180 degrees where it should. sorry for this long reply. gtoken PS if I am in the wrong area for posting my question how do I get to the right area this is all new to me thanks for your help
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Old 06-02-2013, 05:30 PM
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I'm just taking a guess, but if there is too much clearance between the plate and impeller of your water pump, at an idle it may not be moving enough coolant. Wallace Racing has a little about this: Water Pump Mods

Bill
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Old 06-03-2013, 02:57 PM
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gtoken

Hi Bill I appreciated the info about the water pump suggestion. Off and on that has been in the back of my mind; that something could be going on with the water pump impeller. I did put a brand new pump on the engine when I Rebuilt the engine and installed it. I will diffidently look at that when I get a chance. Do you know the proper clearance for the impeller to water pump plate. Thanks for your help gtoken P.S. I did look at the web sight that you posted and it has the info I need for the clearances
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Old 06-03-2013, 06:12 PM
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Also, I forgot to mention that a waterpump with cast impellars is preferred over one with the stamped impellars.
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Old 06-03-2013, 08:11 PM
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You didn't say what cam, etc. you're using, but increasing the initial timing sometimes helps. Be sure the total timing doesn't go too high if you add initial timing! Info on the GM HEI is here. I found the Pontiac 455 w/smog heads likes less than 36 degrees total, YMMV. Here is some info, including a link to see what's needed to set up the WP clearances. Don't forget the rubber grommets.

Also I've always found a thermostatically controlled fan clutch to work well. Be sure the fan fits the shroud correctly. Use a thermostat. More on all that can be found here.

It's unlikely, but be sure the crank pulley isn't smaller than stock and that the WP pulley isn't larger- either/both slows coolant flow.

Also, here's some links to Pontiac info and vendors.

Last edited by cobalt327; 06-03-2013 at 08:17 PM.
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Old 06-06-2013, 03:26 PM
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gtoken

I appreciate all the info and at least know I have a few good ideals to help me along. Not for sure how soon I can get started on it but as soon as I do I will keep you informed.
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Old 06-06-2013, 04:49 PM
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Heating while moving slow or setting is usually an airflow problem or a slow moving coolant. Not a radiator .
I have my 389 set at 14 degree BTDC as of now, and the mechanical pulls in 20 degrees at 3200 rpm.
Also myvacuum module is adjustable and I have the tension set light, it pulls 10 degrees at 10 inches of vacuum. Doing that made it seem like it cruised effortlessly and seemd to have helped with temp some.
I also put in a dual row summit aluminum radiator, that was also real good for dropping the coolant temp.I still run 205 on a hot day after a while of running and I have a few more tricks u p my sleeve.
I am going to dilute the coolant to a mix of 70-30 as it transfers heat better and I have a bottle of REDLINE water wetter I will be adding also.
That should keep me at 200 or a tad under (I hope) on hot days.
I also have the stock fan shroud and 18 inch 6 blade with thermostatic clutch.Big pulle on crank and smaller on W pump.
The all aluminum radiator made the most difference as far as I am concerned.
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