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-   -   HELP WITH B&M SHIFT KIT/TURBO 350 (http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/help-b-m-shift-kit-turbo-350-a-85019.html)

leejoy 03-22-2006 05:37 PM

HELP WITH B&M SHIFT KIT/TURBO 350
 
I will be installing (attempting to) a B&M shift improver kit to my Turbo 350 this weekend. I already have the kit and starting reading the instructions. It looks very doable but not a piece of cake. It can easily be screwed up if one is not careful, methodical, organized, and documented with sketches and photos. The trans is still in the car, (and will remain in the car) bolted to a chevy BB. It's a 72 Nova. Anyway, any advice for me before I have a go at it. this is my first one. here are a couple of questions that for sure I need to know:

1) do I have to use the recommended type F trans fluid when I am done?
2) If I have to drain all my existing Dexron II fluid, (to replace with type F)including the fluid in the converter, should I drill the converter and drain (please say no) or disconnect one of the trans cooling lines, start the car and pump it out. Will that work? or is there some other method to drain fluid in the converter, cooler and lines?
3) should I install a drain plug in the trans pan during the process for future trans fluid draining?
4) should I install a new filter (this is an old TH350 with 100,000 miles on it)
5) any tricks or pointers in removing and replacing the valve body, plates, manual valve, check valve balls, etc?
6) should I install a new adjustable vacuum modulator?
7) what else am I missing about this? is there anything else I should do while performing this upgrade?

M&M CUSTOM 03-22-2006 07:31 PM

1) They RECOMMEND it for a reason.
2) I would see if a transmission sho can do this for you, unless someone can help out better here.
3) If you don't particularly like spilling the fluid when draining the transmission it would be a good idea.
4) New filter at minimum, you might be better off going the route of rebuilding it and installing the shift kit upon reassembly.
5) I don't have anything to help you out here.
6) Yes
7) I can't help out any more than I have so far.

leejoy 03-22-2006 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M CUSTOM
1) They RECOMMEND it for a reason.
2) I would see if a transmission sho can do this for you, unless someone can help out better here.
3) If you don't particularly like spilling the fluid when draining the transmission it would be a good idea.
4) New filter at minimum, you might be better off going the route of rebuilding it and installing the shift kit upon reassembly.
5) I don't have anything to help you out here.
6) Yes
7) I can't help out any more than I have so far.

not what I wanted to hear, but I appreciate the honesty.

Twistedwrench 03-22-2006 08:44 PM

I have installed those kits when the transmission is still in the car. It can be done. You must have patience with the check balls. As far as the fluid. I have never completely gone with type F. I only add 4 quarts. The rest is dex. You can also use trick shift. Personally I have never noticed any difference between trick shift and using type f. I am sure there is a difference in the amount of friction material but I was never able to feel any shifting difference between the two. I have also installed the kits and used straight dex and never had any problems. I have run into one trans that gained no improvement after installing the kit. The kit worked and the plates did clamp faster but their wasn’t enough grab left on them to matter. This is how I would recommend doing yours. First drain and remove pan. If you can find an old garbage can lid and drills some holes in the center, these work very nice used as a Catch pan when placed on top of an oil drain pan. Let it drain overnight. This will insure that the transmission is cold. Using Vaseline to hold the check balls in place does not work unless the tran is completely cold. It will also allow it to drain more, so that you are not getting frustrated with fluid dripping on you. Once you have cracked all the body bolts. Just lower them enough to allow it to drain further. Oh yea, I also like to lay or line the catch pan with shop towels. I do this to make the ball and bolts easier to see and it insures that nothing drops through the drain holes. I do like to add an adjustable mod to fine tune but I have also done them without adding and they work fine. Drain plugs do make life a whole lot easier when having to go into the pan. I also use a lot of brake cleaner, especially after the valve body is down. I use it to clean everything and help slow down the dripping. I am sure someone will argue with my ways but I am just telling you how I do it and it has always worked well for me.
Troy

leejoy 03-23-2006 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twistedwrench
I have installed those kits when the transmission is still in the car. It can be done. You must have patience with the check balls. As far as the fluid. I have never completely gone with type F. I only add 4 quarts. The rest is dex. You can also use trick shift. Personally I have never noticed any difference between trick shift and using type f. I am sure there is a difference in the amount of friction material but I was never able to feel any shifting difference between the two. I have also installed the kits and used straight dex and never had any problems. I have run into one trans that gained no improvement after installing the kit. The kit worked and the plates did clamp faster but their wasnít enough grab left on them to matter. This is how I would recommend doing yours. First drain and remove pan. If you can find an old garbage can lid and drills some holes in the center, these work very nice used as a Catch pan when placed on top of an oil drain pan. Let it drain overnight. This will insure that the transmission is cold. Using Vaseline to hold the check balls in place does not work unless the tran is completely cold. It will also allow it to drain more, so that you are not getting frustrated with fluid dripping on you. Once you have cracked all the body bolts. Just lower them enough to allow it to drain further. Oh yea, I also like to lay or line the catch pan with shop towels. I do this to make the ball and bolts easier to see and it insures that nothing drops through the drain holes. I do like to add an adjustable mod to fine tune but I have also done them without adding and they work fine. Drain plugs do make life a whole lot easier when having to go into the pan. I also use a lot of brake cleaner, especially after the valve body is down. I use it to clean everything and help slow down the dripping. I am sure someone will argue with my ways but I am just telling you how I do it and it has always worked well for me.
Troy

dear twistedwrench

thanks for your help buddy.

Lee

86078 03-23-2006 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leejoy
dear twistedwrench

thanks for your help buddy.

Lee


Leejoy,
post up,let us know how it goes...i've been contemplating the same thing...thanks Kimo

Theresa Shank 03-23-2006 02:48 PM

LEEROY:

We put a B&M Shift Kit in a 350 TH. Getting check balls to go and stay where you want them is important. One of ours jumped over a channel and transmission didn't shift right, it would upshift as soon as you took off. Didn't find problem until we replaced with Transco Shift Kit. Transco is about $60.00 but a much better kit.... THERESA

Twistedwrench 03-23-2006 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theresa Shank
LEEROY:

We put a B&M Shift Kit in a 350 TH. Getting check balls to go and stay where you want them is important. One of ours jumped over a channel and transmission didn't shift right, it would upshift as soon as you took off. Didn't find problem until we replaced with Transco Shift Kit. Transco is about $60.00 but a much better kit.... THERESA



Hi Theresa,
I have installed Kits from a few different companies. I am always up for something better. I haven’t found much of a difference between kits. The plates seem to be plates and the gaskets are gaskets. The drill bit that some include is garbage but it does its intended purpose. (Of course me being cheep I have tried to reuse them for other things) I have noticed that the b&m kits have instructions that are hard to read because of poor printing quality. But if you have done a few they become know anyways. What is it that you have found Transco to be better? And is it (Transgo)? I did a search and can only find transgo. Curiosity has me here. Your impute would be appreciated and possibly lead me to be Transco/transgo customer. Is this the place? http://www.transgo.com/ Thank you …troy

sha_ba_do_bang 03-23-2006 06:22 PM

You might as well give it a try first and see if you can do it, and then if it doesn't work take it toa trans shop, i've done prolly 100 shift kits,so i'll give you some pointers,

1. You NEED a inch pound torque wrench, if you don't have one you WILL warp the valve body, also, torque the pan bolts to 100inch pounds and it WONT leak, i have rebuilt many many unites and never had them drip from the pan after i torque them

2. You have to be very very very clean and organized, every valve and check ball and little spring is important, brake cleaner will work fine to clean with.

3. I can't belive you asked that question about the filter, come on,replace the $20 filter, and put the drain plug in also

4. Go get some trans gel, its a sticky blue grease that holds in springs and valve and check balls and then melts down and doesn't effect the trans it all, it is very helpful in reassembly.

5. You dont have to get all the old trans fluid out, and you prolly couldn't if you wanted. You can use the old dex or type f, we put synthetic in everything so there you go.

Have fun and good luck, the most important thing is being clean and organized.

Brendan

Twistedwrench 03-23-2006 09:22 PM

words removed

leejoy 03-24-2006 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theresa Shank
LEEROY:

We put a B&M Shift Kit in a 350 TH. Getting check balls to go and stay where you want them is important. One of ours jumped over a channel and transmission didn't shift right, it would upshift as soon as you took off. Didn't find problem until we replaced with Transco Shift Kit. Transco is about $60.00 but a much better kit.... THERESA

well that sucks.....I already bought the B&M kit. what's better about the Transco kit?

leejoy 03-24-2006 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twistedwrench
WOW 19 years old and you have done prolly 100 shift kits. Thatís impressive! I guess I will know who to ask for tips when working on transmissions.

If you donít have an inch pound torque wrench you WILL warp the valve body. I am so glad that you came along with your 100-kit experience and straightened me out. I have been using a torque wrench that measures foot-pounds all these years

( I can't belive you asked that question about the filter, come on,replace the $20 filter)

I canít believe you would make a statement like that. It was a simple question! Not deserving some smart mouth punk kids response like yours.

dear twistedwrench.

no hurt feelings from the other guy about the trans filter remark. I was going to replace it anyway, I just wanted to hear what people say. those types of statements don't bother me. I agree with you though, 19 years and 100 transmissions. Hmmmmmmmmm.

leejoy 03-24-2006 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sha_ba_do_bang
You might as well give it a try first and see if you can do it, and then if it doesn't work take it toa trans shop, i've done prolly 100 shift kits,so i'll give you some pointers,

1. You NEED a inch pound torque wrench, if you don't have one you WILL warp the valve body, also, torque the pan bolts to 100inch pounds and it WONT leak, i have rebuilt many many unites and never had them drip from the pan after i torque them

2. You have to be very very very clean and organized, every valve and check ball and little spring is important, brake cleaner will work fine to clean with.

3. I can't belive you asked that question about the filter, come on,replace the $20 filter, and put the drain plug in also

4. Go get some trans gel, its a sticky blue grease that holds in springs and valve and check balls and then melts down and doesn't effect the trans it all, it is very helpful in reassembly.

5. You dont have to get all the old trans fluid out, and you prolly couldn't if you wanted. You can use the old dex or type f, we put synthetic in everything so there you go.

Have fun and good luck, the most important thing is being clean and organized.

Brendan

Brendan

ok so I will buy a inch/pound torque wrench. no big deal, but what do you mean "you will warp the valve body" I don't just take my 3/8" ratchet and torque down every bolt I've every touched to 80 foot/lbs like its a lug nut. I know when to use a gentle touch and am accurate when torqueing things down to the specified requirement. I'll read the instructions again tomorrow and see what the torque specs are for the valve body bolts. I will also search for that trans-gel stuff as you suggested.

Twistedwrench 03-24-2006 02:13 AM

Lol I know, I’m sure it didn’t bother you. I just like to point out to them that when they say things like that people will find it hard to believe anything that they say to be reputable.

I hope Theresa comes back and gives a little insight to those kits.

M&M CUSTOM 03-24-2006 07:23 AM

:rolleyes: I will keep an eye on him, I like that he has so much hands on experience.

I just wish some of these young mechanics coming out of our great education system can't remember how to spell "probably", I don't really care that it does take an entire TWO keystrokes less.

Heck, even spell check would help them if they actually cannot spell, but it seems to be acting up lately.


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