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Old 09-30-2008, 11:04 PM
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help deciding on SBC

i may be getting another monte carlo (trading my 94 gmc sierra for a 87 monte ss)

it currently has a 305 with a mild cam. thats no good its got to go!!

for a 3800 pound car (with driver) 350-400 HP should get me in the 12's (according to golan engines)

i have a 350 thats been sitting here for years so i have a block.

the hard part is i want a ton of low end torque to get this pig moving (automatically a stroker motor comes to mind) i dont want a 383 though honestly its over done i would like something a bit different. my father suggested a 400 stroker. i looked into it and it was big money.

im trying to do this for as cheap as possible (lets face it money is a priority and the more i keep out of the engine the more can go in my savings)

so just post whatever suggestions you have engine wise i would have loved to do a 327 but i cant find a block locally. also are there any factory 350 aluminum blocks would love to take advantage of that weight savings

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Old 10-01-2008, 12:06 AM
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If you are looking for torque, the 327 would be a bad choice. Why not pick up a small block 400. You can build a real torque monster.
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Old 10-01-2008, 12:21 AM
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If you're avoiding a 400 stroker because of money, then skip the aluminum block idea. You could build four 383s for the cost of a build using an aluminum block.

Go for cubes, stroker or not. They always win. 305s have tiny bores and limit breathing, and because 350s are nearly free these days there is no reason to cripple yourself with the smaller engines.

350 is great. A 400 is just a few pennies more. A 383 is just a few pennies more than that.

I'm currently building a 383. Sure, its common, but there's a reason for it... they're great and not very expensive.

Its funny, we're currently discussing the torque/stroke idea in another thread HERE The actual length of the stroke isn't as important as the cubes involved.
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Old 10-01-2008, 12:45 AM
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hmm i will look into the 400 sbc

motor will have efi and backed my a nice overdrive trans hoping to get 17mpg

my biggest issue at the moment is insurance i have hartford and the max they will give if something happened to the car is 2,000 nada value is 6k i would like to inure for 6k agreed value but not be limited on my driving. (i will be commuting with this car)
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Old 10-01-2008, 12:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F3RR3T
hmm i will look into the 400 sbc

motor will have efi and backed my a nice overdrive trans hoping to get 17mpg

my biggest issue at the moment is insurance i have hartford and the max they will give if something happened to the car is 2,000 nada value is 6k i would like to inure for 6k agreed value but not be limited on my driving. (i will be commuting with this car)
Check with AAA for a rate quote,on my '54 they based rates on my set value,not a book.Prices over the years have beat everyone,AARP is hooked up with Hartford and their quote for six months was almost $400 higher on our two cars plus I get another 10% discount for Homeowners.
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Old 10-01-2008, 01:33 AM
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I don't know what you consider "big money", but here is a 427/434 all forged kit from Speed-O-Motive for $1,695.....
http://www.speedomotive.com/ps-536-8...roker-kit.aspx
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Old 10-01-2008, 03:14 AM
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i dont have a 400 block though

i have a 350 block

i could do either of these and they should get me to my mark with a good head,cam combo

http://www.speedomotive.com/ps-515-8...roker-kit.aspx

http://www.speedomotive.com/ps-517-8...roker-kit.aspx

does it matter about not being forged? i wanted to do a small supercharger at a later date
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Old 10-01-2008, 03:16 AM
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im want to make ton of torque down low and through out the power band. and rather have my peak horsepower not at 5-6000 rpm
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Old 10-01-2008, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F3RR3T
i may be getting another monte carlo (trading my 94 gmc sierra for a 87 monte ss)

it currently has a 305 with a mild cam. thats no good its got to go!!

for a 3800 pound car (with driver) 350-400 HP should get me in the 12's (according to golan engines)

i have a 350 thats been sitting here for years so i have a block.

the hard part is i want a ton of low end torque to get this pig moving (automatically a stroker motor comes to mind) i dont want a 383 though honestly its over done i would like something a bit different. my father suggested a 400 stroker. i looked into it and it was big money.

im trying to do this for as cheap as possible (lets face it money is a priority and the more i keep out of the engine the more can go in my savings)

so just post whatever suggestions you have engine wise i would have loved to do a 327 but i cant find a block locally. also are there any factory 350 aluminum blocks would love to take advantage of that weight savings
In this car it'll take more than 400 horsepower to get into the 12s. On top of that, you'll have to go to a high stall converter, probably rebuild and beef up the automatic, pump up the rear axle ratio, go thru the suspension and chassis to get it to react adequately. Going fast is a lot more complicated than just upping engine power.

There's reason why 383s are so popular, everybody does it because it's the most cost effective route to more power. You can listen to your own drummer, nothing wrong with that, but that requires a lot of knowledge, ability, and money to be successfully different. Cheap and fast are diametrically opposed concepts. When I was a kid, well over a half century ago, the local speed shop had a sign behind the counter it read: "Speed Costs Money! How Fast Can You Afford to Go?" In that spirit, you need to look toward what everybody else is doing, not try to invent something new as it will be more expensive than you can imagine. Besides the hot rod engine, especially the hot rod Small Block Chevy, is a well traveled path, we know within pretty tight boundaries what works and what doesn't.

Aluminum blocks or heads for that matter are expensive to very expensive. Aluminum casing techniques are tricky resulting in about a 50 percent rejection rate. On top of having to pay for the foundry's scrap and rework, aluminum requires additional work compared to iron in that it must have hard seat inserts, press in valve stem guides, and hardened spring cups because aluminum isn't strong enough to resist these direct reaction operating forces. So between the foundry issues, the more expensive raw material, and the unique additional operations and parts the cost compared to cast iron is double or more, usually more. There are low cost Chinese aluminum parts, but the horror stories with leaking castings, miss-alignment of basic features, bad machining, and failed components are the stuff of legend.

Lastly is the driveline and chassis. You can't hang a young frisky engine on an old automatic and a worn out chassis and not expect problems. Typically the 100,000 mile TH350 gives up within the month. The old cooling system leaks. The suspension being overdriven at higher speeds can't resolve the loads, shocks, u-joints, springs and bushings give out if the car and driver survive the loss of control. So you end up having to go thru all these systems to keep from killing yourself. All this takes is money.

Bogie
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Old 10-01-2008, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldbogie
In this car it'll take more than 400 horsepower to get into the 12s. On top of that, you'll have to go to a high stall converter, probably rebuild and beef up the automatic, pump up the rear axle ratio, go thru the suspension and chassis to get it to react adequately. Going fast is a lot more complicated than just upping engine power.

There's reason why 383s are so popular, everybody does it because it's the most cost effective route to more power. You can listen to your own drummer, nothing wrong with that, but that requires a lot of knowledge, ability, and money to be successfully different. Cheap and fast are diametrically opposed concepts. When I was a kid, well over a half century ago, the local speed shop had a sign behind the counter it read: "Speed Costs Money! How Fast Can You Afford to Go?" In that spirit, you need to look toward what everybody else is doing, not try to invent something new as it will be more expensive than you can imagine. Besides the hot rod engine, especially the hot rod Small Block Chevy, is a well traveled path, we know within pretty tight boundaries what works and what doesn't.

Aluminum blocks or heads for that matter are expensive to very expensive. Aluminum casing techniques are tricky resulting in about a 50 percent rejection rate. On top of having to pay for the foundry's scrap and rework, aluminum requires additional work compared to iron in that it must have hard seat inserts, press in valve stem guides, and hardened spring cups because aluminum isn't strong enough to resist these direct reaction operating forces. So between the foundry issues, the more expensive raw material, and the unique additional operations and parts the cost compared to cast iron is double or more, usually more. There are low cost Chinese aluminum parts, but the horror stories with leaking castings, miss-alignment of basic features, bad machining, and failed components are the stuff of legend.

Lastly is the driveline and chassis. You can't hang a young frisky engine on an old automatic and a worn out chassis and not expect problems. Typically the 100,000 mile TH350 gives up within the month. The old cooling system leaks. The suspension being overdriven at higher speeds can't resolve the loads, shocks, u-joints, springs and bushings give out if the car and driver survive the loss of control. So you end up having to go thru all these systems to keep from killing yourself. All this takes is money.

Bogie
car is defiantly not getting a auto trans theres no way. have not decided on trans looking for a 6 speed

400 hp will run a 12.9 on stock suspension (montecarloss.com)

suspension in the rear will be adjustable upper and lower control arms (500.00) for everything up front will be tubular lower control arms and adjustable uppers (400.00)

on the aluminum block situation i was talking about factory blocks like how the new vets have them just didnt know what other motors had them. for the price itll cost me to build a 400 sbc (one that can stand up to a super charger later is going to be around 4500.

i can buy a new ls3 for 5500 so im thinking if i wait a few years if i still have the car that will be the route to go
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