Help me wire my POWER WINDOWS! - Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board
Hotrodders.com -- Hot Rod Forum



Register FAQ Search Today's Posts Unanswered Posts Auto Escrow Insurance Auto Loans
Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board > Tech Help> Electrical
User Name
Password
lost password?   |   register now

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2008, 10:19 PM
DarknessSpawned's Avatar
God Of Lightning
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Clear Water, FL
Posts: 97
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Help me wire my POWER WINDOWS!

In my 88 s10.

Okay Ive been cleaning up the wiring, and I'm re-doing the power windows. It didnt have power windows from factory so a I got some switches/wires out of an older caprice or something(a full size box body car).... Not sure exactly what it was now. I had them all ghetto wired up before now I'm doing it right and using a relay in there and running the switches to the console. But My uncle and I cannot figure out the wiring for the whole thing using a standard bosch style relay (Thought the relay would help with the straining windows, Also bought a new motor for the driver side door).. But if the relay isnt useable in this application Id still like to discover the best possible way to wire them using my unfinished diagram on down below.

The way it was before (functional):
RH side:
Pink was Positive power
Pink/Green & Pink/Purple together into negative.
Blue & Brown went to motor

LH side:
Pink was Positive power
Blue/whiteStripe & Tan together into negative
Blue & Brown went to motor


So that being said, Ive done a diagram, All colors and wires are EXACT[U].
Can somebody help me out with this we cant find a schematic
that clears it up or anything so Here is the base for it all..... Black octagons
are what the switches plug into, I did them just like if you were looking at them:



The first time we wired them up it was lots of trial and error, and burned wires, I want to avoid all that this time!! Thanks in advance

    Advertisement
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2008, 10:28 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 57
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
30 should be a main battery lead. 86 should be the switched power. Double check your wiring with this link.
http://www.6066gmcguy.org/BoschRelay.htm

Last edited by carsavvycook; 12-01-2008 at 11:51 PM. Reason: Wrong Link
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2008, 11:30 PM
powerrodsmike's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Make a fiberglass fan shroud
Last journal entry: Next.. ..Bagging the king B (barge)
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: gilroy, california
Age: 53
Posts: 4,108
Wiki Edits: 161

Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
You have the switch wiring right, the relay is not necessary, but if you want to wire it in, I'll add a little to what carsavvycook said. (check your link Stephen.. )

#30 is B+ from battery, preferably fused

#87 goes to your pink wires to power up your switches.

#86 is from any accessory terminal on your fuse panel
or ignition switch, hot in run or accessory position

#88 goes to ground

#87A not used, This is the normally closed side of the relay.

The relay might not help with dragging windows, wiring it direct to the battery is the only chance that it could. Use a minimum 12 g wire to go from the battery to the relay. Ground the windows as close to the battery as possible if you want to avoid voltage drops from crappy ground straps, etc.

Hope this helps,

Mikey
__________________
my signature lines...not really directed at anyone in particular..

BE different....ACT normal.

No one is completely useless..They can always be used as a bad example
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2008, 11:48 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 57
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerrodsmike
You have the switch wiring right, the relay is not necessary, but if you want to wire it in, I'll add a little to what carsavvycook said. (check your link Stephen.. )

#30 is B+ from battery, preferably fused

#87 goes to your pink wires to power up your switches.

#86 is from any accessory terminal on your fuse panel
or ignition switch, hot in run or accessory position

#88 goes to ground

#87A not used, This is the normally closed side of the relay.

The relay might not help with dragging windows, wiring it direct to the battery is the only chance that it could. Use a minimum 12 g wire to go from the battery to the relay. Ground the windows as close to the battery as possible if you want to avoid voltage drops from crappy ground straps, etc.

Hope this helps,

Mikey
I'll edit it. OK?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12-01-2008, 11:52 PM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 57
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
It's fixed Mike .................................................. .........................


It must have been this part of me
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Picture.jpg
Views:	57
Size:	35.9 KB
ID:	34597  

Last edited by carsavvycook; 12-02-2008 at 12:11 AM. Reason: addition
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2008, 12:58 AM
powerrodsmike's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Make a fiberglass fan shroud
Last journal entry: Next.. ..Bagging the king B (barge)
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: gilroy, california
Age: 53
Posts: 4,108
Wiki Edits: 161

Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
There ya are...drawn by my inner child with a filthy mouse for a crayon.



Later, mikey
Attached Images
File Type: png TCpowerWindowDiagram.png (32.4 KB, 563 views)
__________________
my signature lines...not really directed at anyone in particular..

BE different....ACT normal.

No one is completely useless..They can always be used as a bad example
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2008, 03:58 PM
DarknessSpawned's Avatar
God Of Lightning
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Clear Water, FL
Posts: 97
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerrodsmike
There ya are...drawn by my inner child with a filthy mouse for a crayon.



Later, mikey
Hey Mikey..... Its bootiful mang

Thank you so much!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I dont know why it was so confusing
to me but you cleared it up very nicely.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 03:37 AM
DarknessSpawned's Avatar
God Of Lightning
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Clear Water, FL
Posts: 97
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Little PROBLEM.......

Okay I wired it up like this basically........



Except I dont have a battery so to test the windows I hooked up a battery charger to the ground of the relay, and the switchs, then Hooked the positive clamp to the wire before the fuse as if it was the (+) battery terminal... And got no response.

The meter read 12 volts at the relay on prong #30 but was not going
through the relay to the windows, No other prong was reading anything.
So Then I just hooked the positive clamp of the charger to the positive window pink wires directly and bypassed the fuse/relay and the windows worked fine.

Could the fact I wired #86 to the hot terminal on the firewall instead
of the fuse panel? I liked it like that so I could roll them up or down
without turning the truck on, But like I said its not going through the relay and I tried2 different relays, Same thing...... Must be something with the wiring everything seems like it SHOULD work!!!!??

So Either I need to modify the wiring, or what changes do I need to make
to drop the relay and wire without it if we cant figure it out. Hoping its something simple.

Anybody have any ideas?
Oh and would old switch wires contribute to slower up/down time?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 05:50 AM
carsavvycook's Avatar
My 2 cents worth
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Lakeside, CA
Age: 57
Posts: 2,855
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Just using a battery charger is not a good test. A battery charger supplies voltage, and very little AMPs to the circuit you are trying to check. You will need to have a battery installed to supply the AMPs needed by the window motor.

You also need to have the body grounded to the frame, and the battery, for a accurate test.

It is a large amperage draw that blows fuses, or burns wires, not the voltage it's self.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 08:41 AM
OneMoreTime's Avatar
Hotrodders.com moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Health and safety in the shop or garage
Last journal entry: Yard Dog pic
Last photo:
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Washington State
Age: 70
Posts: 7,433
Wiki Edits: 3

Thanks: 60
Thanked 163 Times in 152 Posts
Saving this for posterity...i may need it someday..

Sam
__________________
I have tried most all of it and now do what is known to work..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 09:17 AM
powerrodsmike's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Make a fiberglass fan shroud
Last journal entry: Next.. ..Bagging the king B (barge)
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: gilroy, california
Age: 53
Posts: 4,108
Wiki Edits: 161

Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
The way you are using that relay, (all the time energized and the power circuit hot), makes it a totally unneccessary part..

If you wanted to use it as designed, the relay would be a remote switch to control the power (large load) to the window system with the ignition switch (lets a small load through ignition switch to control the larger load.).

But the way you have it wired, all it is is an overly complex connector. As I said before, having that power relay in the circuit won't make the windows work better at all.

If you really want to use it, try hooking post 80 to the common ground for the window control circuit...
You can use a battery charger to test the circuits, but the chargers output is not good for the window motors.


I use a charger and a battery to test those systems when I install them.

Later, mikey
__________________
my signature lines...not really directed at anyone in particular..

BE different....ACT normal.

No one is completely useless..They can always be used as a bad example
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 04:37 PM
DarknessSpawned's Avatar
God Of Lightning
 
Last photo:
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Clear Water, FL
Posts: 97
Wiki Edits: 0

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerrodsmike
The way you are using that relay, (all the time energized and the power circuit hot), makes it a totally unneccessary part..

If you wanted to use it as designed, the relay would be a remote switch to control the power (large load) to the window system with the ignition switch (lets a small load through ignition switch to control the larger load.).

But the way you have it wired, all it is is an overly complex connector. As I said before, having that power relay in the circuit won't make the windows work better at all.

If you really want to use it, try hooking post 80 to the common ground for the window control circuit...
You can use a battery charger to test the circuits, but the chargers output is not good for the window motors.


I use a charger and a battery to test those systems when I install them.

Later, mikey
So ground 80 where the switchess ground?
If so I did that and it didnt work. WE tried to make
sure all grounds were there to make it theoretically just like
being hooked to the battery... I wont be gettin a battery for another
couple of weeks at least. I mean the relay looks cool and is
mounted all nice and neat but it aint workin and I dont see why it wouldnt.

Maybe put the pink wires straight into the fused link, to the battery
and use the relay for something else perhaps? Just want the windows
to work properly and not worry about half a$$ing
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 04:56 PM
powerrodsmike's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Make a fiberglass fan shroud
Last journal entry: Next.. ..Bagging the king B (barge)
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: gilroy, california
Age: 53
Posts: 4,108
Wiki Edits: 161

Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Are you powering up terminal 86 as well? That is what powers up the relay coil to close the contacts at 30 and 87.
I noticed you did not say that you had your charger hooked to terminal 86, only that you had it hooked to the hot accessory terminal in the fusebox...but with no battery, that terminal is dead.

Ground your terminal 80 to the same ground as the switches.


That relay will fail sooner if it is left on all the time like you are wanting to do by hooking it to the always hot terminal in the fuse box. Not only that, but it will be a constant drain on your battery. IIRC those relays draw .2 amps, that's enough to drain a battery in a few weeks.

If it were me, I'd leave the relay out, and just hook to the battery if I wanted to operate the windows with the key off.

That relay is gaining you absolutely nothing, the way you are using it.


Later, mikey
__________________
my signature lines...not really directed at anyone in particular..

BE different....ACT normal.

No one is completely useless..They can always be used as a bad example

Last edited by powerrodsmike; 12-07-2008 at 05:16 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 05:15 PM
powerrodsmike's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Make a fiberglass fan shroud
Last journal entry: Next.. ..Bagging the king B (barge)
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: gilroy, california
Age: 53
Posts: 4,108
Wiki Edits: 161

Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
BTW, your relay's terminal numbers don't look like any of the relays I have.

check the pic..


You must have 12 volts going from 85 to 86 (your 80) in order to have current flow from 30 to 87.

86 gets grounded. (I'm not sure it matters if it is reversed, with 85 being ground and 86 getting bat+)

Later, mikey
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	relay pic.JPG
Views:	479
Size:	14.4 KB
ID:	34833  
__________________
my signature lines...not really directed at anyone in particular..

BE different....ACT normal.

No one is completely useless..They can always be used as a bad example
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 12-07-2008, 05:31 PM
powerrodsmike's Avatar
Hotrodders.com Moderator
 
Last wiki edit: Make a fiberglass fan shroud
Last journal entry: Next.. ..Bagging the king B (barge)
Last photo:
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: gilroy, california
Age: 53
Posts: 4,108
Wiki Edits: 161

Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Just checked one of the relays I have, it draws .17 amps and does not matter which way current flows through the coil.

Whne you energize 80 and 86 (or 85 86 on my relays), you should hear a click...that is when the contacts between 30 and 87 close.

80 and 86 are seperate circuits from 30, 87 and 87a, and need to be powered seperately.


Later, Mikey
__________________
my signature lines...not really directed at anyone in particular..

BE different....ACT normal.

No one is completely useless..They can always be used as a bad example
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

Recent Electrical posts with photos

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Hot Rod Forum : Hotrodders Bulletin Board forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (usually not your first and last name), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Turbo vs Supercharger - Write up!! FastChevyTruck Engine 107 02-16-2011 12:18 PM
Wacky Power Windows airman_turtle Electrical 12 08-16-2006 06:18 PM
Upgrade to power windows Moon Interior 4 06-09-2006 04:54 AM
power windows wrangler Electrical 7 03-02-2006 01:21 AM
1986 Cutlass wiring Q's again :( ChrisMiddleron Electrical 12 07-16-2005 04:22 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright Hotrodders.com 1999 - 2012. All Rights Reserved.